No Start - Case 580C Help Needed

[dwall2181]

Hello friends,

Can't get the Case 580C to start. New battery and starter. I hear one "click" when I turn the key over but the starter doesn't even attempt to fire. After the first time I try to turn the key over it won't click again until I disconnect and reconnect the battery. But at sometimes there's no click at all when I turn the key over. Is there a solenoid or switch somewhere that can stop power from flowing to the starter? How can I figure this out to get this beast started again? It runs fine once started but as soon as you cut it off you can't turn it over with the ignition.

There's a key and a push button start. The key used to work and I've never been able to get the push button to start it.

Welcome your thoughts on how to fix this.

Thank you in advance

 

[funwithfuel]

Start with battery connection and head towards the starter. Sounds like poor ground. Try looking in youtube "measuring voltage drop. That'll lead you right to where you want to be. Good luck.

 

[KisstDiagnostics]

What year is the 580 C?
Without taking anything apart you can test the voltage at the starter and on the starter solenoid to check key on power, if you have a voltage meter or power probe connected to the solenoid you can watch for drop out during cranking.
A lot of cases have a starter relay .
Is your dash powering up with key on?

 

[stinky64]

This is the 3rd time you've posted with this problem. Original setup pretty easy to diagnose, your start system has been modified, no easy answer. Probably time to get someone on sight who has a clue about elec. systems to look at your machine.

 

[Fasttrack]

Mine has a similar if intermittent problem. My key doesn't have a start position, just on / off. It must be in the on position and then I start it by pressing the horn button because the starter button failed and someone rewired the dash!

Anyway, when mine doesn't start from the button, I start it by shorting battery power to the solenoid with a screwdriver at the starter. Not a long term solution to anything, but that may help you troubleshoot. If it starts that way, the problem is not with the heavy lead to the starter motor or with the quality of the ground path between starter and battery (could still be a ground problem with the control circuitry).

The original starter circuit in the 580C is pretty simple. You have a key switch, starter button, and neutral switch (and circuit breaker). Current must pass from the battery through the circuit breaker, through the key switch, through the starter button, and through the neutral switch to energize the solenoid on the starter. When the solenoid is energized, it kicks the starter pinion out to engage the flywheel and closes the heavy contacts to energize the starter motor. If any of those switches is faulty or the circuit breaker is bad, then you won't be able to crank. Start poking with a multimeter to figure out where the problem is.

 

[Fasttrack]

I read your other thread here: https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/threads/case-580c-won’t-start-help.109025/

Start with the 40 amp circuit breaker located near the starter. My guess is that you are either inadvertently shorting something out (likely given the age - some rodent nibbled wires are touching or some whiskers of corrosion are shorting something to ground) or the breaker itself is flaky (also quite possible given it's age). Once the breaker trips, you have to go ignition off or battery disconnect for it to reset.

A high resistance (i.e. "bad") ground connection usually results in solenoid chatter / repeated clicking. The fact that you only get one click and then nothing until you disconnect the positive lead suggests the breaker it opening - either because something is drawing more than 40 amps or because the breaker is bad.

Try bypassing the breaker through a standard 40 amp automotive fuse. If it blows, then you know there is a short somewhere in the circuit. If it holds and everything starts, you have your answer and you can probably just leave the fuse in place of the breaker.

Something like this: https://www.grainger.com/product/2F...kIBPJiuu3xNIlH4aSMoaAiFvEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Or this: https://www.grainger.com/product/6C...mfRpk0Qb3IJyZDZO8xwaAolJEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

Would be appropriate.

 

[dwall2181]

Thank you guys! All very helpful info. The circuit breaker make a lot of sense because I cleaned up the ground. I’ll try the 40a circuit breaker and see what happens.

 

[dwall2181]

Just noticed that the green and yellow wire are on the same lug. Sharing a picture. Does this look like my issue?

 

[Fasttrack]

No, that's "correct", although not factory so hard to say where those wires actually go. There should be two wires on one of the studs and one of those two wires should go directly to the alternator, the other should go to a harness connector.

Do you have a multimeter? If not, you could try bypassing the circuit breaker by moving those two wires to the other stud (the one on the left). Make sure you clean all the contacts really well before connecting and be vigilant. Without a circuit breaker, if there is another component that has failed, it could draw a bunch of current and melt a wire or - worst case - start a fire!


That said, the two wires on the left hand side are suspicious. That should just be one wire but it could be that someone has moved the connection from the solenoid to the circuit breaker. Regardless, I'd check that those two wires going into single crimp terminal are "good"

 

[Tinkerer]

Do you have the service manual for your 580C ???

If the ignition switch has a start position and a push button for the starter you may need to hold the ignition switch on start and at the same time push the start button.
I have seen machines wired like that to deter an easy theft of it.