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Good old Iron versus new stuff

Discussion in 'Scrapers' started by squid_wood777, Aug 9, 2018.

  1. simonsrplant

    simonsrplant Senior Member

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    As a mechanic working on the equipment, In my opinion, the older stuff is tougher and on the whole, more reliable.
    Shiny paint and a fancy cab is nice but it doesn’t move dirt... it’s a shame that “image” counts for so much in some places. I sure prefer older iron.
     
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  2. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    western australia
    O
    Agree,who ever designed the cabs on the K model scraper for instance and im talking about the outside ,needs to be sent packing.It is the ugliest,wierdest looking thing and then theres the plastic look of the whole thing.Far too much electrics so that basically the operator just sits and steers the thing.Had a 37G just shut itself down on a haulroad that had 8 37s going fullnoise on and had to stop the job while the poor fitters tried to find out why.In the end about an hour later after the laptop said nothing was wrong they found a dodgy censor for something that was they think through vibration the culprit.As far as ive found out through operating both the old and newer gear,the newer gear is absolute garbage, rough as guts because they bounce around too much and mung the haulroads up real quick.The inside of the cab is wasted because you cant enjoy the comforts because of the bouncing all over the place.The best scraper ive been on for power,smoothness and reliability is a 57E and i know a G isnt even close,might be smicker inside the cab and thats it.The 57K is going to be even more out there the way Cat are going now days.The operators have to put up with this crap all day and then theres the poor old fitters etc who have to work on them.Cat just seem to be interested in making machines look flash and be overloaded with technology that if you can operate the old way you dont need most of whats there.Seems theyve lost the old values that Cat had of you were getting the best there is.
     
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  3. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    Early adopters 637Ks
    637Ks.jpg 637K.jpg 637K_3.jpg 637K_1.jpg
    Crack problem on R.E. Monks 637Ks
     
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  4. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    Occupation:
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    western australia
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  5. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    Ops, my &^* 637Gs and 637K sorry, trying to eat and post at the same time.
    Monks 637 with cracking rear axle housing 'heads up' posted in Independent Mechanic Group.
    637K-627Ks share the same Cab and maybe 657K will also, we'll see next year. Same cab, same simulator for training the 'new' generation of computer geek-ie basement dwellers; no strength to operate manual control levers:rolleyes:
    Aussie 637Ks

    Ezyquip Au / http://ezyquip.com.au/Careers.aspx
    Pu$$y boys, razed by feminist mommies, 'the machines ride so rough', we're in those cabs ALL DAY...Safety bars, safety bars, safety bars...next up from CAT, pink finished interiors.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2018
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  6. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    western australia
    Ha ha well said mate,no strength in arms only enough to operate keyboards on laptops etc and maybe get the scraper door open and it will probably be light enough with all the plastic in it.Dont worry about the pink interiors,by the looks of the K cab and other things Cats designers are looking like they may be trying to take the hard tough look of earthmoving gear away and probably will start offering a new colour every year because yellow has become so drab and boring and is not the in colour anymore.I cant believe they have used plastic on the scrapers.Alright in the cab but mudguards and fueltanks and by the looks of the K the front of the machine.
    Only time will tell i suppose.
     
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  7. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    squid,
    Old Iron for U
    Shortage of large scrapers in S.Cal; 2 Coburn 651Bs with bail hooks. D9L with worn ripper shank pockets. T-shirt operators:cool:
     
  8. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    western australia
    Thanks for that Stan.Ive been on 631s and all between up to 657Es im on a 39D at the moment and i know ive done well but really wish there had been alot more 660s and 666s in Australia.From what ive read Thiess contractors bought 6 660s in for coal mines in Queensland back in the late 70s and some bloke bought a couple of them and their still going but other than that we missed out big time.Havent heard of any Euclid or international or any other 6 wheelers over here so you blokes are very lucky.At least i can still watch Socal earthmovers.
     
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  9. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    Occupation:
    Plant Operator
    Location:
    western australia
  10. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    western australia
    Here,s some big buggies that just about all would not have seen before.Piacentini,s believe if Cat havent made it well they,ll make it themselves.These two big paddlers were made to shift mineral sands here in West Oz.The first is what they called a Wabcat.A 57B front with a large Wabco backend minus the motor.They have big 6cyl cummins motors and the truth is they have some still working with over 70,000hrs on them.The man standing along side this one is the man who started it all back in the late 40,s Albert Piacentini,who sadly passed on a few years ago.The other creation is a 651 with the own made elevator in it.They have about 4 of these ive been told.They are the masters of everything scrapers over here and still have a huge fleet of big buggies .
     
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  11. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    squid,
    Go check those 653 Wabcats out and make a movie.

    Cummins K19 600Hp w/Jake Brake was installed in one S. Cal 666 tractor. Brain Yeager has a 630 2-axle converted to pull a taper powered with a K19 @ 500Hp; Cummins made the flywheel adapter gear (standard part number) to mate up to Cat's 9 speed torque converter transmission. K19 morphed into QSK19 Tier3 final is being installed in 140Ton Aussie Road-Trains @ 750Hp.
    I am a K-series fan boy https://www.cummins.com/engines/qsk19-tier-3

    Thanks for posting the photos, very unique self loading scrapers.
     
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  12. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Stan,glad you like them.
    Apparently Piacentini,s used to put cummins motors with allison transmissions (i,m sure thats the tranny i was told)in all their 57B,s and they had alot of them in fact i seen a ad for 14 of them that were being sold a few years ago and they were listed with the cummins motors.Obvisously they are,nt big fans of at least that particular cat v8.Ive always been a cummins fan myself,always thought they had alot more grunt than cat motors.I drove a Euclid dumper for awhile many years ago and that had a V12 cummins in it.We were in very steep country and all the other dumpers would down in first gear going up hill loaded,the 2 euc,s could pass them,most times in 2nd or 3rd.
     
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  13. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    squid,
    I 99.9% sure they didn't use Allison trans in the 57Bs; Cat's 8 speed is not a problem child and the Cat pump drive-to-engine bellhousing is easy to adapt different brands of engines... D346 V8 60deg does not like overreving; causes crankshafts to crack or break and valves to hit the pistons. The guys in this area refer to D346s as 'hand grenade engines', but we've made lots of money rebuilding.

    Enjoy your day / cheers
     
  14. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    Roger that Stan,thought i heard somewhere thats what Piacentini,s done.We just got one that they brought out of retirement from the graveyard.Running short on 33s so they picked the best looking old ones that had been down the back and completly stripped them to chassis and started again.Done a bloody great job on the first one anyway its like a new one would be.(just about).One thing about this company they know about scrapers and an intereresting thing i was told also is they were asked a few years ago to come over to the states and show the contractor the best way to mine mineral sands with scrapers and also how to set up a dozer push.For many years over here thats all Piacentini,s done was mineral sands.Since the man who started it all,Albert is sadly no longer with us,the last ten years or so his son Colin and his two sons have doubled their work including hard rock opencut mining and civil jobs like building mine haulroads and dams etc.They have over 800 people working for them now and are getting more and more work,this is why there,s a shortage of 33,s.It is a true story that they have 11 39,s one,s been wrecked for some reason but the other 10 are goin flat out,we have 2 on our job.They also like to put double augers in 657E,s for moving sand.Will post some more photo,s when i can.
     
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  15. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    squid,
    There was lot mineral sands mined in this area. Owens-Illinois in Corona for 40yrs, two uncles worked there, one spent his entire working career @ that plant as assistant superintendent. Owens leased from Pete Wiesel, Wiesel mined with blasting and 'steam shovel', labors with pick-shovel and Cat RD6; also invented magnetic separator (I think). Later mining was with D9G and Cat90 pull scraper and 633C running two shifts per day. Interstate 15 cut off the rear of the pit, so operations were stopped. Pete Jr's kids sold the property for Industrial-Housing development. Abandoned plant was our almost free source for material, all machinery, bagging, hoppers, dyers etc and water for 25yrs. Owens material was a waste product used to prevent shrinkage while firing clay sewer pipe, bricks and roof tiles. Ditto 3M's waste from down the canyon; paid to haul off and resale for very fine base material.

    McKnight experimented with Euclid-Terex augers scrapers for years. S.Cal former website had a bunch of photos. Unfortunately Kenny didn't archive the thousands of posts and information. Dave Peed offer to pay for Ken's videos, so Ken's freebies morphed and he hooked up with Awesome Earthmovers. Peed hired Ken for operations manager.

    Little scraper action. Indy trying to set a record for blowing up engines and transmission on the down ramp. Ramp was over 2Km so engine overspeeds was wiping out engines and trans; per memory 32 engines and 26-ish trans in the 1st 3 weeks. 3408-3412s break easier versus C18-C15 combo repowered. Most of Indy's 57Es brought on-site had been sitting for 4-5yrs due to the 08 recession. You can see 'can down dragging' to slow speed in the mid section of the video. Typical work all night, 'hey can work today, you can sleep when die'...
     
  16. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    Seen this one Stan,its awesome for two reasons,the whole haul route and the ammount of gear they munged up.
     
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  17. squid_wood777

    squid_wood777 Well-Known Member

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    You got the whole clip Stan?That one only shows a minute or so of a few buggies going up.Ive been trying to get the helmet cam one where he takes off from the parkup and goes all the way up and then their coming down in top gear dragging their bowls all the way.At the start you can see a heap of 31s parked up and the bloke with the helmet cam explains how they started with 31s but because of the long steep climb it was taking them around an hour to do a load.I think it,s the same one where they finish up useing diggers and seml,s with bellydumpers to finish it coz it,s cheaper.I messaged Kenny ages ago to see if he still had the clip but got no answer.I had a look on Socal site but its not there.It,s a shame coz thats one of the best clip,s you will ever see.
     
  18. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    dirtmanjones68
    //www.youtube.com/channel/UC2nqkX9R1roQL49ocH_PUtQ All links, add https in front of //www...

    Yep, Wood Bros used 31s for 5 days and on Friday, 'a big decision has to be made'. The decision was renting 57s.
    Excavator Show, Trucks

    Mass X, typical WB; 9R out of service with HEUI pump issue. Dozer sits for 2 weeks and then they haul the machine back to their shop.
    Hauler Coaster / Road Truck Drive


    The job was not finished with Truck and Bottom Dumps. One of the drivers got stuck and miss communication; grader operator pushed his rig over him. County stopped the truck usage. So WB used their 31Ds to finish that phase of the job and won another phase using the 31Ds. Sukut underbid the next phase by 50% under the engineer's estimate and is still on-site currently.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  19. StanRUS

    StanRUS Senior Member

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    Good Oil Iron versus New Stuff and Iron versus Mexico
     
  20. mowingman

    mowingman Senior Member

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    Wow, how many safety violations can we count in this video?