Friction Crane Operation-Tips and Tricks?

[Operator4100]

your outriggers are controlled by switches, electric over hydraulic, remember that, like TUGGER said, sounds like your outriggers are dead heading on those circuits, those machines had quick disconnects on them to remove the outriggers if needed, so check all connections, if there is a loose connection you will have to relieve the pressure before you can get them reconnected properly... your boom down problem, with the lever push in forward that brake should wiggle a little when hitting it with a hammer, the bottom of the brake can touch or rub a little that's the way it works... yep you probably got rust and crap on the hoist drums, lock the hoist breaks drums should not turn then and spray them out good with break cleaner while the draworks are turning.. By the way I've gotten a little close to ya, on a job in Lake Charles La. now, maybe sometime I can come out and help ya with the ole girl, when you get these bugs worked out you'll have a sweet little crane, keep in touch, Dwight

 

[alskdjfhg]

your outriggers are controlled by switches, electric over hydraulic, remember that, like TUGGER said, sounds like your outriggers are dead heading on those circuits, those machines had quick disconnects on them to remove the outriggers if needed, so check all connections, if there is a loose connection you will have to relieve the pressure before you can get them reconnected properly... your boom down problem, with the lever push in forward that brake should wiggle a little when hitting it with a hammer, the bottom of the brake can touch or rub a little that's the way it works... yep you probably got rust and crap on the hoist drums, lock the hoist breaks drums should not turn then and spray them out good with break cleaner while the draworks are turning.. By the way I've gotten a little close to ya, on a job in Lake Charles La. now, maybe sometime I can come out and help ya with the ole girl, when you get these bugs worked out you'll have a sweet little crane, keep in touch, Dwight

Thanks, I'll take a closer look at the outriggers next time I'm at the machine.

What you said about the boom hoist is exactly what I did. With the lever forward the bottom part of the brake opens, but the top stays in sold contact with the drum. Hit the band with a hammer with the lever forward and got no motion.

Dad used to work off shore for a while, fly out to the rigs from all sorts of places in southern LA. Lake Charles is a bit of a hike, he had truck trouble one time just east of Lake Charles, had to drive over with a rented truck and trailer to haul back the dead pick-up.

 

[Operator4100]

your outriggers are controlled by switches, electric over hydraulic, remember that, like TUGGER said, sounds like your outriggers are dead heading on those circuits, those machines had quick disconnects on them to remove the outriggers if needed, so check all connections, if there is a loose connection you will have to relieve the pressure before you can get them reconnected properly... your boom down problem, with the lever push in forward that brake should wiggle a little when hitting it with a hammer, the bottom of the brake can touch or rub a little that's the way it works... yep you probably got rust and crap on the hoist drums, lock the hoist breaks drums should not turn then and spray them out good with break cleaner while the draworks are turning.. By the way I've gotten a little close to ya, on a job in Lake Charles La. now, maybe sometime I can come out and help ya with the ole girl, when you get these bugs worked out you'll have a sweet little crane, keep in touch, Dwight

 

[Operator4100]

sorry, old age I guess!! after looking at the picture yes the bottom of the boom hoist brake will be loose when lever is in boom down, the top will be snug on the drum, if your boom dog is not engaging as TUGGER said it should boom down, but spray everything out good,,, DW

 

[alskdjfhg]

Got the boom tip, jib and a 20' section moved this week. Plan is to get the last 3 30' sections moved this week.

But more importantly, boom down works! Just needed some more weight. Hung the hook block on the tip of the base and that worked like a charm. She started to break free with use, I think it was just stiff from sitting.

Also the outriggers now all work. It looks like the PB Blaster I sprayed all over them were what was needed, one is still a bit stiff, but I think it'll get better.

Got the 20' boom section pined on today, with needing weight on the boom to lower, the lowest I could go was about 5' off the ground. Made mounting the boom 'fun', had to once again call on the old Hyster. It's a plain mast machine unfortunately, no fork positioner or side shifter. So got as close as I could driving up to the boom (about 6") then used a come-along to drag the 20' section to the boom tip and pinned it in place.

Now, stupid question time once again;

Next time I'm at the machine I'm going to try and get the tip and jib mounted and the hook blocks all reeved. Anyone got a picture or explanation about how the hook block is supposed to be secured. Revving it is pretty self explanatory, what I need to know is how (and where) the end of the cable is secured.

Also what's the deal with the extension cables for boom hoist. I understand that the bridle (think that's the right name) will need to be unpinned from where it's currently attached and then pinned to the long cables that are in turn attached to the tip of the boom. My question is, are there a specific cable I need to use to do this or just find one that's long enough? I've got two or more for about every boom section, will I have to join any together?

Stupid pictures aren't coming out in the right order, but you get the idea.

I also was doing some googling and found this; https://cranenetwork.com/details?id=170185&pn=cranes
Pretty interesting, kinda amazing they paid that much for my machine and then it somehow made it to Houston. I wish I had the bumper weight, wonder why it got separated from the machine, but that's not a big deal to make. But something is weird with the listing, they are either using pictures of my crane (identical to bend thing on the boom to rust steaks) to describe another machine or just have the info wrong, so can't be sure what's going on.

 

[Tugger]

Find the balance point on your tip with one sling if you can ,should be 3 0r 4 feet back from the tip,mark it with a paint stick for next time. raise your forks up 5 or 6 feet then hook to the sling at the balance point of the tip.manuver in close to the last section and hold it so you can hook the top pins up.lower the forks,if the tips on the ground boom up easy till things line up.we always grabbed our boom sections rigged in the centre to balance .usually rig up off the back end so you can back the truck up for line up.your boom hoist is hooked to the equalizer or (bike as we call it) its important to always leave it hooked up until all sections are pinned.be careful how much boom you lift with the bike hooked to the butt,nothing more tham 60 or 70 ft with that crane.run your main hoist line thru the the sheave that it lines up with on the tip ,left side for left drum,then thru the middle sheave on your block and back up to the the lug under the right side of the tip.there should be a beckett with the crane to hook your line up with.google Crosby terminator wedge socket for a description of how to put the beckett or wedge socket together.when you rig blocks you try and keep things symmetrical or balance the forces .last tip hook all your sections up with all 4 pins except the two bottom pins on the butt,when all are laying flat hook your pendants up to the bike,boom up a bit and pin the butt to the rest of the boom.then boom down until the boom hoist line is slack,pull some more slack and knock out the bike pins.watch the pendants don't fall off the boom on you and watch they are leading right when you boom up.I think ive got all the steps sometimes instinct is hard to put in writing.

 

[old-iron-habit]

Got the boom tip, jib and a 20' section moved this week. Plan is to get the last 3 30' sections moved this week.

But more importantly, boom down works! Just needed some more weight. Hung the hook block on the tip of the base and that worked like a charm. She started to break free with use, I think it was just stiff from sitting.

Also the outriggers now all work. It looks like the PB Blaster I sprayed all over them were what was needed, one is still a bit stiff, but I think it'll get better.

Got the 20' boom section pined on today, with needing weight on the boom to lower, the lowest I could go was about 5' off the ground. Made mounting the boom 'fun', had to once again call on the old Hyster. It's a plain mast machine unfortunately, no fork positioner or side shifter. So got as close as I could driving up to the boom (about 6") then used a come-along to drag the 20' section to the boom tip and pinned it in place.

Now, stupid question time once again;

Next time I'm at the machine I'm going to try and get the tip and jib mounted and the hook blocks all reeved. Anyone got a picture or explanation about how the hook block is supposed to be secured. Revving it is pretty self explanatory, what I need to know is how (and where) the end of the cable is secured.

Also what's the deal with the extension cables for boom hoist. I understand that the bridle (think that's the right name) will need to be unpinned from where it's currently attached and then pinned to the long cables that are in turn attached to the tip of the boom. My question is, are there a specific cable I need to use to do this or just find one that's long enough? I've got two or more for about every boom section, will I have to join any together?

Stupid pictures aren't coming out in the right order, but you get the idea.

I also was doing some googling and found this; https://cranenetwork.com/details?id=170185&pn=cranes
Pretty interesting, kinda amazing they paid that much for my machine and then it somehow made it to Houston. I wish I had the bumper weight, wonder why it got separated from the machine, but that's not a big deal to make. But something is weird with the listing, they are either using pictures of my crane (identical to bend thing on the boom to rust steaks) to describe another machine or just have the info wrong, so can't be sure what's going on.

The pennent lines are as you said tied to the top of each boom section. You may have to manually pull out a little more boom cable but in a freed up machine the bridle should lay down on the base boom stub allowing them to be connected. The pennent lines attach to each end of the bridle, two per section. Install your boom section so the ends of the pennent lines will mate to each other without having to turn them end for end. Attach the tip section and when you boom up the boom will lift from the tip, not from the base section. Check you manual as to how many empty boom sections can be lifted from the bridle when pinned to the base section without causing damage. Probably not an issue on your small machine but it is on longer booms. When operating make it a point to look at the cotter keys and boom pins in the pennent lines and boom daily to insure they are in. Takes a set of binoculars in a larger machine. Not sure what way your machine is. Most had to have the bridle unpinned first but on at least one we could attach the pennent lines before unpinning the bridle.

 

[Operator4100]

Hey Guys, Very well put there TUGGER & OLD- IRON- HABIT, you need to think about putting your counterweight on, I have no clue about that, we never removed it, when we moved from job to job our boss said to swing it around so the butt section of the boom was to the rear then tied it down, the crane so it couldn't swing, don't trust any of those brakes, remember they work from brake fluid they will leak down overnight so put those dogs in, don't forget to raise you back gantry / back stay , I always raised it first, the boom cables seem to travel easier. Take care and be careful those rigs can be tricky.... DW

 

[alskdjfhg]

Thanks for the info guys, really appreciate it.

Tugger, I know what the wedge socket is. Will it link up on the big lug on the top of the block?http://s1309.photobucket.com/user/mebunting/media/440TC/20160206_141827_zpsaiioz4z2.jpg.html?o=56 With 4 sheaves on the tip and 3 on the block that would make sense.

Old-Iron-Habit, I think this 20' section and the jib will be about the most length I'll ever need. I did find the manual for this machine in the lower cab, but it was so water damaged it's pretty much useless.

Operator, I'd have put the counterweight on the machine yesterday, but it was still a bit wet for the Hyster back there and I haven't gotten around to making the pins for it. I'll see about getting the back gantry up when I'm at the machine again.

 

[Tugger]

More good points!Id go 2 or 4 parts of line hook your beckett to the lug on the boom tip.3 parts always seems to twist more and requires more messing around with back twisting.Putting the gantry up is a great idea.Years ago we went out with a P&H 325 tc and drove 12 piles quick ,went to unrig and realised the gantry was still down.No one on the site cared and I felt dumb for surviving something that could have gone wrong.Ive seen what happens to others who forgot the gantry.Back in the day you might rig up once a week,now we just go out push the lever and step on the throttle most of the time so you forget some steps .It would be fun to get the bunch of us together and do this .

 

[alskdjfhg]

It would be fun to get the bunch of us together and do this .

Sure would be.

If I had endless time and money, I'd try to save the big pile of heavy equipment I keep driving by. There is one BIG old crawler, what looks like a little Bantam truck crane, some old pan scrapers, trucks and misc stuff rusting on the side of the highway.

I keep seeing that big rusty crane boom and thinking it would be so cool to pull it out of the weeds and get running. Guess I must be a masochist at heart....

Maybe once I get organized (have a bunch of my own junk I've got to fix) and get the shop built, (that's going to be the big thing this P&H does for me) I can start adopting some real projects......

 

[Operator4100]

you would be surprised what that crane will do, I've drove piling with a drop hammer, clamshell rip rap and in coffer dams, poured a many a yard of concrete with that crane fun to run , very fond memories indeed

 

[alskdjfhg]

Ok that kinda brings up an idea I've been thinking about for a while.

What would it take for me to be able to drive pillings with this machine? It seems the drop hammer set ups use kind of jig to align what ever is being driven and the hammer.

Obviously I don't have this but is it something that could be made? Looks like a pretty simple weldment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8YRdR9s08E
This is the kind of set up I think I could rig up, on a smaller scale though.

Is the crane holding the frame up at the same time it is driving?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UZRHMKBQQw
A different way where the pilling aligns the hammer, how did they get pilling started?

How hard on the machine is it when used as a pile driver?

 

[Operator4100]

Hey, Got you thinking huh? lol last question first, na its not really hard on the machine but you needed good cables I'm thinking of your rusty ones, no offense. We had a drop hammer set up where the leads (that's the frame the hammer and follow block run in) were about 50 feet long, they were good for 40 foot piling. when the hammer was cast it had slides cast into it and hooks on each side for the follow block cables to hang on. the hammer would slide up and down the leads I guess that's why they called them leads cause they would LEAD the hammer, the follow block set on top of the piling, it had slides cast into it to, it kept the piling aligned with the hammer and straight in the leads. when we built the leads at the bottom we had 2 plates welded on each side of the main runners with slots cut in them so that timbers could be placed in there to center the piling with the leads. takes 2 hoist lines to work this, left hoist connects to the top of the leads because the left one has your power down planetary, don't use that to drive pile with to hard on it, then connect the right hoist to the hammer, there is more to it but that will give you an idea, maybe the other guys will chirp in here, I will help you all I can, keep in keep in touch, DW

 

[old-iron-habit]

I would think there would be some old drop hammers and leads around. No one uses them any more with the small vibratory hammers so plentiful. I would check with the crane rental outfits to see if they know of any.

Not sure on your rig but on most the rig will lift the counter weight into place by itself. Start with boom on the ground. On many the gantry stays on the back side have pins that you pull to allow the stays to extend down to connect to the ground setting counter weight. You lower the boom after it is setting on the ground to do so. Connect counter weight, boom up and pin the counter weight into place, boom down and pin the gauntry stays in the work position. To bad you operators manual is not in better shape so you can read the erection sequence.

 

[Tugger]

I still do jobs with the drop hammer,mostly test piles where recording the blow count for pile capacity is important.I run 3 drums on my cranes.We set up a hydraulic winch for the 3rd to hold the leads ,on your crane the power lowering drum for the pile line to load your pile into the leads( 2nd line).The first line runs the hammer.You can run with the leads rigged direct to the boom tip then 2 drums will work but its not so handy on a truck crane,works ok on a crawler crane .Be careful theres lots of things going on when your driving piles,some jobs are simple,some highly complex.I drove my first piles off a barge with a friend who must have been as crazy as me.We had no experience and no internet to get ideas from,but we lived to tell about it.

 

[alskdjfhg]

Thanks guys.

you needed good cables I'm thinking of your rusty ones, no offense.

None taken, they look worse in the pictures than they really are on the machine. But I think I'll put new cables when I start to actually work this machine just as a matter of prudence.

Not sure on your rig but on most the rig will lift the counter weight into place by itself. Start with boom on the ground. On many the gantry stays on the back side have pins that you pull to allow the stays to extend down to connect to the ground setting counter weight. You lower the boom after it is setting on the ground to do so. Connect counter weight, boom up and pin the counter weight into place, boom down and pin the gauntry stays in the work position. To bad you operators manual is not in better shape so you can read the erection sequence.

I'd think it would have too. The chart on the door of the lower says the counterweight weights 16,580lbs. There would either have to something at the site to install it (another crane of big forklift) and with this being a fairly small crane and designed to be 'portable', it should have a way to lift the counterweight by it's self.

Although I think it would be faster for me to just install it with the forklift than figure out how to make the crane do it.

And yeah it is a shame about the manual, I've been looking around online and haven't been able to find a replacement. Looks like ya'll are gonna have to function as my manual.

some jobs are simple,some highly complex.

I can imagine. I'm in engineering school right now (may have mentioned this in the past), but the actual engineering classes are yet to come so been doing a bit of self teaching on some of these strength of materials/simple engineering stuff.

It's fairly easy to calculate the bearing capacity of a pilling, but you need to know some data about the soil it's being driven in, of course I don't have this. Either have to hire a geotechical service or do it myself with tests.

Trying to see if it would be cheaper to go the trouble of driving my own pilings for my shop or having bell bottom piers drilled as originally planned. The concrete piers are pretty cheap, but I'm going to need a fair few of them (and they will have to be big as well) so it adds up.

Seems kinda silly to me not to at-least pencil out the costs of driving pillings VS drilling piers when I've got the crane to drive the pilings sitting 50' from the building site.

 

[Operator4100]

Hey Guys, like I said before we never removed the counterweight on this one but ya'll got me thinking some cranes are able to lower the weight down on the carrier when the boom is swung over the rear, then with probably with only the but and tip sections attached to the crane swing around boom up high and pick weight up and set it on a trailer or what ever then do the reverse for mounting the weight . look behind the lower engine compartment where the rear of the crane swings when over the rear (boom to the rear) and see if theirs 2 locating lugs on the deck, like 2 little pointy things sticking up a couple of inches, maybe I'm thinking of another crane not sure but have a look see. or send us a pic of that area so we can see, take care, DW

 

[alskdjfhg]

Their are two pointy things on the carrier, kinda wondered what they were for.

I'll get some pictures tomorrow, afraid it's going to be too wet to move any iron though, it rained this week. The joys of having an open air shop....

 

[old-iron-habit]

Thanks guys.



None taken, they look worse in the pictures than they really are on the machine. But I think I'll put new cables when I start to actually work this machine just as a matter of prudence.



I'd think it would have too. The chart on the door of the lower says the counterweight weights 16,580lbs. There would either have to something at the site to install it (another crane of big forklift) and with this being a fairly small crane and designed to be 'portable', it should have a way to lift the counterweight by it's self.

Although I think it would be faster for me to just install it with the forklift than figure out how to make the crane do it.

And yeah it is a shame about the manual, I've been looking around online and haven't been able to find a replacement. Looks like ya'll are gonna have to function as my manual.



I can imagine. I'm in engineering school right now (may have mentioned this in the past), but the actual engineering classes are yet to come so been doing a bit of self teaching on some of these strength of materials/simple engineering stuff.

It's fairly easy to calculate the bearing capacity of a pilling, but you need to know some data about the soil it's being driven in, of course I don't have this. Either have to hire a geotechical service or do it myself with tests.

Trying to see if it would be cheaper to go the trouble of driving my own pilings for my shop or having bell bottom piers drilled as originally planned. The concrete piers are pretty cheap, but I'm going to need a fair few of them (and they will have to be big as well) so it adds up.

Seems kinda silly to me not to at-least pencil out the costs of driving pillings VS drilling piers when I've got the crane to drive the pilings sitting 50' from the building site.

Piers? Now you need a Kelly drill attachment for your rig. The tools needed by a do it yourselfer never ends. You should see my place. LOL

Edit: You can get one with a Detroit to stay in period and humor the neighbors.