I have played with tool control a bit but all i can do is select 1 thru 5 and all of them just say AUX. Non says the name of a attachment. I tried 2 different passwords but non get me any further then selecting 1 thru 5. My manual don't show any more then how to select tool and tells me to contact dealer. I have searched this forum and found other cat machines having more menus but i can not find them in my machine. As of right now "no tool" is selected and that is how i got the line to pressurize pushing on the peddle sliding around the floor. Maybe next time i will try a video to show just what i see and just what happens with what. Maybe that make life easier.
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Cat 325c How do i set up hydraulics for thumb?
- Thread starter bigcam
- Start date
I have played with tool control a bit but all i can do is select 1 thru 5 and all of them just say AUX. Non says the name of a attachment. I tried 2 different passwords but non get me any further then selecting 1 thru 5. My manual don't show any more then how to select tool and tells me to contact dealer. I have searched this forum and found other cat machines having more menus but i can not find them in my machine. As of right now "no tool" is selected and that is how i got the line to pressurize pushing on the peddle sliding around the floor. Maybe next time i will try a video to show just what i see and just what happens with what. Maybe that make life easier.
Nige
Senior Member
My bad. I couldn't identify the last digit from the tag so I started searching from 171-0140 prepared to use anything from 0-9. I thought I'd hit pay dirt when 0 came up as a good number for a control valve. I never checked anything after that. At least thanks to Chris we're on track.
I've been dabbling a bit more in this today. I'm now pretty sure that we have a (dealer installed?) system 3 (1 or 2 pump, one-way flow) with the optional electrical foot switch. What isn't clear from SIS is whether the pilot lines which make both the standard aux valve and the 1710146 aux valve move in the other direction, are installed as default. If they are, it may be relatively easy to get two way flow with a solenoid valve and software change. Or, on the other hand, it may not. But either way, it IS possible.
bigcam, are you actually sincere about making this work, even if it means some serious effort and/or expense? I mean absolutely no offence, but I and others have previously put many hours of research into peoples' problems on this site for them to turn out to be just tyre kickers.
bigcam, are you actually sincere about making this work, even if it means some serious effort and/or expense? I mean absolutely no offence, but I and others have previously put many hours of research into peoples' problems on this site for them to turn out to be just tyre kickers.
High cost no because we will be getting close enough to the price of a grapple that wont need AUX hydraulics. The way we see it is if the stuff is there to make it work we will. If we must spend thousands of dollars to have a hydraulic thumb we might as well go buy a grapple move a few pins and be done. The only worth while to us of having the hydraulic thumb is save money. So if we start talking about spending thousands of dollars that is the time to quit and we will put a grapple on it. We don't "need" it ready until probably next year to start pulling out trees. We don't like to be behind so we get stuff done ahead of time and have it ready when needed. By next year we will surly know what is going on this machine.
No i wont take offense to you asking that question. I have been on many forums over the years and helped lots of people just for them to up and change there mind or have a different plan in mind already. So I have laid it out how we feel about it above. It does take time and effort to help people and i appreciate every bit of help every one of you have given. I must also add you guys on this forum are of the few that actually dig in and help anymore. Many other forums people just wont help anymore and tell you to "search for it" Even know you have searched for hours for the info already and couldn't find it. Which i did search several hours several different nights before joining this forum and asking the question. Just nothing really comes up in searching for this machine. Again I really appreciate all of you that have helped and i thank you. You guys remind me of why i liked the forums so much back in the day.
So If/when we find we will need to spend thousands just say so and we wont spend no more time on it. If the stuff needed or at least the costly stuff needed is on the machine lets make it work. A couple hydraulic hoses is no big deal to buy or little stuff like that.
I will admit i can't sit and turn wrenches on the machine every single day. I have my own business to run out side of grandmas farm this excavator is for and helping grandma get a new house put in. But i will be out there some time today and try to get a video taken.
OK I see where you're coming from. Here's what I see as the next steps but other opinions welcome.
1. Take a look at the tool settings in the monitor. Try passwords 0001 or FFF2.
2. Follow the non-cab side line back as previously mentioned.
3. Do the two auxiliary valves have pilot lines going in to the bottom ports?
1. Take a look at the tool settings in the monitor. Try passwords 0001 or FFF2.
2. Follow the non-cab side line back as previously mentioned.
3. Do the two auxiliary valves have pilot lines going in to the bottom ports?
What settings am i looking for? Last time i was in there i couldn't find a way to do anymore then just select 1 thru 5. I tried both of them passwords last time.
Ok first thing I am wrong on 2 things. JohnC is right the CAB side line is the one that pressurizes when you hit the peddle. Yea now i feel pretty dumb. What was going on is when i let off the peddle the right line would move for some reason? Vibration transfer maybe? IDK. But the left side line by the cab is the pressure side. Now my other mistake is i had to look threw the side panel to see behind the valves before and thought that right line went to a valve but no that is actually a different line. The right line goes to another block i will call it that has more then one hose going to it and from there looks like return. Boy do i feel dumb. 
I pulled the top cover off to see back there better so that makes a heck of a difference. I should of done that before and i am sorry.
For you Cmark
1 I still could not find any tool settings and i made a video just give me time to upload it.
2 Look at my dumb mistake above
3 Yes i see pilot lines on the bottom of both and i will get that video uploaded as well.
And for the last question you asked Nige No i didn't find a tag on the other valves. I must be blind or something.
I pulled the top cover off to see back there better so that makes a heck of a difference. I should of done that before and i am sorry. For you Cmark
1 I still could not find any tool settings and i made a video just give me time to upload it.
2 Look at my dumb mistake above
3 Yes i see pilot lines on the bottom of both and i will get that video uploaded as well.
And for the last question you asked Nige No i didn't find a tag on the other valves. I must be blind or something.
John C.
Senior Member
What we are trying to tell you is that you already have the auxiliary valves installed. You already have the pilot controls installed. You can do anything you want with little expense compared to starting from scratch. You mention a grapple. Does it have rotation? You could do a clamshell. Nether tool is worth a lot with out rotation and you already have the aux valves in place to do anything you want. Likely all it would take is a phone call to a dealer to get an idea of price.
Well I already made 6 calls to dealers last week and only got to talk to 2 of them and them 2 gave me little to no info and 1 of them told me to call a different dealer and that dealer i left a message with the person they said i needed to talk to and still have not got a call back lol In all honesty you folks have been way more helpful then any dealer.
At this point it seems like you said everything is there we just need to rearrange things and we have it. My guess the next steps are
1 pick a AUX valve to use and hook the right AUX line to the open port.
2 Find what pilot valve controls the 1 and 2 pump flow.
3 rearrange the pilot lines so my 1 and 2 pump flow changes to cylinder in and out direction change.
4 put my cylinder on the machine for the thumb and set the pressure relief valves to not blow it apart!
5 Thank you guys with the biggest thanks i can give.
6 Find a way i can pay you guys back for the help.
7 rip out a few thousand trees, tear down several buildings, load a few truck loads of iron and trash.
Just to give a idea i have already hauled over 30 loads of trash and tires. Plus 3 loads of tree branches. we are hauling with a 20ft long dump truck. With that much moved you can hardly tell i did anything yet! That was done with my skid steer. Really slow going with a old smaller machine from the 60s or 70s.
For the grapple no we was not looking at one with rotation. Al tho we could now. But with the little cost it seems this will take to have the hydraulic thumb we might as well save that money for something else and use a hydraulic thumb. To save more money I have bought some steel to make this thumb long enough for this machine and i have a cylinder off another backhoe i think i will use to move the thumb.
I'm confused about you comparing a grapple to a hydraulic thumb. Both will need two way hydraulics. What's the difference?
Anyway, here's some more bedtime reading. I think the schematic on page 7 is closest to your machine.
Anyway, here's some more bedtime reading. I think the schematic on page 7 is closest to your machine.
This type https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-54-Hea...132633578860?_trksid=p2385738.m4383.l4275.c10 No need for AUX hydraulics. Or like these where both sides open and close just off the bucket cylinder. http://www.rocklandmfg.com/index.php?page=h23-severe-service-excavator-grapples Heres a video of something similar.
Well guys it has been some time and other things took up all my time to finish this project but we are back at it! I got the thumb extended and now with the help of you guys and dad we pretty much have everything found and figured out down to just the hoses and pressure relief. So i hope you guys are willing to help me finish? Really didn't plan for it to take so long. Anyways my questions are:
1 how do i set the pressure relief on the AUX valve at the one end of my valve bank? Looks like just a jam nut and a large set screw but i want to be sure if that is the correct way and which way turning it does what? I assume threading setscrew out would lower pressure? I have a hydraulic gauge. I need to lower it for my cylinder rating.
2 will a code 62 flange bolt right up to my AUX valve on the end of the valve bank? If i buy both code 62 pieces?
3 does the pressure relief also relieve pressure when not activating that valve? example if i grab to hard with the bucket will the thumb cylinder get over pressurized or will the relief just release the over pressure and allow the cylinder to move rather then blowing things up?
1 how do i set the pressure relief on the AUX valve at the one end of my valve bank? Looks like just a jam nut and a large set screw but i want to be sure if that is the correct way and which way turning it does what? I assume threading setscrew out would lower pressure? I have a hydraulic gauge. I need to lower it for my cylinder rating.
2 will a code 62 flange bolt right up to my AUX valve on the end of the valve bank? If i buy both code 62 pieces?
3 does the pressure relief also relieve pressure when not activating that valve? example if i grab to hard with the bucket will the thumb cylinder get over pressurized or will the relief just release the over pressure and allow the cylinder to move rather then blowing things up?
So the way it works is there is a main relief valve that controls maximum pressure on every circuit so all circuits relieve at the same pressure. (There are exceptions and a main relief valve with two or more settings depending on the circuit in use isn't uncommon, but that's beyond the scope of what we're doing here)
Each hydraulic cylinder circuit will also have two "Line Relief" valves, one for each direction. The line relief valve's job is to open if the cylinder control valve is in neutral and the cylinder comes under excessive external force, thus preventing structural damage. (Once again there are exceptions. Not all cylinders will have a line relief, but most will.) The line relief valves pressure will be set above the pressure of the main relief valve meaning that the line reliefs only operate in an overload situation.
This is where it gets tricky. With a thumb, you will have the thumb cylinder and bucket cylinder pushing against each other. Depending on the cylinders' effective area and linkage geometry, one cylinder will be able to overcome the other and open its line relief which isn't a desirable situation as this will create heat. This means you have to set the thumb cylinder head-end line relief to a pressure that isn't so low that it opens all the time when working, and isn't so high that the bucket will bend the thumb before the thumb cylinder retracts.
TLDR; The aux valve will have two line reliefs, one on top, one bottom. Adjust the one for the head-end of the thumb cylinder so it has enough force to be effective but not so much that the bucket can't push the thumb back before structural damage occurs.
Each hydraulic cylinder circuit will also have two "Line Relief" valves, one for each direction. The line relief valve's job is to open if the cylinder control valve is in neutral and the cylinder comes under excessive external force, thus preventing structural damage. (Once again there are exceptions. Not all cylinders will have a line relief, but most will.) The line relief valves pressure will be set above the pressure of the main relief valve meaning that the line reliefs only operate in an overload situation.
This is where it gets tricky. With a thumb, you will have the thumb cylinder and bucket cylinder pushing against each other. Depending on the cylinders' effective area and linkage geometry, one cylinder will be able to overcome the other and open its line relief which isn't a desirable situation as this will create heat. This means you have to set the thumb cylinder head-end line relief to a pressure that isn't so low that it opens all the time when working, and isn't so high that the bucket will bend the thumb before the thumb cylinder retracts.
TLDR; The aux valve will have two line reliefs, one on top, one bottom. Adjust the one for the head-end of the thumb cylinder so it has enough force to be effective but not so much that the bucket can't push the thumb back before structural damage occurs.
Thank you Cmark. I know most of what you said. My lack of knowledge is how that pressure relief works as in what way do i turn what to raise and lower the pressure? And how do i know if i have and set the over pressure relief so the bucket can push the thumb back? Obviously I only need to mess with the AUX valve.
Also i learned that AUX valve has code 61 flanges which are only rated for 3000psi. So i shouldn't blow everything up right away while testing as i would assume the AUX valve should already be set to 3000psi or less. But i need to be somewhere around 2500psi for the rating of my cylinder. I do have the service manual on its way. WOW what a costly pile of paper lol But if you or anyone knows the details of turning what does what on the reliefs i could get that part set now rather then waiting a few more weeks for a expensive pile of paper. There is photos of the AUX valve earlier in this thread. Im using the added on AUX valve at the left of the valve bank. Im not going to use it till i know the pressures are right.
Also i learned that AUX valve has code 61 flanges which are only rated for 3000psi. So i shouldn't blow everything up right away while testing as i would assume the AUX valve should already be set to 3000psi or less. But i need to be somewhere around 2500psi for the rating of my cylinder. I do have the service manual on its way. WOW what a costly pile of paper lol But if you or anyone knows the details of turning what does what on the reliefs i could get that part set now rather then waiting a few more weeks for a expensive pile of paper. There is photos of the AUX valve earlier in this thread. Im using the added on AUX valve at the left of the valve bank. Im not going to use it till i know the pressures are right.
Generally, turn in to increase pressure, out to decrease. You can really only set it by trial and error. Start with it out so the bucket can easily push the thumb back and gradually turn it in until you think you have enough clamping force but the bucket can still overcome the thumb.
Thank you. We got them set lower yesterday. 2500psi for clamping and 1900psi to release thumb. Didn't plan a number but hit 1900psi and figured that should release the grab more then well enough ha. Does the overload portion come down in pressure with the main pressure adjustment or is there a separate adjustment for the overload? So the bucket can push it back without bending things.
Main pressure relief and line reliefs are completely separate. Don't touch the main relief valve as this affects all systems. As I mentioned, line relief pressure should always be set higher than main relief, except in very specific circumstances such as this one.
What you are effectively dong is using the thumb close line relief as a main relief, which is not really its job. If you were to constantly hold the thumb closed overcoming the line relief, it would quickly get hot. However as the thumb only gets occasional use, it is considered OK.
What you are effectively dong is using the thumb close line relief as a main relief, which is not really its job. If you were to constantly hold the thumb closed overcoming the line relief, it would quickly get hot. However as the thumb only gets occasional use, it is considered OK.