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Bobcat T190 arm repair

willie59

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Before noticing the 2nd page(yeah, I know I've done that before:Banghead:beatsme) I googled G.G. Willis. The best result was "G.G. Willis Insurance Co. and Funeral Home", New Orleans La. So did that experience come from fixing wrecks to save on claims or the mortuary dept.? :D

seriously nice work


LoL, no, he was my father. Taught me and brothers so much that we know today. Mainly, do it right...or you got :cussing :cool:
 

Speedpup

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I cannot imagine what they would want in NY to do that repair :eek::eek: Walked into the boat yard yesterday and labor rate was 125 per hour.:pointhead
 

willie59

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I cannot imagine what they would want in NY to do that repair :eek::eek: Walked into the boat yard yesterday and labor rate was 125 per hour.:pointhead


Dang Speedpup :eek: did ya remind them that ya just an owner of a little boat...not a cruise ship! :Banghead :tong
 

bill onthehill

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I am thinking someone played with the relief on that bobcat to tear it up like that. That and operator abuse can do a lot of damage. Great looking repair/engineering.
 

stock

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We have moved on and now were lost....
I cannot imagine what they would want in NY to do that repair :eek::eek: Walked into the boat yard yesterday and labor rate was 125 per hour.:pointhead

Always knew boats were holes in water that swallowed money......
 

daman

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May as well do both sides while its handy.
Well, got a phone call Thursday. You guessed it...it was Matt. "Hey, you remember my T190?"..."Yeah, what about it?"..."Oh, the side you repaired is fine...it broke the opposite side!" Grrrrrrrrr :Banghead :Banghead :Banghead

Now I have to do this again!
;)..
 

willie59

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I am thinking someone played with the relief on that bobcat to tear it up like that. That and operator abuse can do a lot of damage. Great looking repair/engineering.


Hi bill, I did check the relief setting when the first failure occured. Haven't checked it yet since it came back for failure on opposite side. I really don't know what they're doing to have this happen. Only know when it breaks, it breaks ugly. :yup
 

Tigerotor77W

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Man, I'm really glad I clicked on this. As an engineering student, let me say outright that this is far more impressive than the stuff I'm likely to end up doing as an engineer... hopefully we get the chance to meet sometime. I'm nearly amazed that you were able to make it look so easy!

I wish I had the experience to look at a weldment and know where its weak spots were, let know devise a strategy for how to fix it. :(
 

willie59

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Man, I'm really glad I clicked on this. As an engineering student, let me say outright that this is far more impressive than the stuff I'm likely to end up doing as an engineer... hopefully we get the chance to meet sometime. I'm nearly amazed that you were able to make it look so easy!

I wish I had the experience to look at a weldment and know where its weak spots were, let know devise a strategy for how to fix it. :(


Well thanks Tigerotor77W. ;)

In all honesty though, when you've pretty much worked with steel in some form or craft all your life, experience teaches you a great deal about it. Likewise, you learn how to work with it. Generally, when a failure of steel occurs, it typically leaves clues as to what happened and why. But wood? That's a different animal. Ain't really worth a hoot with it. I can build with wood, but prefer to work with steel. :)
 

stock

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We have moved on and now were lost....
Well thanks Tigerotor77W. ;)
But wood? That's a different animal. Ain't really worth a hoot with it. I can build with wood, but prefer to work with steel. :)

Yea there Atco I concur with that;too dam hard to get a rod to weld timber....:D:D:D
 

Tigerotor77W

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Well thanks Tigerotor77W. ;)

In all honesty though, when you've pretty much worked with steel in some form or craft all your life, experience teaches you a great deal about it. Likewise, you learn how to work with it.

This is an interesting point. Maybe I'll try to seek out a steel guy after hours or over the weekends and try to learn. More to add to the to-do list...
 

willie59

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Yea there Atco I concur with that;too dam hard to get a rod to weld timber....:D:D:D

Aye, it tis it tis. And ya can't heat it and bend it. And if ya take a torch to it...all you accomplish is set the darn stuff on fire! Can't do nothin with it I tell ya. :tong :D
 

willie59

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This is an interesting point. Maybe I'll try to seek out a steel guy after hours or over the weekends and try to learn. More to add to the to-do list...

Hi Tigerotor, I actually took a few pics of the failed metal to show you a few clues of what happened, but for some reason, me Gmail account didn't recieve the email I sent. Oh well, will try again tomorrow. :)
 

willie59

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Yep, pretty much posted pics just like this a year ago, just figured I'd post opposite side to remind everybody to frequently inspect this pin connection at the rear of loader arms. When they break...it's ugly. I priced a new loader arm assy a year ago and it was around $5,000, don't know what they are today.


Yep, they're bent.

T190 arm repair 015.jpg

T190 arm repair 016.jpg
 

stock

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We have moved on and now were lost....
Aye, it tis it tis. And ya can't heat it and bend it. And if ya take a torch to it...all you accomplish is set the darn stuff on fire! Can't do nothin with it I tell ya. :tong :D

A mon afftarr ma ooun hart............
 

stock

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We have moved on and now were lost....
Aye, guud mon yoorself! ;)






LoL, yep, but that was the little'n. SK200. The big'n, SK480, is stage left of pic, awaiting it's opportunity to squash little loader arms. :tong :cool:

I'd slap a freshman if he came out with a statement like that especially in front of a customer or in public..

They will be used to apply a gently metered force to realign the misaligned lifting structure from the awd skid steer.....to with in an appreciable tolerance to assure realignment of all the pivot points.this structure will then be checked for additional work, stress fractures etc prior to you; the customer making a lubain of it again..
................might need to review them certificates and Diplomas............................................ maybe it time for a refresher ....
 

willie59

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I'd slap a freshman if he came out with a statement like that especially in front of a customer or in public..

They will be used to apply a gently metered force to realign the misaligned lifting structure from the awd skid steer.....to with in an appreciable tolerance to assure realignment of all the pivot points.this structure will then be checked for additional work, stress fractures etc prior to you; the customer making a lubain of it again..
................might need to review them certificates and Diplomas............................................ maybe it time for a refresher ....


LoL...Stock, once again, your skills as a wordsmith is a pleasure to read. :notworthy


Tigerotor, I took a few pics (actually, quite a few) of the area of failure, I'll try to post the ones that give the best views of how the failure progressed.

This first pic shows the way to pin boss would have been oriented. The side plates have been cut away and what remains is the top and bottom web members. Now, keep in mind, the side plates are an important part of the assembly, but they can't hold the pulling load that is on the assembly because they're only 3/16" thick steel. The critical part that bears the pulling load between pin boss and loader arms is the welds that attach the pin boss to the top and bottom web members, they are 2" wide / 1/2" thick steel. The top web member weld is where the original crack developed. Once the weld cracked entirely, now the pulling load was transferred to the side plates as they encircle the pin boss. The right plate cracked next, then all that was left holding was the left plate. There's no way the left plate could hold the load by itself, so it would have rapidly pulled apart. Once the entire top frame members failed, it would have simply peeled away from the top breaking the bottom web member weld and tearing the bottom circle of the side plates. Pretty much done then.


Bobcat weld failure 001.jpg


This pic shows what it would have done once the top attachment failed. It pulled away and bent the bottom web member downward. Then the pin boss would have rolled backwards and tore off the lower circle of the side plates. If you look closely at the side plate that is still attached to the pin boss, down at the bottom of pin boss, you can see the steel of the side plate is bent downward from the pin boss rolling counterclockwise then tearing the steel of the side plate. This is the obvious clue that the top failed first and left the bottom to hold the load.


Bobcat weld failure 002.jpg


This is the top weld. Notice the rust on the weld that attached the pin boss to the top web member. Rust indicates that a fracture has been there for a period of time. Notice also, there is no rust where the side plate broke on the left, but there is rust on the right side plate. This indicates the weld was cracked, and that it extended to the right side plate. But notice at the very bottom of the right plate, there is a (seemingly) tiny portion of the right side plate that is rust free. This means the left plate and that tiny piece of right plate was all that was holding the pulling load. Once that little piece of right plate let go, the left plate wouldn't have lasted long, and it all came unwound.



Bobcat weld failure 003.jpg


Another thing that is noteworthy of the top weld is the right side of the weld, it was only about a 1/4" thick. This in an area of attachment to a 1/2" thick plate. It appears in production, Bobcat only gives this joint a single pass of weld. And this one didn't even cover the full 1/2" of the web member.



Bobcat weld failure 007.jpg


Here's looking at the top web member. Sure didn't get a full weld in there did they.


Bobcat weld failure 006.jpg
 

willie59

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Now here's an interesting site, the bottom web member weld. Once the top let go, this wouldn't have held long, and understanably so. Look closely at the weld on the web member, it's a full 1/2" of weld. But look at it's matching location on the pin boss. You can see fractured weld along the bottom, extending upward about a 1/4". Above that, up to that black burn stain line is no evidence of fracture, meaning, the weld didn't penetrate and bond with the pin boss in that area. There was only about 1/4" of confident weld on the lower web member attachment to pin boss.


Bobcat weld failure 011.jpg


Here's how the pin boss would have be oriented on the lower weld. You can actually see the gap between the weld on the web member and the pin boss where the weld didn't pentrate the pin boss and bond with it. It's easy to see the events that led to the destruction of this side. Problem is, the welds would have looked fine from the outside, but outside inspecting wouldn't have revealed the problems that were underneath the welds. The only thing that could have yeilded a different outcome would be if the owner had frequently inspected it and noticed the initial crack and addressed it promptly.


Bobcat weld failure 010.jpg


But here's the part that concerns me, and yes, I will cover this with the owner. This is the side I repaired a year ago. When the opposite side busted, it put a great deal of stress on this side. Notice the little lines in the paint, and the paint splotch areas. This is paint spalling from the metal being distorted. Doesn't necessarily mean this area in now comprimised, but it does mean the structural integrety has been somewhat weakened. The top and bottom welds look ok with no signs of cracks, but given the obvious stress that has happened on this side, I did grind away some of the top and bottom welds and applied more welds. We'll see how it goes.


Bobcat weld failure 012.jpg


Bobcat weld failure 013.jpg


Hey Stock...do I get my diplomas reinstated now? :D
 
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