That was a damn fine explanation there Mr. Atco! The lack of penetration on the lower weld is also a fine example of what can happen when somebody who isn't overly experienced is running a wire feeder on a structural weld. Personally, I prefer to use a stick to do my root pass simply to get in a bit deeper.
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Bobcat T190 arm repair
- Thread starter willie59
- Start date
stock
Senior Member
Hey Stock...do I get my diplomas reinstated now?
Hep we have referred it to the board but as it's timber and hasn't done a feckin thing is the last year I would not hold my breath....
willie59
Administrator
Tiny
Senior Member
Atco,Looks to me like you need to sneak up on these guys and take a vid of how they are using it,thats not normal.
Also ,great job on the repair. Most shops here would have ordered the assm. and never looked back .
Also ,great job on the repair. Most shops here would have ordered the assm. and never looked back .
willie59
Administrator
I agree Tiny, not the norm to see arms break like this on Bobcats, there are tons of them out there. As for the repair, this fellow is a small business tree service, budget is tight for guys like him, he's just trying to earn a living like most. New arms would be a stretch for him, and I can repair it for about half what new arms are and get him working again. Although, and I will discuss this with him, he has to consider these arms are no longer as structurally sound as new arms would be, they can't possibly be as much as they have been twisted about. He must consider this in continuing operating this machine and treat it with care. It ain't a 992 Cat. :yup
Ive never ran a bobcat brand skid loader but on my JD 8875 they recommend that heavy grubbing be done with the loader all the way down so it's resting on the frame of the skid loader at the front and use the bucket to twist out stumps rocks etc.I noticed on pic#3 on post #6 it looks like the bobcat loader also rests on the frame when it's it the down position.That may be your customers trouble, heavy grubbing with the loader up.Just a thought.
Tigerotor77W
Senior Member
Awesome explanation, ATCO! Makes sense to me.
Here's a question: are welds also stronger in compression?
I think I know how it happened (armchair engineering, of course).
Here's a question: are welds also stronger in compression?
I think I know how it happened (armchair engineering, of course).
willie59
Administrator
Awesome explanation, ATCO! Makes sense to me.
Here's a question: are welds also stronger in compression?
I think I know how it happened (armchair engineering, of course).
Well, to be honest, never thought much about the compressive strength of welds. I suppose there may be a test for the compressive strength of welds, but I think, and someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but most weld processes are tested/rated by their tensile strength, what it would take to pull it apart. Interesting question Tigerotor.
willie59
Administrator
I was going to post pics about finishing up the repairs on the right side of loader arms when forum went down, so here's a couple more.
One thing I failed to mention in the repairs on the left side was how to determine the exact location of the pin boss when fitting new plates. I figured a complex system of geometric measuring would be difficult at best and easily lead to error in location. To make the task easy, simple, and relatively accurate, I placed the pins removed from the lift arm components in the pin boss's on the opposite side, the side not broken. Fit a sturdy piece of steel on the end of the pins and tack weld the pins to the steel angle.
Then you simply remove the "pin template" and transfer it to the side being repaired. Slip the two pins in the lower pin boss's on that side, then fit the pin boss to be located and welded. Here's the pin template holding pin boss in it's proper location with no side plates, then a pic with the side plates clamped in place.
But even using this method isn't dead on precise, so I fitted the loader arms on the machine, loosen clamps and make slight adjustments in the fitting of the plates so that pivot pins went in properly on both sides. It would be a bad day if one was to weld up the side plates and pin boss, then try to fit it to the machine, only to find the pin boss is off by 3/16" and not be able to fit the pin that attaches it to the machine. Very bad day indeed.
One thing I failed to mention in the repairs on the left side was how to determine the exact location of the pin boss when fitting new plates. I figured a complex system of geometric measuring would be difficult at best and easily lead to error in location. To make the task easy, simple, and relatively accurate, I placed the pins removed from the lift arm components in the pin boss's on the opposite side, the side not broken. Fit a sturdy piece of steel on the end of the pins and tack weld the pins to the steel angle.
Then you simply remove the "pin template" and transfer it to the side being repaired. Slip the two pins in the lower pin boss's on that side, then fit the pin boss to be located and welded. Here's the pin template holding pin boss in it's proper location with no side plates, then a pic with the side plates clamped in place.
But even using this method isn't dead on precise, so I fitted the loader arms on the machine, loosen clamps and make slight adjustments in the fitting of the plates so that pivot pins went in properly on both sides. It would be a bad day if one was to weld up the side plates and pin boss, then try to fit it to the machine, only to find the pin boss is off by 3/16" and not be able to fit the pin that attaches it to the machine. Very bad day indeed.
willie59
Administrator
Got it all welded, cleaned it up, and applied some primer and Bobcat white paint.
And I'm confident there is way more weld here than what it origianlly had.
Ok Matt, ready for you to, err, hopefully not break something else. :tong
And I'm confident there is way more weld here than what it origianlly had.
Ok Matt, ready for you to, err, hopefully not break something else. :tong
stock
Senior Member
So lets have there of the story.......you know you want to... excellent work though...............................
willie59
Administrator
Ahh, as in "don't ask me how I know". :tong
Well, my friend, in this case, no, it was experience in working/fitting iron that told me "you better not just trust the jig...ya better make sure it fits before you weld..."
Sure enough, on left side repair as well as right side, had to make very slight adjustments to the side plates holding the position of the pin boss so that the pivot pin would drive home at attachment to rear arm of the machine.
Now I'll grant you this; maybe it's my past errors of fitting/welding during the apprenticeship days of my youth that prompted the voice in my head to say "ya better check it". Yes, experience gained from age can be a wonderful thing. Alas, age bears it's price on the eyes though...it's a real struggle to see good enough to weld nowdays. Just can't see the bead as well as I used to in my youth. :Banghead
willie59
Administrator
:lmao :duh :cussing :falldownlaugh
LoL...naw, it's a Bobcat, that's all it will ever be. :tong
stock
Senior Member
If Atco had made it then it would never have broken in the first place...
willie59
Administrator
Welcome to the forum amgsmith. :usa
Our business has evolved into doing a considerable amount of equipment rentals, and that rental fleet keeps me covered up in work to the point that it's difficult for me to fit current customer machines in for repairs, there's just no way I can take on any more work.
Did your loader arms fail in the same location, at the rear loader arm pin bosses? If so, any good welding/fabrication shop in your area should be able to perform the repairs. It's not a terribly difficult job, just a bit time consuming.
Our business has evolved into doing a considerable amount of equipment rentals, and that rental fleet keeps me covered up in work to the point that it's difficult for me to fit current customer machines in for repairs, there's just no way I can take on any more work.
Did your loader arms fail in the same location, at the rear loader arm pin bosses? If so, any good welding/fabrication shop in your area should be able to perform the repairs. It's not a terribly difficult job, just a bit time consuming.
ya same left side and the right side has cracks so ready to break as well....How much should i expect to pay for this type of work????? or do you know of any place i could just get a set of used arms? mine are so warped i also broke last year the front cross member so the arms are out of a line.