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The upcoming generation

JD955SC

Senior Member

Rising Number of Men Don't Want to Work​

merican men are opting out of the workforce at unforeseen rates.

For many, it's not an issue of not being able to find a job. They have simply opted out altogether. The Bureau of Labor Statistics found only 89 percent of working age men have a job or are actively looking for work. In 1950, that number was at 97 percent.

While the early 1950s saw around 96 percent of working age American men between the ages of 25 and 54 working full or part-time jobs, that proportion has now moved to just 86 percent, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

And as fewer men financially support themselves, there are long-reaching economic and societal implications, experts say.

"The U.S. has a major issue of prime-age men giving up and permanently exiting the labor force," Robin Brooks, a senior fellow policy research firm the Brookings Institution and the former chief economist at IIF, wrote on X, formerly Twitter this week.

"What's striking about this is that it doesn't get talked about at all, not in the mainstream media and not by economists, even though this obviously feeds political radicalization."

What Caused The Drop?​


Recessions often bring down the workforce participation rate, and often the numbers never quite recover.

The 2008 Great Recession saw male employment decline from 88 to just 80.6 percent, and the rate has never been able to get higher than 86.7 percent since then. The pandemic saw a similar if not slightly different fate for men's work. After dropping to 78 percent in 2020, male workforce participation has essentially recovered to pre-pandemic times now but still remains far below the times of the 1950s.

A larger factor may be men's declining participation in higher education. While women historically were excluded from universities, they now outpace men at college roughly 60 to 40 percent.
And for those without a college degree, unemployment is far more likely. Those with only a high school diploma have an unemployment rate of 3.9 percent compared to just 2.2 percent of those who achieved a bachelor's degree, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics.
A recent study from the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston linked a drop in self esteem related to the jobs on the market as a possible factor.

The drop in men in the workforce has been largely concentrated among non-college educated men, and it's these men who face a significant decline in earnings.
Over the timespan of 1980 and 2019, non-college-educated men's median weekly earnings went down 17 percent after inflation, while college-educated men saw earnings rise by 20 percent.
"This finding suggests that deteriorating social status is a plausible key factor," the Boston Fed paper said.

Of course, since 1950, there's also been growth in the United States' safety social net.
While 1960 saw only 455,000 workers on Social Security disability benefits, that had moved to 7.6 million people in 2022. Of that cohort, 1.3 million were men between the ages of 25 and 54.
"If the jobs don't meet people's needs, people can't work," Yvonne Vissing, a professor at Salem State University and an expert on the changing role of men in society, told Newsweek. "It's not that they won't work. They can't, given the job options, locations, tasks, hours, pay, and environments that are available."

Men have also been more likely to go to graduate school or be stay-at-home dads in recent years.
The shift in industry work available will also see men lose traction in the workforce, Vissing said.
Most factory or manufacturing jobs are gone in the United States, and while STEM remains a hot field, health, education and administration roles are increasing in importance, Vissing said. These jobs are often held by women.

Men also may be leaving the workforce due to a larger dissatisfaction with capitalist society, Vissing said.

"Many jobs are simply not satisfying," Vissing said. "Working for others who get the benefit of our physical labor and intellectual property is not rewarding either emotionally or financially. People want to work doing jobs that matter to us. We want to use our creativity. We want to matter, and in many businesses, employees simply don't get treated with the respect and support that we need and want. People walk away from them."


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You want to know my job hunting experience until I just happened to find a good program that was willing to give me a chance to escape the dead end .gov job I had before becoming a heavy equipment mechanic?

“You’re overqualified”
“Spend hours filling out resumes but get constant rejection letters and companies ghosting me”
“You need five years experience” “where do I get that experience?” “By getting hired on here, after you gain five years experience”

Half the workforce problem has been caused by companies themselves with their run amok HR departments and nonsensical hiring policies.
 

skyking1

Senior Member
The problem with statistics is the hide as much as they reveal. There is a large cohort of folks who no longer need to work after 50. They won the game working at MegaCorp, and are Financially Independent Retired Early (FIRE).
They contribute to that lowering employment number.
If I had my ducks in a row I would have bailed at 60 or 62. That's working blue collar my whole life.
People average about 6 different careers over a lifetime these days, so it is not unusual for the Voc Tech schools to run through a lot of candidates who really have no idea where their niche is.
I have personally discouraged a couple of apprentices who were not cut out for the job. The one went back to tying rebar. I have also encouraged the good workers and even gone to bat for one that my crane boss was going to axe.
 

funwithfuel

Senior Member
When I wanted a job, I went to the place I wanted to work Monday morning before anyone showed up. Introduce myself to the first guy that showed up and applied myself to the job. I usually got what I was after.
Nowadays, nobody will talk to a kid trying to fill out an app. Apply online, email yer resume. That crap there is enough to pi$$ anyone off. Then the crap mentioned by JD955SC, too much experience, not enough. And the best, no connections. Who do you know? What bit of difference does that make?! I see bonafide apprenticeships are often distributed that way as well. Some kids with good heads on their shoulders get in, but a lot of time it's a kid with no skills, no brains and no drive whose dad is drinking buddies with a director or manager. Terrible for the field as a whole.
 

Welder Dave

Senior Member
A person needs to have a desire to do a certain type of job but part of the problem is that not everyone has the right stuff for the job they'd like to pursue. Just like you can't force someone into a specific job. Your parent may have excelled at their job and want you to follow in their foot steps but that doesn't always work out. I'm sure everyone in a trade has seen newbies come in that just aren't suited to the job.

As far as trades schools, it's really disgraceful that they were often referred to as dummy schools and a dumping ground for the slower or problem students. None of the students wanted to admit they went to the dummy school. My dad had to fight to get me in a trade school and I'm grateful. I actually liked going to school again. I was much better working with my hands than sitting at a desk learning useless crap I'd never use. I got out early because I had a job offer to start an apprenticeship. I started at $7.31/hr. It went to $8.30 when they had a 13.58% wage increase a few month's later. Students out of a "smart" school would have been fighting to get a job at McDonalds for $4-$4.50 an hour. The school I went to wasn't considered a dummy school by employers. Quite the opposite, it had a reputation of having some of the best pre-employment training and employers knew this. It's really sad the trades and trades people aren't given the respect they deserve. It's even sadder they aren't promoted. There's already a shortage of skilled trades people and I think it's going to get to a critical shortage in the very near future. They'll come out with the next big project but there won't be the skilled trades people to complete it.
 

Coaldust

Senior Member
That’s understandable. I tend to think that way, as well. There may be a few good ones with potential here and there. It’s going to be expensive and time consuming to locate them.

I wonder how well Cat ThinkBig is doing with recruitment and how much success the dealers are having? The best best practices for recruitment were well established. If that’s failing, I’m not sure there is much hope.
 

Tugger2

Senior Member
Over the years ive had my problems with employing the younger generation and trying get jobs done.At times ive figured im just too much of a pr*ck to work for and left it at that.Im usually pretty happy working alone,but thats a tough way to move forward. In the last few years ive been working as a sub for another contractor that hires a lot of young guys. On his jobs he sends me out with some first class young guys ,often not super experienced in some of the work we do . But they are smart , keen and we get things done safely and productively. Its a pleasure to work with these guys. Now its on me to learn how to pass the experience forward.
 

chidog

Senior Member
A person needs to have a desire to do a certain type of job but part of the problem is that not everyone has the right stuff for the job they'd like to pursue. Just like you can't force someone into a specific job. Your parent may have excelled at their job and want you to follow in their foot steps but that doesn't always work out. I'm sure everyone in a trade has seen newbies come in that just aren't suited to the job.
When I worked at a huge manufacturing company in the early 70's, it seemed most of the people there (lots of old ww2 folks) fit what you say. I always wondered how they ever got into the profession.

Kids? I remember working with fairly fresh tech schoolies that thought they were the all knowing gods of the particular trade. In other words little _______ holes. I've run into a few decent younger folks, but they are not mechanics.
IMOP some one that has to go to a trade school to learn the old school mechanics doesn't have it in their system. They are doing it just because.
 
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