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opinions of fiat allis 16b

Discussion in 'Dozers' started by hd16b, Mar 22, 2011.

  1. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    Got my 16b in the shop today. What all is involved in changing the undercaraige out to cat, ecsecially in the sprocket change over .my rails are done, and I don't think I can find any. Anyone else know where some rails and sprockets are.
     

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  2. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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  3. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    I got a track taken off, and the thing has tons of play .I am slightly worried that someone has possibly taken a link out of the track . Which would be bad, if I had to find another link per side .

    Is there any way you can tell me how many pins are in your track on yours td25c .
     
  4. DIYDAVE

    DIYDAVE Senior Member

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    I know the AC machine with 7 rollers had 41 links. Don't know if Fiat stayed with the original AC 16B design, though...
     
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  5. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    That sounds correct DIYDAVE . Will double check tomorrow .

    If the sprockets are sharp I'd guess it's had a link removed with the given condition of the track .

    On a good note Grantc's 16 looks pretty strait like it's been taken care of .

    Problem …… Rail's / bushings are more than likely shot .

    If I was going to keep the tractor would convert the undercarriage to Cat D7G .
    I know the bottom rollers will fit with a little work .:)
     
  6. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Replacing / rebuilding the end bit's ?
    Cutting edge looks pretty good yet .

    Moldboard looks in good shape as well . No plate welded in the center , could be a low hour machine ?

    KIMG0849[1].JPG
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2019
  7. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    The end bits had to come off to get it through the door into my shop, made it by 1/2" per side. Lol

    The sprockets are shot completely .the pins and bushings were laughable.

    But good news is that I counted 41 pins a side on mine. That would be some good news .

    I ran this tractor for very limited time (maybe like 20 hours) mostly ripper time. Cause the rippers planted the rear end and kept the tracks from slipping g mostly.

    The dozer runs exceptionally well, but I'd on wanna throw a ton of money at it in new parts, as I don't know what to expect the drives, motor and tranny to do long term.

    I have the tooling to do most of the machining myself, and am going to do it on the cheap and see if it runs out, then if it holds up, I will concert most likey.

    I am planning on machining the sprockest to accept a bushings that is heat treated and cut in half to fill machined spot and weld edges and am going to make new pins and bushings, and I am thinking about machining the bottom rollers and putting a 2 piece shell around then heat treated as well for now to see if this girl has some life left I it.

    I am only into this thing for 6k right now, so I guess I'll see if it is gonna warrant the money, I have a buddy that heat treats, and the machining is on me, so it won't be really any cost but the steel .

    Any advice on steel for pins and bushings? Haven't done any homework yet on it.
     

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  8. Theweldor

    Theweldor Senior Member

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    If you have the means to machine it. I would go with 4140 Prehard.
     
  9. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    More pics
     

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  10. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    If it's prehard, that gonna be hard to machine?
     
  11. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    The hour meter says little over 5k, for what thats worth.
    I have quite a bit of equipment, and judging by the wear in the lift cylinder bushings, and other areas, it looks like this was possibly the original under carriage i think. The bushings have been turned over already. Its does have part of the sub structue cut out on the passenger side under the lift cylinder, looks like they were trying to get something on the front of the motor im guessing, for easier access. You can see the weld line in the pic with the chain taken apart above
     
  12. Theweldor

    Theweldor Senior Member

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    It machines well with good carbide tooling. Of you can figure out the dimensions you may be able to buy it to size. If you order it TPG { turned ground and polished} all you would have to do is cut it to length and put s slight chamfer on it.
     
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  13. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    from what i gather the pins are 1.875 and the bushings are 2.875, so its possible i could get that maybe. wouldnt be a big deal to cut ant then harden, i just dont know if it will change in size after heat treat, would wanna try a couple and verify, before i go for all of them.
     
  14. d9gdon

    d9gdon Senior Member

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    You might want to build up the roller shells with weld and turn to specs if you're able to do the machining on the other parts. Some people submerge them while being welded to reduce heat. I have seen elaborate setups that turn the submerged shells as they're welded.
     
  15. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    Well got the tracks off today, and opened the drives up, and suprise . Drivers side pinion has some very bad damage. 3 teeth have bad damage. Can't believe I didn't hear it. I have had damage before in other equipment, buy have allways heard/felt it.

    Now I have to try and find a pinion, or I guess have to try and repair this one. It keeps getting deeper. Ugh
     

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  16. Grantc

    Grantc Member

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    Have you been into the finals on your 16b. The pinion in one of my drives is pretty tore up. To get it out, i don't know if you can sneak it out from outside, without going in from the trans side .by looking at the parts manuals, it looks like it could be possible, because of the tapered splines on the trans side.
     
  17. Welder Dave

    Welder Dave Senior Member

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    At least you got it in your shop.
     
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  18. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Yes , been in both sides . Had a similar experience as you .

    I did notice a slight noise when tracking in reverse fast .
    My issue turned out to be the intermediate pinion shaft inner bearing was going out .
    It sets in a cavity behind the gear .

    100_4596.JPG 100_4591.JPG
    Best to pull the final on the 16-B completely down & check all the bearings . That's more then likely what caused the gear failure .

    You will have to pull the steering clutch assembly & pull the brake drum hub to get the top pinion out .

    100_4594.JPG
     
  19. td25c

    td25c Senior Member

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    Last edited: Jan 13, 2019
  20. Queenslander

    Queenslander Senior Member

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    The large live axle, you can slide out and then roll the bull gear out the opening at the rear, the intermediate gear is straightforward, but the small pinion gear/shaft has to be first separated from the steering clutch hub on the inside.


    Td answered your question as I was typing, comprehensively as usual.:)
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2019
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