Fiat 70CI. Repairs, modifications and stories.

[Jeembawb]

Steering Clutches Day 1 Progress

Ok so I have finally started - 1st I had to get the forklift going & drag it up the hill (very steep) & with no brakes & the sloppiest steering in history - it made for an interesting morning. It was a little dangerous but I took a fire extinguisher along for the ride so that safety wasn't completely out the door (I have a lawnmower gas tank cable tied to the rops) . The 4x4 Navara wasn't cutting the mustard & luckily my neighbour came by with a Ford 7000 to tow me up the rest of the way.

Anyway here are some pics. The 1st few anyway.

 

[Jeembawb]

More pics of day 1

It was all going ok (apart from running out of gas a couple of times in the hyster (hence the opportunity for photos)) until I propped the front of the dozer up (using it's own "seen better days" 6" blade lift rams) - actually all was good until i let it down onto the blocks when it walked the ram nut out - luckily enough I had already modified the other side so I know what to do this time. Lucky it didn't do that while I was under placing the blocks. 1st rule of hydraulics - Never trust hydraulics! Anyway, just another thing to add to the list.

I was 1/2 way thru removing the ripper when I had to find my good prybar & I was hot & dehydrated when a bloke rung & said he was coming round for a beer - Knockoff time :drinkup

 

[OzDozer]

Interesting to hear of the BT7D Fiat crawler - I had never heard of this model. I can't find it listed in any tractor S/N records, and neither can I find it on the MMT Italia website (which has pics or brochures of nearly every European tractor, as well as American and British ones).

The last small Fiat I ever knew of, was the AT7C. Both the 70CI and the AT7C were quite good little tractors. One farmer went into competition against me with my D6's and D7's - with firstly, a 70CI - then later an AT7C.
He was a real PIA! Those damned Fiats kept going and kept going, and he carried out an enormous amount of earthmoving work with those little tractors. He made it perform like a D6!

http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...--apripista/0_Fiat_AT7C_anni60_dozer.JPG.html

 

[22a]

Saw one (BTD7) at a clearing sale last Sunday. It was passed in.

 

[OzDozer]

22A - A BTD-7 would be a British International crawler, the U.S. version was the TD-7. The Fiat was BT7D.

 

[Jeembawb]

Interesting to hear of the BT7D Fiat crawler - I had never heard of this model. I can't find it listed in any tractor S/N records, and neither can I find it on the MMT Italia website (which has pics or brochures of nearly every European tractor, as well as American and British ones).

The last small Fiat I ever knew of, was the AT7C. Both the 70CI and the AT7C were quite good little tractors. One farmer went into competition against me with my D6's and D7's - with firstly, a 70CI - then later an AT7C.
He was a real PIA! Those damned Fiats kept going and kept going, and he carried out an enormous amount of earthmoving work with those little tractors. He made it perform like a D6!

http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...--apripista/0_Fiat_AT7C_anni60_dozer.JPG.html

Interesting to hear about the 70ci / at7 comparison to d6 & 7. When I had a D6D up here recently I was a little surprised at the similarity in size (&corresponding weight) when they were side by side - I reckon there would only be 3 or 4 ton in it - the difference in usable horsepower was a bigger gap.

Jimbob

 

[OzDozer]

Jimbob - I didn't intend to indicate that the 70CI and AT7 would equal the D6 and D7 in performance. There's no comparison there.

What I meant was, that this farmer bloke thought he had a D6, the jobs he took on with it! He ripped rock that would have made my D6's slow up, and he dug huge dams with those little Fiats, that took him weeks and weeks to complete!
He really was a tiger - he would put those little Fiats into almost anything. He'd take on jobs that I wouldn't have considered with a tractor that size. Often, I'd see him stopped for a short while, as he blasted some rock the Fiat couldn't rip!
Then, he'd be back into it again! I dunno who had the bigger heart - those little Fiats, or that farmer! He was truly a real toiler, and never let anything stop him - and those little Fiats rarely let him down.

Have you ever seen an AD14 or BD14 Fiat? They came out about 1967, with a direct drive powershift! There was no torque converter in the driveline, just a clutch and manual transmission operated by a single lever.
They were supposed to be Fiats answer to the Cat powershift, as you could shift the Fiat transmission in the same manner as a Cat powershift.
I never saw many of these tractors, I don't think they sold any more than a handful here in Australia.

Fiat AD14 - http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...er-e--apripista/AA_Fiat_ad14__anni60.jpg.html

Fiat BD14 - http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...--apripista_001/0_FA_BD14_an70_dozer.JPG.html

I drove an FD20 for a couple of months for some Italian friends back about 1997. It wasn't a bad tractor, it was 227HP and was supposed to be the equivalent of a D7G.
It had an Iveco motor, which performed O.K. - but the part costs for it were horrendous! The cost of a water outlet housing (thermostat housing) was $1000! What a joke!
It had quite a good fully-enclosed ROPS, A/C cab, which made operating the tractor quite pleasant. It could push better than the D7G, and it was quite reliable.

Fiat-Allis FD20 - http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...zer-e--apripista_002/Fiat-Allis_FD20.jpg.html

http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...pale-cingolate_004/AA_FA_FD20_anni80.jpg.html

http://www.album-mmt.it/foto/v/la-s...i-anni-80/altro_004/0_FA_FD20_anni80.jpg.html

 

[Queenslander]

Jeembawb,
The dozer in your photo would be an AT7D, the BT7D is the bull blade version.
Not sure about the steering clutch setup.
We had an AT7C with the dry rear end and composition plates,but metallic ones were obtainable, they may have come from the D.
I doubt that D4 clutchs would fit these tractors though.
Cheers, Greg

 

[Jeembawb]

Jimbob - I didn't intend to indicate that the 70CI and AT7 would equal the D6 and D7 in performance. There's no comparison there.

What I meant was, that this farmer bloke thought he had a D6, the jobs he took on with it! He ripped rock that would have made my D6's slow up, and he dug huge dams with those little Fiats, that took him weeks and weeks to complete!
He really was a tiger - he would put those little Fiats into almost anything. He'd take on jobs that I wouldn't have considered with a tractor that size. Often, I'd see him stopped for a short while, as he blasted some rock the Fiat couldn't rip!
Then, he'd be back into it again! I dunno who had the bigger heart - those little Fiats, or that farmer! He was truly a real toiler, and never let anything stop him.

Fair enough OzDozer, I know what you mean. I'm sure that with some of the work I did with the D6D here recently, if I was trying to do the same thing with the fiat it would have broken 10 times to get the job done. I was more surprised in the relative similarity in size.

Btw - what old loader is your loader project?

Jimbob

 

[Jeembawb]

Jeembawb,
The dozer in your photo would be an AT7D, the BT7D is the bull blade version.
Not sure about the steering clutch setup.
We had an AT7C with the dry rear end and composition plates,but metallic ones were obtainable, they may have come from the D.
I doubt that D4 clutchs would fit these tractors though.
Cheers, Greg

Thanks Greg - I figured the bloke that owned it would know what model it was. Interesting that there could be a fair bit of difference between a c & d model variant & also about the bull blade.

Jimbob

 

[22a]

22A - A BTD-7 would be a British International crawler, the U.S. version was the TD-7. The Fiat was BT7D.

It was A Fiat BT7D. I typed the D in the wrong place.

 

[Tarpon140]

Can someone who owns a Fiat 311c, 312c, 351c give me the length of the bottom link arms on the 3 pt linkage.
The 351c I just purchased has had the link arms butchered and I want to restore them to original condition.
Just end to end length is good enough.

Also any tips on splitting the tracks would be appreciated as well.

 

[Jeembawb]

Can someone who owns a Fiat 311c, 312c, 351c give me the length of the bottom link arms on the 3 pt linkage.
The 351c I just purchased has had the link arms butchered and I want to restore them to original condition.
Just end to end length is good enough.

Also any tips on splitting the tracks would be appreciated as well.

Wow - I have heard of the 4xx & up models, but I didn't know they made a 3xx as well. What size is that? I know of a 4xx m/c around the traps here I have been trying to get my hands on for little work & spraying & running the wood chipper etc, but a 3xx would probably be ok for cleaning up around the house too - I reckon there may be someone on here that has 4xx m/c's (they might be the same) but you could also try sth burnett tractors or gw tractors to see if they have any in their wrecking yards to check for you - they could have some books too.

Jimbob

 

[Jeembawb]

RipperOff

Ok - so i found my prybar & the beer has run out & I have been trying to turn a Nissan Patrol into a tractor - enough play - back to real work now. The ripper is off & will be drug to the shed to make it a little less hillbilly (pins half the size of the holes (some were pipe!) and rams that were just in the wrong place), they might even end up not having to share a spool with the tilt ram via a myriad of taps. Then to chop the top of the uprights for the rops, pull the top off for rebuild or remanufature & then at the end it can sleeve back onto the uprights with a couple of bolts. That should keep me busy for a couple of nights. May even get the cwp / steering packs out by the weekend.



Jimbob

 

[Tarpon140]

The 311c, 312c and 351c are a 4 cylinder 30hp tractor.

Information is hard to find but from research I have found out they were made '59 to '61. The 351c was a Montagna or mountain tractor with a wider track base than the 311c & 312c. I can't tell you difference between 311c & 312c though.

There was a 355c made after this. It has two cylinders and has more of a square bonnet, similar machine though. It was made in a series with the 405 and 605.

If anyone out there has or knows of these machines it would be good to hear from them.

 

[Jeembawb]

The 311c, 312c and 351c are a 4 cylinder 30hp tractor.

Information is hard to find but from research I have found out they were made '59 to '61. The 351c was a Montagna or mountain tractor with a wider track base than the 311c & 312c. I can't tell you difference between 311c & 312c though.

There was a 355c made after this. It has two cylinders and has more of a square bonnet, similar machine though. It was made in a series with the 405 and 605.

If anyone out there has or knows of these machines it would be good to hear from them.

Good tip that the Montagna means mountain tractor - I did a lot of research before I got a dozer & really liked the fiats that had a wide gauge & wide grousers & were good on hills. I was looking mainly at 605 to ad7 / 70ci but I did some research on some 4xx ones that come up for sale & though they could be good for when all the hard work is done.

Put up some pics when you can - are you going to restore it or run it or both? The little ones make for a good shed project huh?

Welcome - Jimbob

 

[Jeembawb]

Roof Off

Ripper mounts off & roof cut off - next to take the fuel tank & seat out and work these fenders out (hopefully having enough room to slide them sideways (one with hydraulics attached) to be able to get the top off).

Jimbob

 

[Tarpon140]

Will get it back to tip top working condition then put give it a go with spreader, slasher, spraying.

3pt linkage is fixed, injector pump is with doctor, the steering clutches and brakes are next.

Hard yards were done with D4D, the Fiat is for general work.

Will think about restoration later (ie paint).

 

[Queenslander]

Hey Jeembawb, I've probably missed something in one of your earlier posts, but why did you deem it necessary to lift the front of the tractor to work on the rear end?
Cheers, Greg

 

[Jeembawb]

Will get it back to tip top working condition then put give it a go with spreader, slasher, spraying.

3pt linkage is fixed, injector pump is with doctor, the steering clutches and brakes are next.

Hard yards were done with D4D, the Fiat is for general work.

Will think about restoration later (ie paint).

Did all my hard yards work with D6D just recently. The fiats usually have a few features that Cats don't. Does your rig have angle & tilt? Should be a handy tractor.

Guy