Characteristics of a good operator?

[777funk]

Around our remodels, we have a skid steer and have had a backhoe (big Ford) and a tractor with a grader blade. My 17 year old has taken an interest in becoming an operator. He plans to enroll in a union apprenticeship program.

I am a little concerned however. He's a great test taker and smart kid. He will do well on the written. He aced his driver's written test. But his practical driving skill is marginal. He's not a natural driver and has had some close calls. Will this hurt him as an operator? In running my skid steer he does fine and I'd go as far as to say very good. He's careful around septic plumbing and other obstacles. I think he's a good operator. He's better than he is on roads. I certainly wouldn't want him behind the wheel of a tractor trailer.

The other quality I notice is he is a precision over speed guy. If he sweeps a floor, it will be near spotless, but it'll take 3x longer than it would take me. Will this cost him? I've encouraged him to go into something like auto body where attention to minute detail is critical. But he likes heavy equipment. He also is decent at servicing the hydraulics. So he has that going for him.

I'm hesitant to tell him what he should do for a living as he'll be happiest with what he loves. But I also want him to succeed.

Will there be some kind of weed out during the "hands on" portion of the apprenticeship? Is speed critical? Does his not being a natural in driving an automobile mean he'll have trouble with machinery?

Thanks in advance for any thoughts!

 

[Welder Dave]

Quality first, speed second. It takes a lot of experience to be good and fast. Having the job how it's supposed to be is the most important part.

 

[terex herder]

You may be able to teach a good man to be fast, but you can't teach a fast man to be good.

Very few people retire with the same type of job they had when they started their career.

 

[Tinkerer]

Any union apprenticeship program co-ordinater will determine if he will get into the program.
If he does get in, his skills and the level of them will allow him to either to stay in the program or be ejected.
It's not about speed. It is about efficiency. An operator doesn't have to be super fast. But he has to be productive enough to satisfy his employer.
If anyone cannot do that they will have to find a different career.

I guess I am one of the few Terex Herder mentioned. The first time I ran track loader was in 1962. 43 years later I parked a 450H JD dozer the day I retired.

 

[treemuncher]

Many years ago, when I had employees, I would not stand for a "cowboy" type attitude. You operate too fast or too forceful, you will break it and I will have to pay for the repairs. Heavy equipment is heavy in weight, that does not mean it is unbreakable. Everything has a limit. Every tool should be well cared for and used within the limits it is designed for. It means more to me to know the limits of a cylinder and never hit the stops than to bang the bucket on every pass without intention. By all means, efficiency is more important than speed so make every move count to keep a customer happy and keep the business profitable.

I have a professional degree but sitting behind a desk was a slow death for me and I dreaded going to work every day to drive that wooden flat and perform high end mathematical functions. What is the quality of life if you do NOT enjoy what you do every day? One way or another, an opportunity dropped into my lap with heavy equipment and I ran with it. I was a kid again in the big sandbox with REAL Tonka toys! I've enjoyed most all of it but the financial instability until I got over the hump. Life is the best it has ever been after many, many years of hard work and sacrifice. This was the right path for me. It is not for every one.

While I don't know a thing about union stuff, other than they are a pain in my butt on some jobs, the fact that he is interested in operating and THAT is a great thing. He's 17. I was not as safety conscious at 17 as I am now - I spent my free time at least doubling every speed limit sign on a motorcycle. Safety should come with maturity. If he has the attitude that, "what one man can do, so can another" then he will be successful. If you add fulfillment and enjoyment into that equation, he should be able to make a rewarding career out of it. If he is book smart as well, he might progress into self employment some day IF he has enough drive and passion to do as he pleases.

More important than leading a youth into an occupational direction is teaching them how to work and not be a pussy when the going gets tough. Get the job done no matter how difficult it is if you are being paid to work. Bosses don't want prima donnas at the job site. Most of today's youth is weak and few have a desire to work. If they can be molded into great workers, they will always have employment and cash on hand.

At 17, if he does well in the operator's union program but does not enjoy it, he will always have a fall-back occupation. It's more important to have alternate methods of occupation if the economy goes south. Experience in multiple occupations is a great thing to have in order to stay employed.

 

[thepumpguysc]

Characteristics of a good operator.?? One that checks the machine fluids before climbing into the seat..
U can’t b an operator if the engine blows up..+ it’ll probably impress the h outta the instructor...
And if he’s in a class with more than just him, it’ll trickle down to the other students..
Can u just see it.. 8 young men pulling the dipstick on an engine.!!!
what a beautiful site.!!!

 

[John C.]

Let him make his own mistakes and triumphs. What his interests are at 17 will likely have no relation to his interests at 21. Best you can do is to harass him into thinking about safety.

 

[777funk]

Thanks for the replies! Sounds like maybe I'm mistaken in my thinking that a pro jobsite is a race. He is what I observed to be pretty slow when we did rough backhoe work (trenching, digging out trees, septic, etc). However, when we did more finish type work requiring accurate depths and sloping drains, he did great (he is patient and attentive). He can learn just fine and his accuracy is great. He will likely never be a fast paced person. I just don't want him to waste a few years if his personality doesn't fit the work environment. Maybe he'll be fine.

 

[Welder Dave]

Adapting to the job at hand and being efficient is what makes a good operator. I can't count how many times I've seen people who think they are good operator hop in a skid steer and try to show off how fast they are. Not smooth and getting buckled around. Do that for an 8 hour shift and they can probably barely walk at the end of the day.
Your son is only 17, give him a chance before guessing what he's capable off. The fact he's interested is a huge bonus. A lot of 17 year olds have no idea what they want to do and aren't motivated to do much of anything anyways. They think everything should just be handed to them.

 

[777funk]

.....

The fact he's interested is a huge bonus. A lot of 17 year olds have no idea what they want to do and aren't motivated to do much of anything anyways. They think everything should just be handed to them.

Isn't this the truth! He's worked side by side with me and his brothers with shovels in hand long enough to have learned hard work is a part of life.
He will do well in work ethic. I'm proud of him for that!

I told him to give it a try and enjoy it. Be glad if he succeeds. Be honest with himself if it doesn't seem to be his strength and not to be discouraged. There are a thousand good ways to make an honest living that hell enjoy and that he'll find one.

 

[sled dog]

We were all slow and inefficient at one time. Speed comes with time in the seat. That he cares, and wants to learn is 90% of it. All of us oldtimers learned from old guys when we were pups. Now we are them. A young person that wants to learn? That's an old mans dream right there!!!

 

[AzIron]

It takes me a year to make a turn key guy out of a 20 year old that wants to be good so that's roughly 2000 hours and that is just make him productive and profitable it will be 2 more years before he is a master at digging plubming and he does that 8 to 10 hours a day so do the math

Speed comes with rythem more than anything

If he wants to have a career as an operator he needs to learn more than just a skid steer true backhoe operators are a dying breed that's a great machine to master always have work if you can run a backhoe

 

[Oldcatpusher]

He's 17. I quit high school then to move dirt and I didn't know my head from my ass. I loved the equipment just like him. Had my first Cat backhoe at 19. 31 now and still learning day to day but now I have a small fleet of paid off equipment. If he loves it stand behind him. Glad to see he has a father who pays attention cause I didn't.

 

[777funk]

He's 17. I quit high school then to move dirt and I didn't know my head from my ass. I loved the equipment just like him. Had my first Cat backhoe at 19. 31 now and still learning day to day but now I have a small fleet of paid off equipment. If he loves it stand behind him. Glad to see he has a father who pays attention cause I didn't.

I think you were smart to not waste time and to dive right in. I wish he could start now at 17 and finish school at his convenience. The union program hes interested in makes him wait to 18. I don't think he has the guts to try the self employed route (better in many ways). I like the training aspect of the union route. Never easier to be self taught than now though.

 

[Mike_IUOE]

If he gets into the apprenticeship program the instructors will teach him how to be productive. There's alot of jobs where speed is discouraged and safety is number one. Most industrial work they would rather you be slow and steady and the job completed safely rather than going in and cowboying the machine around. On the other hand there's jobs you're on where its go, go, go and you have to be fast and good. He'll figure it out.

 

[HardRockNM]

If he gets into the apprenticeship program the instructors will teach him how to be productive. There's alot of jobs where speed is discouraged and safety is number one. Most industrial work they would rather you be slow and steady and the job completed safely rather than going in and cowboying the machine around. On the other hand there's jobs you're on where its go, go, go and you have to be fast and good. He'll figure it out.

Exactly. It doesn't matter how fast you can throw the machine around if you cause damage that puts the job on hold for a day.

 

[Tyler d4c]

I cant speak on this in still a bit green.....

 

[skyking1]

Any union apprenticeship program co-ordinater will determine if he will get into the program.
If he does get in, his skills and the level of them will allow him to either to stay in the program or be ejected.
It's not about speed. It is about efficiency. An operator doesn't have to be super fast. But he has to be productive enough to satisfy his employer.
If anyone cannot do that they will have to find a different career.

I guess I am one of the few Terex Herder mentioned. The first time I ran track loader was in 1962. 43 years later I parked a 450H JD dozer the day I retired.

Me too, tinkerer. Big difference is I did other things for aboot 10 years in the middle

 

[RickW4]

It's all about the quality. I'm also a bit green but I make sure that I always get the job done!

 

[Flat Thunder Channel]

One thing I learned from a friend.... He is a trained and certified union operator. The majority of the older fellas he worked with are reluctant to share secrets of the trade. He had to learn the hard way while being criticized by the more seasoned operators. Maybe it's a localized to his specific job experience, but maybe it's normal?

I also learned from him having a CDL is helpful. He just completed his class A licensing. It helped on some random job sites and have him another career option.

Sounds like a fun and exciting time for him! I'm jealous. I knew everything at that age and continued to do so until about 25.