Cat d5m pro and con versus cat d5g. Looking for versatile rugged productive on budget

[Mountainmover]

Hello.
So I have been in the markert for a versatile 6 way blade Dozer.

We keep equipment for years and years and I am looking for the overall package.
By the word overall package, here is what I mean,

It has to be a good size that can do driveways, basements, and large jobs such as clearing, knocking down fill on larger fill sites.

Not too wide but wide enough to fill the gap between a compact track loader and a d6 size machine.
I use to have a use for a cat d3 size Dozer until the compact track loaders filled that gap in conjunction with compact excavators.

It needs to be rugged. Tough so that any operator can run it and it not be easily abused. I usually find a way to block out 3rd gear on older machines because I hate to see operators kick a Dozer in err verse and fly backwards wearing out the tracks etc....
It needs to be versatile and agile.

It needs to be easy to work on. Easy to fix out in the field. It should be common and familiar to the average heavy equipment operator.

Aftermarket parts should be widely available. This is why I like caterpillar. I want the option of choosing where I buy parts. I hate being stuck to a dealer with average wear components.

Easy to operate. OK, so I know that fingertip steering seems weird. I grew up running old cat dozers and jinks stuff even cable blade machines. I can probably run fingertip steering but....the average operator? Can I find a version that isn't fingertip? Is fingertip that bad? I assume hat fingertip is a regular steering clutch machine that will not push like a hydrostatic or diff steer machine in a curve right?

Long lasting. Is the high track machine still the king of high hour machine life? Seems as though they are on larger tractors. I need my machine to last a very long time....I hate to see cracked roller frames.....warped frames......etc...

Reasonable undercarriage costs.

Strong enough to angle the blade and push put roads around the side of mountains. Can push large stumps. Pull a sheep foot roller. Pull a house trailer into a site

I like the hydrostatic controls of a cat d5g or d5k. But the machine seems as though it isn't designed to last as long as a high drive tractor. Things look like they at hard to reach if you have a breakdown! The undercarriage stays packed up with mud in wet conditions. And how much will it cost to replace hydraulic motors and the main pump who it gets old? At what hour do I need to start expecting hydraulic failure on the drive system?

Thanks guys. I would consider Deere or komatsu....but I'm not so sure I'm the big picture. The 650h an above seems ok....a little hit more flimsy than the d5k and less productive than a d5m.
I wouldn't rule out a d6m or d6n....but Im on a budget and I already have d6d tractors.


Thanks guys.

 

[Construct'O]

I have a G model dozer ,main thing you will notice is that they don't have a equailzer bar they are welded solid.No give like e-bar machine.If you don't have the blade on the ground at all times then your in for a ride.M or N machine which ever,has a e-bar smoother ride alround.5 M models will be finger tip steer,diff steer wasn't until D6N. and D5N was still fingertip.

G model machine will be hydro-sta, which is okay.I just think for what you are expecting out of your machine you would be happier with the M or N model machine more robust through out.N model had a better cooling system on them then the M's.

If you want diff steer you will have to jump up to a D6N which also has a semi blade option if you wanted.I know you said you already had the D6D,so putting it out there.

If your fixed on having a 6-way dozer then i believe they have mentioned on the M model there is an update for the yoke arm on the 6 way that the old ones had issues with and there is a update on it that can be expensive. Good luck

 

[Mountainmover]

How to spot the upgraded blade triple tree or whatever you call it?

I have a G model dozer ,main thing you will notice is that they don't have a equailzer bar they are welded solid.No give like e-bar machine.If you don't have the blade on the ground at all times then your in for a ride.M or N machine which ever,has a e-bar smoother ride alround.5 M models will be finger tip steer,diff steer wasn't until D6N. and D5N was still fingertip.

G model machine will be hydro-sta, which is okay.I just think for what you are expecting out of your machine you would be happier with the M or N model machine more robust through out.N model had a better cooling system on them then the M's.

If you want diff steer you will have to jump up to a D6N which also has a semi blade option if you wanted.I know you said you already had the D6D,so putting it out there.

If your fixed on having a 6-way dozer then i believe they have mentioned on the M model there is an update for the yoke arm on the 6 way that the old ones had issues with and there is a update on it that can be expensive. Good luck

Thanks so much for the info.
What are the issues with fingertip steering ? I ran a few a few years back and because I'm accustomed to older steering clutch cat dozers it was fine to me . Weird but easier. Of course the hystat has the most control.....but hystat dozers.... What's the long term look like in repair when getting into high hours versus regular steering clutches or diff steer?

I saw a 2002 d5m for sale with regular steering clutch levers. Was the fingertip optional?

Can anyone post the proper pictures of the upgraded blade mount triple tree that I should be looking for? Is there a cat part number for the upgrade? Warranty covered?

What prices should I be looking at and what hour range means trouble?

Am I wrong in thinking that a d5m is gonna be longer lasting and more versatile?

What is the undercarriage replacement costs? What brands if undercarriage should I be straying from?

I'm pretty gentle in undercarriage. I tend to back up at moderate speeds, never turning tight.... Rarely spinning, always keeping it clean and I always pop rocks out of my way before walking over them.
But when buying used.....omg. Who knows the history??

Thanks for the help so far guys!

 

[JDOFMEMI]

For what you are talking about doing, I would go with the D-5M.
I have one, and am mostly happy with it. it has about 5,500 hrs on it, so I can't comment on the life, as that is still young. I will say the hystat machines seem to find trouble by then.
The 5M is strong, but not so much it overpowers the 6 way blade like the 6M will. I have pushed out trees and stumps with it I would not have expected a small tractor to handle.

I have only seen fingertip steering on them, I wonder what the deal was on the one you seen with old style levers?
The fingertip controls operate like the old, but with much less effort. You have to learn the feel for them, or else they will seem jerky. One thing I do when needing very fine steering control is to very slightly ride the brake pedal before pulling the clutch. It will help some, and if done only when needed, will not destroy the brake life.

Recent trouble with mine has come due to part of the trans wiring getting rubbed through, causing erratic shifts, then no shifting. That is a downside with any newer machine with electronic controls.
The weight and power of the D-5M makes it a good all around choice, in my opinion.

 

[Mountainmover]

Thank you

For what you are talking about doing, I would go with the D-5M.
I have one, and am mostly happy with it. it has about 5,500 hrs on it, so I can't comment on the life, as that is still young. I will say the hystat machines seem to find trouble by then.
The 5M is strong, but not so much it overpowers the 6 way blade like the 6M will. I have pushed out trees and stumps with it I would not have expected a small tractor to handle.

I have only seen fingertip steering on them, I wonder what the deal was on the one you seen with old style levers?
The fingertip controls operate like the old, but with much less effort. You have to learn the feel for them, or else they will seem jerky. One thing I do when needing very fine steering control is to very slightly ride the brake pedal before pulling the clutch. It will help some, and if done only when needed, will not destroy the brake life.

Recent trouble with mine has come due to part of the trans wiring getting rubbed through, causing erratic shifts, then no shifting. That is a downside with any newer machine with electronic controls.
The weight and power of the D-5M makes it a good all around choice, in my opinion.

Thank you for a good reply of advice.
You totally "get" what i was asking.

At what hours will the original undercarriage fail . At what hours will the second uc fail? Aftermarket price will uc be ?
I'm trying to shop to buy one. What year model and price am I looking for? At what hour range us it considers in good shape and what hour range is worn out?

I am in georgia clay mostly.

 

[JDOFMEMI]

Glad to help.
About the undercarriage, a lot depends on operating conditions and practices, but mine is still on the original everything at over 5,000 hrs. It is worn badly, but still serviceable.

There are some applications that will last longer, and some that won't last near that long, so local experience is needed.
As for condition, I would recommend that you decide what your budget is, then look for the best one in your range. I would worry about condition more than hours.

 

[Nige]

Jerry, does your D5 have the Heavy Duty undercarriage or System One..? I would always recommend HD undercarriage myself.

Regarding undercarriage it's very much a "you get what you pay for". Aftermarket is cheap and cheerful, OEM lasts better but costs more. Cost per operating hour generally nothing beats OEM in my experience and I've crunched enough numbers to know that's still the case today. Best way to overhaul undercarriage is wait for offers from your friendly Cat dealer if the Service Dept is a bit short of SWIP and needs to generate work.

 

[JDOFMEMI]

Nige

Mine is heavy duty. I am not sure about system one, but the new to me D-6T LGP I got this year has it, so I will be learning about it now, for better or worse.

I agree with you entirely that genuine Cat U/C is the best way to go. I have ran most others, and the best hourly cost by far is with Cat.

 

[D3DaveC]

I like my D5M LGP. I've had a D4G and D5G. Very nice for finishing but both had issues. The D5M looks like a machine I can fix myself. Perfect farm machine. In my opinion tougher than the G's I've owned.

 

[John C.]

I've seen lots of issues with M series dozers in the transmission electrical sensors. If you are looking at one, make sure there are no fault codes showing on the monitor and ask if the transmission speed sensor have ever been replaced. As I recall the transmission needs to come out to replace them. The N series dozers did not seem to have any of the issues that I've seen in the M's.

 

[CM1995]

I'll chime in with my $.02. Bought a D5G new 10 years ago and it's still a productive machine, putting new pads on now, it's the 3rd set. The chains were replaced under warranty in '05 or '06 at around 2500 hours don't remember the exact date but it was due to a Cat bulletin and a good PSR. The P&B's haven't been turned since then.

The tractor has 4700 hours on it and has been a good machine for what I need it to do but like Jerry said it's still young. Other than normal wear items - blade bushings, UC, some hydraulic hoses and a re-flash from the Cat tech, it's been a damn good machine.

It burns about the same amount of fuel per full working day as a T250 but can get more work done, depending on the conditions. It's a great tractor for finish grading and can move bulk dirt with proper slots - relative to it's size of course. We are a "run what you brung" operation so it has to fill many tasks on a job site.

I have also owned a D6N 6 way and it's a beast, really no comparison between the D5G and a D6N. The D6N will do everything fine grading wise as the D5G but will cost more to purchase and operate but of course will move more dirt. The D5 can be moved without permits if you position the blade just right, the D6N requires permits and an escort to move, at least in my area. Something to think about if you move often.

These types of questions are always hard to give advice on as we don't know your operating conditions or your typical job. I don't put a 6 way into heavy clearing that involves large trees or stumps, that's better left for track hoes, track loaders and larger C frame dozers.

 

[Seabass]

I ran a 5M for a few years, good solid machine. Apparently with the high track design you can service your transmission and planetarys with greater ease then a conventional low track design. Cant comment on a G series.

 

[Bluetop Man]

A high track D5 is one sweet machine to run. I echo everything CM1995 had to say above. One notable advantage of the high track fives was one heck of a lot less track flap compared to the larger dozers. I see by the CAT website the new fives only come with oval tracks. The oval track D5 and D6 machines really hit a sweet spot for lighter work before you get into the heavy production machines.

 

[ILLICEMAN]

While I have used Cat,s on the farm most of my life I now have a JD 750C II.It has been a great machine.Easy to control.Low fuel consumption,parts are easy to get and in some cases can be purchased on line.

 

[Mountainmover]

Pictures of the updated blade mount system for caterpillar d5m and part numbers?

Hello.
So I have been in the markert for a versatile 6 way blade Dozer.

We keep equipment for years and years and I am looking for the overall package.
By the word overall package, here is what I mean,

It has to be a good size that can do driveways, basements, and large jobs such as clearing, knocking down fill on larger fill sites.

Not too wide but wide enough to fill the gap between a compact track loader and a d6 size machine.
I use to have a use for a cat d3 size Dozer until the compact track loaders filled that gap in conjunction with compact excavators.

It needs to be rugged. Tough so that any operator can run it and it not be easily abused. I usually find a way to block out 3rd gear on older machines because I hate to see operators kick a Dozer in err verse and fly backwards wearing out the tracks etc....
It needs to be versatile and agile.

It needs to be easy to work on. Easy to fix out in the field. It should be common and familiar to the average heavy equipment operator.

Aftermarket parts should be widely available. This is why I like caterpillar. I want the option of choosing where I buy parts. I hate being stuck to a dealer with average wear components.

Easy to operate. OK, so I know that fingertip steering seems weird. I grew up running old cat dozers and jinks stuff even cable blade machines. I can probably run fingertip steering but....the average operator? Can I find a version that isn't fingertip? Is fingertip that bad? I assume hat fingertip is a regular steering clutch machine that will not push like a hydrostatic or diff steer machine in a curve right?

Long lasting. Is the high track machine still the king of high hour machine life? Seems as though they are on larger tractors. I need my machine to last a very long time....I hate to see cracked roller frames.....warped frames......etc...

Reasonable undercarriage costs.

Strong enough to angle the blade and push put roads around the side of mountains. Can push large stumps. Pull a sheep foot roller. Pull a house trailer into a site

I like the hydrostatic controls of a cat d5g or d5k. But the machine seems as though it isn't designed to last as long as a high drive tractor. Things look like they at hard to reach if you have a breakdown! The undercarriage stays packed up with mud in wet conditions. And how much will it cost to replace hydraulic motors and the main pump who it gets old? At what hour do I need to start expecting hydraulic failure on the drive system?

Thanks guys. I would consider Deere or komatsu....but I'm not so sure I'm the big picture. The 650h an above seems ok....a little hit more flimsy than the d5k and less productive than a d5m.
I wouldn't rule out a d6m or d6n....but Im on a budget and I already have d6d tractors.


Thanks guys.

Can someone please post pictures of the cat d5m blade mount update? Price? Part numbers? Pictures of old mount?
Thanks!

 

[LT-x7]

Here is some info on the blade pivot.
https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/showthread.php?34295-D5M-Blade-pivot

 

[Mountainmover]

Thanks for the link lt.

So, most people are still using the factory blade pivot unless they have pried against a big stump?