Biggest dozer to pull without having a CDL?

[fast_st]

Just pay the money to have it hauled and be done with it.

There is no way on God's Green Earth I would pull 20K behind a 1 ton dually from New Mexico to Arkansas. Even if the truck could safely handle the load it's all the 4 wheelers tic-tocking, fb'ing, eating and doing everything else but have their concentration on the road that's the real problem. I drive amongst these fools everyday.

Heh, I agree if you're not 200% comfortable, a hauling service is the way to go.
I had to bail out of CA during the crash, couldn't find a uhaul truck anyplace within 1000 miles, everyone had the same idea. I had my 89 F250 with a 4.9 5 speed, 330k miles. Plenty of extra springs from being back east and hauling a slide in 2 yd sand spreader. Added a gooseneck and found a trailer local, 25 foot with a beavertail flat deck. Built some sides and loaded up all my stuff to move out. The performance of the truck was dismal, it'd pull 52 mph on the flat and I'm heading from CA to MA. The day I left was 9/11 so all the construction sites and dot spots were vacant and abandoned. I rolled over a scale in Reno to see about 28k combined weight, oops. I had been adding air to tires to keep the temperatures in check, decently over-inflated tires but they were running under 120f. Drive axles and bearing temps all seemed happy at every gas stop. The trip was slow but uneventful, that 4.9 ran 12+ hour days at full throttle and never a complaint. Still have the truck and trailer!

I should have called a moving company!

 

[Montecresto]

You might get by with lots of stuff.

But if you go out and wheel pack a school bus they are going to hold you to the letter of the law.

The law is federal and supersedes all state laws.

A cdl is required for any vehicle or combination of vehicles with a carrying capacity over 10,000.

My 1 ton Dodge dually has 14,000
So are you saying all the rednecks riding around in these Dodge one tons with HO engines and Aisin transmission’s towing nothing with their mirrors folded out are required to have a CDL…..

 

[Montecresto]

A five axle highway tractor trailer can gross 80,000 anywhere in the US. The truck is 46-47k, the trailer is 33-34k. The truck might weigh 18k by itself, but then it takes another 1.5 times it's own weight from the trailer.

Yeah, and my point is that they are very unsafe, and these days those trucks will run 80 mph down the highway and do, following each other and other vehicles at distances that they could never respond to, constantly impeding the passing lane (out west here the interstates only have two lanes) and if anything happens they’re not stopping, they are going to jackknife, flip etc…

 

[DMiller]

I would be surprised if DMV has a chart of tow rating for each truck. Whether you are exceeding your tow rating would have to be extreme if DMV were to pursue that fine. They have others. Vermont says any trailer over 10,000 LBS requires CDL. A few pages later, the truck actual weight plus trailer rated weight must be over 26000 to require CDL.
I drove a truck titled 25999 with air brakes a number of years. No fine, I don't know if they could have. I then got a class A CDL. I don't believe I am limited as to tow rating. I've questioned, haven't got an answer. If I exceed trailer GVWR, I get a violation. If I exceed rear axle rating of the truck I get a violation. No one seems able to tell me the tow rating of my truck.

Mo DOT Brownshirts do, nearly every manufacturer has provided OEM By S/N stats as to GCWR GVWR. Seen the Laptop Database in use, removing tags or labels does no good except to add Over Weight to Tires, Axles, Suspension as the DOT boys and Girls can write up.

 

[Montecresto]

I thought they mostly go by the tire ratings. Doesn't matter what a sticker says if the tires aren't adequate. This appears to be a case of someone asking a question and not liking the answers so they somehow try to change the narrative to suit their way of thinking. 26,500lbs. behind a 1 ton is a bad idea.

I think raising the tires issue is a valid point and must be looked at. But I don’t think I’ve changed a narrative. But no, you’re right that I don’t like the answers. Here as all other forums that I’ve posted the question the answers vary significantly. It’s like tacking my box of tax papers to 10 different CPA’s and asking them to file my taxes and getting it back from each one with ten different results on deductions, what I owe etc. same thing taking a legal question to ten different attorneys and getting 10 different answers……

 

[DMiller]

Yes, but not because my load won’t be legal. The manufacturers stickers on the truck and trailer cover my load. Of course there’s apparently a conflict on the whole sticker issue…..

Explain that to a DOT person and see how it flies, Lead balloons do not bode well.

DOT here is applying pressure on all manner of Hot Shot style transport since have had numbers of incidents Overweight, Overloaded to GCWR, Tire Failures, Axle Failures and lives threatened.

Do not listen to anyone just take off and do it your way, Your Cash, Your License, YOUR insurance. Pays your Money Takes your Chances.

 

[Montecresto]

I dont see the problem, Im legal at 25800, why wouldn't you want me on the road.

According to what, the sticker on the door jamb or trailer with a number on it that the manufacturer pulled out of their ass that DOT is going to check to see that you’ve loaded according to……

 

[Montecresto]

Mo DOT Brownshirts do, nearly every manufacturer has provided OEM By S/N stats as to GCWR GVWR. Seen the Laptop Database in use, removing tags or labels does no good except to add Over Weight to Tires, Axles, Suspension as the DOT boys and Girls can write up.

Wish the sticker on the truck had a GCWR. Why is it all so difficult. If it’s that damn important why is it that forum after forum, these discussions go on page after page and there is NO consensus, even arguments, sometimes fights leading to moderators shutting down threads as is even the case on one thread in this forum…..

I’ve got a truck and trailer with manufactures data which covers my load and I’ll move my equipment when I get ready to as I have 2-3 times in the past. That’s over a 15 year period. I’m not out there on a regular basis moving heavy equipment for others for hire.

 

[Montecresto]

Explain that to a DOT person and see how it flies, Lead balloons do not bode well.

DOT here is applying pressure on all manner of Hot Shot style transport since have had numbers of incidents Overweight, Overloaded to GCWR, Tire Failures, Axle Failures and lives threatened.

Do not listen to anyone just take off and do it your way, Your Cash, Your License, YOUR insurance. Pays your Money Takes your Chances.

Explain what to DOT? That my load complies with the manufacturer’s data on the stickers that NTSB requires manufacturers to affix to vehicles so that we know what our load limits are……

 

[Montecresto]

Explain that to a DOT person and see how it flies, Lead balloons do not bode well.

DOT here is applying pressure on all manner of Hot Shot style transport since have had numbers of incidents Overweight, Overloaded to GCWR, Tire Failures, Axle Failures and lives threatened.

Do not listen to anyone just take off and do it your way, Your Cash, Your License, YOUR insurance. Pays your Money Takes your Chances.

And again, I move my equipment once every few years. I’m NOT commercial, I’m NOT a hotshot driver……‍♂️

 

[skyking1]

I think raising the tires issue is a valid point and must be looked at. But I don’t think I’ve changed a narrative. But no, you’re right that I don’t like the answers. Here as all other forums that I’ve posted the question the answers vary significantly. It’s like tacking my box of tax papers to 10 different CPA’s and asking them to file my taxes and getting it back from each one with ten different results on deductions, what I owe etc. same thing taking a legal question to ten different attorneys and getting 10 different answers……

The common answer is, you will be at the mercy of the DOT guy who gets you in his sights and HIS interpretation. Everybody says ask DOT 6 times and get 6 different answers, so you can see the problem.
My issue is this: I have pulled heavy trailers with electric brakes, and I have had something happen, a loose plug or whatever and was on the highway at full speed with no trailer brakes. They worked when I hooked up and checked the brakes, and then they didn't. It is just 1 wire in a plug.
There is no alert or chime or red light, no clue unless you look at the brake controller and see the little "N.C".
There is no alternative method, no hand brake lever, nothing. It's just you and a heavy trailer and only the truck brakes now, no fun at all.
Compare that to air brakes.
I hook them up and check them. If a hose pops off or breaks, the whole rig is coming to a stop. If the air pressure gets too low I get a light and an alarm in my view. I don't deal with that and the whole rig is coming to a stop.
On the electric brake rig, a wire or connector gets loose and the whole rig comes to a go go go baby.

 

[Montecresto]

Explain that to a DOT person and see how it flies, Lead balloons do not bode well.

DOT here is applying pressure on all manner of Hot Shot style transport since have had numbers of incidents Overweight, Overloaded to GCWR, Tire Failures, Axle Failures and lives threatened.

Do not listen to anyone just take off and do it your way, Your Cash, Your License, YOUR insurance. Pays your Money Takes your Chances.

If I did listen to someone, which poster would I listen to? You guys are all getting butt hurt here, yet you can’t even agree or all come to a consensus on this yourselves. And that’s not just here. Go to Facebook or any other heavy equipment forum and look at these discussions, it’s freakin ridiculous the amount of disagreement and bullshit one has to wade through only to get nowhere….

 

[Montecresto]

The common answer is, you will be at the mercy of the DOT guy who gets you in his sights and HIS interpretation. Everybody says ask DOT 6 times and get 6 different answers, so you can see the problem.
My issue is this: I have pulled heavy trailers with electric brakes, and I have had something happen, a loose plug or whatever and was on the highway at full speed with no trailer brakes. They worked when I hooked up and checked the brakes, and then they didn't. It is just 1 wire in a plug.
There is no alert or chime or red light, no clue unless you look at the brake controller and see the little "N.C".
There is no alternative method, no hand brake lever, nothing. It's just you and a heavy trailer and only the truck brakes now, no fun at all.
Compare that to air brakes.
I hook them up and check them. If a hose pops off or breaks, the whole rig is coming to a stop. If the air pressure gets too low I get a light and an alarm in my view. I don't deal with that and the whole rig is coming to a stop.
On the electric brake rig, a wire or connector gets loose and the whole rig comes to a go go go baby.

I believe your first sentence is likely accurate….but I’m also betting that if my load is within the limits of the manufacturers posted data, I win in court if DOT tickets me…

Also, I don’t travel “full speed” when moving my equipment. I back road it and take my time. As to trailer breaks, I squeeze the two levers on the trailer brake controller together regularly to check them, at slow speed, you can feel the trailer pull. Also, if there is a problem in the wiring, the dash message says “no trailer connected” when you squeeze them. Well of course there IS a trailer connected, and I’m looking at it in the mirror….‍ So that is indication of a problem as well….

 

[skyking1]

so why ask? As one of the other posters here would say, nothing will happen, you'll get there OK, never see a DOT guy and this is the normal thing now.
If you get in a fender bender or get pulled over and sidelined, have to park it and hire a haul, winning in court will be a moot point. They say park it you park it.
A few weeks later you get your ticket thrown out, but what have you done in the meantime?
I weigh all that above with hiring a haul and I cannot see what the hassle is of hiring the haul in the first place. Professional outfits do it all the time. It is part of doing business.

 

[CM1995]

My 1 ton Dodge dually has 14,000
So are you saying all the rednecks riding around in these Dodge one tons with HO engines and Aisin transmission’s towing nothing with their mirrors folded out are required to have a CDL…..

According to what, the sticker on the door jamb or trailer with a number on it that the manufacturer pulled out of their ass that DOT is going to check to see that you’ve loaded according to……

The last time the two posters you quoted above were on HEF was 2016 and 2017 respectfully so you probably will not get a response from StxRancher nor Heavey Metal.

If I did listen to someone, which poster would I listen to? You guys are all getting butt hurt here, yet you can’t even agree all come to a consensus on this yourselves.

Currently you seem the only one getting "butthurt" since you've asked a question and the consensus is don't do it.

 

[Montecresto]

The common answer is, you will be at the mercy of the DOT guy who gets you in his sights and HIS interpretation. Everybody says ask DOT 6 times and get 6 different answers, so you can see the problem.
My issue is this: I have pulled heavy trailers with electric brakes, and I have had something happen, a loose plug or whatever and was on the highway at full speed with no trailer brakes. They worked when I hooked up and checked the brakes, and then they didn't. It is just 1 wire in a plug.
There is no alert or chime or red light, no clue unless you look at the brake controller and see the little "N.C".
There is no alternative method, no hand brake lever, nothing. It's just you and a heavy trailer and only the truck brakes now, no fun at all.
Compare that to air brakes.
I hook them up and check them. If a hose pops off or breaks, the whole rig is coming to a stop. If the air pressure gets too low I get a light and an alarm in my view. I don't deal with that and the whole rig is coming to a stop.
On the electric brake rig, a wire or connector gets loose and the whole rig comes to a go go go baby.

Yeah, pretty damn unacceptable that the “law” is so confusing that the DOT brownshirts don’t even understand it and asking six DOT inspectors will net you 6 diffent answers…..

 

[fast_st]

If I did listen to someone, which poster would I listen to? You guys are all getting butt hurt here, yet you can’t even agree all come to a consensus on this yourselves. And that’s not just here. Go to Facebook or any other heavy equipment forum and look at these discussions, it freakin ridiculous the amount of disagreement and bullshit one has to wade through only to get nowhere….

I think everyone agrees that there is 'no consensus' At the time I ran my own crap coast to coast, I called my home state police truck team and spoke with the LT on duty, I knew I was heavy and was told at the time, 2001, if its your personal property and not part of a business transaction, you are exempt from CDL requirements in this state' Now I had that piece of paper and the LT's cell phone number with me for the trip (for state reciprocity). Now DOT would have had my ass over the coals as I was way over the sidewall and axle ratings on truck and trailer, all of them.

There are a lot of 'Depends' which is and is not an answer. The feeling is that if you're within axle and tire ratings, manufacturers towing rating be damned. (who has the picture of a dually and pintle ring towing a 53 foot box on a dolly)

 

[Junkyard]

What’s a win in your mind? The absolute best is they drop tickets. You will be out your time, any expenses and believe me now they’re gonna watch for you to make any little infraction. It’s what they do.

We’re all speaking from direct experience. It seems to me that the answers you’re getting aren’t what you seek. I can tell you from experience that most states look at GVW of truck and trailer. Add those up and if they exceed 26001 you’re in CDL territory. How and when they choose to enforce that is up to them. Every single solitary law or rule is subject to their mood or discretion. That’s what makes it hard to give you advice or direction.

Having run all 48 and some of Canada with big trailers I’ve met some great officers and some royal douches. You can argue, cite laws, reference other forums or whatever you want. We’re trying to give firsthand experience, possibly save a major headache or worse.

It’s interesting to me that you came here seeking advice and seem to want to argue and contradict most of it. We didn’t catch you at the fuel stop and start picking apart your rig or questioning your license. There isn’t really a straightforward answer to your questions. It is 100% at the mercy of whoever stops you.

 

[Montecresto]

so why ask? As one of the other posters here would say, nothing will happen, you'll get there OK, never see a DOT guy and this is the normal thing now.
If you get in a fender bender or get pulled over and sidelined, have to park it and hire a haul, winning in court will be a moot point. They say park it you park it.
A few weeks later you get your ticket thrown out, but what have you done in the meantime?
I weigh all that above with hiring a haul and I cannot see what the hassle is of hiring the haul in the first place. Professional outfits do it all the time. It is part of doing business.

Why ask. I suppose that one might expect that in time, the confusion gets remedied and all 6 DOT inspectors understand the regulations they are enforcing and we finally all know that the manufacturers sticker on trucks and trailers is accurate and these forum threads are no longer necessary. But apparently not….

 

[Montecresto]

I think everyone agrees that there is 'no consensus' At the time I ran my own crap coast to coast, I called my home state police truck team and spoke with the LT on duty, I knew I was heavy and was told at the time, 2001, if its your personal property and not part of a business transaction, you are exempt from CDL requirements in this state' Now I had that piece of paper and the LT's cell phone number with me for the trip (for state reciprocity). Now DOT would have had my ass over the coals as I was way over the sidewall and axle ratings on truck and trailer, all of them.

There are a lot of 'Depends' which is and is not an answer. The feeling is that if you're within axle and tire ratings, manufacturers towing rating be damned. (who has the picture of a dually and pintle ring towing a 53 foot box on a dolly)

Yeah, see, you were running your crap coast to coast. There’s a big disconnect here and every other forum on this subject. You’ve got the guy like me that moves something once every few years, that gets piled on by all the CDL guys moving heavy loads down the interstate daily with all kinds of personal experiences and it never seems to get separated. I can assure you that if I was a commercial driver, hauling equipment for OTHERS at a fee, I’d have a commercial license, I’d have a tractor and flatbed, and I’d have the maximum limits on insurance, and not just on truck and trailer, but the clients equipment, and a liability policy for my company that would be an LLC……‍♂️