Originally Posted by DGODGR
Digging the "steeps" will be easier from the top down. You can use a pile of dirt (pushing it with the loader) to help control your decent. The machine will also stay put while digging (machine will have a tendancy to pull itself down the hill if you try to dig from the bottom up). The downside is that you will be pulling your backfill down the hill as you dig. Be cognisent of this and place your spoils as far up hill as possible.
That was my original plan, top to bottom with loader bucket pointing downhill. The dirt pile idea is sounding real good. I will try to keep the spoils high up.
I would not use the "whole hog" (also known as a power mole) if it is rocky.
There may not be any/many rocks in the bottom land where the creeks are. It could be an option. As soon as I start up the hill the difference is night and day as far as rocky terrain. It would be nice to get through my neighbors creeks without disturbing them.
If you do use one you will also have to use it to pull the pipe through the hole (you can't just push it through).
Pull the conduit through? Like hold the device in the air (with tension) and use it like a pneumatic slide hammer? How does one attatch it to the conduit?
If the ground is muddy the hole hog will lose efficiency due to the suction created by the moisture in the dirt. It will also have a tendancy to go deep if it even works at all. To attach the pipe to the hog you will need an additional tip that will be a loop. You will have to cut some triangles out of the end of the conduit so that you can tape the end to a point (duct tape works well). tie a rope to the loop (on the end of the hog) and then use several "half hitches" to secure the rope to the pipe. The tail end of the rope should be taped to the conduit to ensure that the pulling tension, on the rope, will squeeze the pipe through the half hitches. The hole hog will have reverse (you just twist the hose until it locks into reverse) and you will use it to pull the conduit through. Be sure to glue all the joints (that you are going to pull through) well in advance of the pull. This will give the glue time to fully set up so they, hopefully, won't pull apart during the pull.
I would also suggest "roping the pipe" instead of using the 22-1/4 degree bends. PVC will bend (3" easier than 4").
Do you suggest I go with 4". I can use either size.
There are pros and cons to both. Here's how I see them. The 4" pipe will be better for the guys who are pulling the wire. It will also cost more (noticeably), for the pipe and the additional glue, and be more difficult to install. If you are using the hole hog you will need a larger unit to make a larger hole. If you are trenching than you will need 6" wide trencher segments to fit the pipe in the trench. If you are not pulling the wire, I see no real advantage, to you, to use the 4" pipe.
If you have warm sunny days you can employ a "solar bender". Take a joint of pipe and place on end in an elevated position (lean it on a tree, on a fence, or a rock, truck...most anything will do) with the middle unsupported. As the direct sunlight warms the conduit it will begin to sag in the middle. This will shape your bend. Simply rotate the conduit so that the bend is in the same direction as the curve in your trench.
I like this idea! I have also heard of heated conduit benders. Maybe something else I could rent if needed?
You might be able to rent them but I have never used them directly. They will also have a learning curve (you can heat the pipe too much) and I think you already have enough on your plate.
Since you are going "across country" I would assume that you have plenty of room to make the gradual bends. Sharper turns equal more friction during the pull.
Well, yes and no. I need to follow a grass road as closely as possible. The 10' wide ROW runs along the side of this road. It's a real mess at the start of this run because I have the pole, a creek, and the need to get on the other side of the road as quickly as possible because of a buried barn that is not very deep in the ground. A solar bend or heater should do the trick though.
The 20' joints will bend MUCH easier than the 10 footers and the shorter joints probably won't have enough weight to "solar bend".
20' joints it is!
I would tend to agree with the opinion that the 800' pull is too long. That being said the designer is an engineer and they (power company) do this all the time. I would assume that they will employ the use of a power tugger and LOTS of lube. We also don't know the cable size but, again, the engineer should have all of this data taken into account. The only real variable is your trench quality.
She told me they have to keep the pulls under 1000'
I also recommend that you go deep early, at your creek crossings, and not use 22-1/4 bends.
Will do.
Damming of the creek will be the ticket but I would bet that you still will have subterranian water intrusion. I suggest that you have the pipe ready and glued together before you dig the crossing (however much pipe you need to get across the creek and back into dry ground).
One 20' section will easily span the creek depressions.
If you have water in the ditch, and it's deep enough, it will float the pipe. Be ready to have a helper weight the pipe until you can get some dirt on it.
IMO you should be able to keep the conduit dry if you use glue AND primer. The 20' joints are a must. Everything about this job will be twice as hard if you use 10' sticks. I also recommend a brush dobber instead of the crap foam ones that come in the can. They won't break off, like the foam ones, and they hold much more glue. They will apply the glue 3 to 4 times faster. More glue on the joint equals less effort to push it together. You can also save money by buying glue by the gallon instead of the quart. Be sure to hold pressure to the joint for few seconds after fitting it together.There will be hydraulic pressure in the joint (because there is glue between the two pieces of plastic) until it sets up enough to over come the force trying to push the joint apart.
Will do. I'm an anal retentive obsessive compulsive machinist mechanical electrical engineer. My joints will be right or I won't be able to sleep at night
Always install the pipe from the bottom up on slopes. Otherwise gravity can pull them apart and you may not notice it until you can't make the pull.
I'm backfilling as I go because this is a weekend project. I need to dig down the hill. Will the backfill take care of this problem?
It will probably work but I still don't see why you can't dig from the top down then lay the pipe and backfill from the bottom up. You are not going to be able to reach the whole 20' stick to backfill it anyway.
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