Who builds the best Skid Steer and Why

dave esterns said:

. the bobcat is well a bobcat. They are super reliable durable high quality simple machines that you can depend on with your life. Since we probably won't put too many hours on a second machine I would not be surprised if we keep it for 20 years with no problems. At the end of the day the bobcat hand foot controls are the superior way to control your machine. Although I feel I can keep up to the average bobcat driving speed with joysticks, if I'm in a hurry I can run circles around a joystick machine if I'm in the bobcat. Another reason we purchased hand foot is because I am apparently the only farmer in the county capable of learning how to drive a joystick machine. And me being the only person who knows how to drive the skid steer is problematic at best. That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if they have some bugs to work out of the doosan engine that may temporarily effect their reliability.

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Reading your comments makes me wonder. I know a grading contractor near me that has 4 tracked bobcat machines. 3 of them have turned into part machines. His comments to me were they had computer issues and that the security and drive systems were a pain once they got some hours on them. The cost for the new control panel parts was too high and the machines were eating the boards. He was looking for a work around so that he did not need to spend $1000.00's for harnesses and computer control crap.

I have not been in any foot control machine on the market, that can run circles around a high horsepower case joy stick machine. After diving my case, a foot control bobcat feels like a old slow goat. The case also has a great deal of quick fine control. Sorry don't mean to call you out, I have used both. I get so upset when I have to get a rental it can add hours to the job. Lately I have been on 4 jobs that the owners had there own skids. I was allowed use of them and I was contracted to build them a building pad. Leveling a building spot can be more than an average user can do. I always bring my own machine because we are 1! It is a special feeling to get called in to complete machine work when they could have done it them selves. I run high rates and don't cut my prices. But I can grade to within about 3\4s of an inch and I can save lots of concrete and also make sure it is thick enough which is important. I do not use lasers or gps. String lines and eye.

this may sound crazy but if one tire has a different pressure I know. It screws up my grading. I can almost run at max speed building a pad. I slow done when men are near but other than that it is balls out.

But my case now has 1400 hrs and the control boards have failed. It is easy enough to by pass the safeties on the older machines, but the danger use level goes way up and you loose the parking brake when you by pass the boards. Difference is mine is still making money and not collecting dust, but I wish I had time to put it down to fix.it.

Case machines are loud and I wear earplugs, but mostly due to the backup alarm.

After watching those videos, I had a quick feeling that i really can not operate. There is no way I have that level of smooth slow control. Then I remembered why I do not like the hand and foot controls. In work application I seem to be better just using my hands. It really gets pronounced when you start hitting bumps. I can not even keep my feet in place sometimes. I use my whole body to ride the machine, changing direction and gravity makes it harder to control with your feet. That is the difference!

I would imagine that you can't squeeze much more work and speed out of a machine than I do. The average user will not probably know the difference. I do not ever work by the hour. I work by the job so I haul tail to get in and then out.

For those wondering what I think the best machine is, my answer is I do not know. I know how mine could be improved but it is no longer made. The new machines went in the wrong direction for me. Cheap, simple, strong, over built and easy to work on. I like parts that work on several things and I like being able to find parts and hose fittings any where. I hate waiting for special fittings and I do not like how the companies have a part made by another company then make it so that you must order this pulley or that part only through the retailer.

Case burnt my ass with the drive motors on the 75xt. They put in motors that could not be rebuilt and they were not strong enough to last. The replacements cost 5000 dollars and are supposed to be improved versions. They are leaking into the chain boxes again. I tried getting the first set rebuilt, due to the design the rebuild did not last and I blew them up with in 8 hours. Double labor. 700 hours out of drive motors is a joke.

i have said it before. case had something with their old school skid steers. its really too bad they are gone. so what models specifically are you referring to from bobcat and case. i haven't driven too many case machines, sv185, 420, 40xt, 90xt, 465: i don't remember any of them being excessively quick. the 90xt i think had fast cycle times, the 465 was terrible. i don't see how case can be more quick if your hand has a direct link to the hydro on the bobcat. if you are saying case is more uncontrollable on the drive i can see what you mean! you do get more action from less throw... there is nothing i can't do with hand foot controls; the whole not being able to remain planted is simply not true. if it really gets that bumpy you can stand while you drive.

so it sounds like your buddy with the bobcats has all the options on them. i am referring to ones with no options, cuz options cause problems. and ctls are really not my specialty. we have been running bobcats for 45 years and have never had any major problems. we had 2 engines go out at 7000 hours years ago. one was a little 3 cylinder deutz and i don't know what the other was. on the other hand our old international skid steer was a nightmare.

I worked on Case skid steers for 6 years and they are very easy to maintain, they are built with great componentry and last a long time provided you maintain them reasonably well. They are also great value for money and if you change them over every 4000 hours you will do well out of them

Sincerely

Bulldog

my prediction is that one of the major manufacturers is going to adopt this technology soon. obviously jcb has thought about it...

http://forums.dhsdiecast.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=125779

For the guy that is a expert at driving on two wheels !!! not sure how often I could get paid for that and I would have nothing but tracks. I have rented Bobcat's many other skid steers I have not ben on all of them but in all the ones worked the Takeuchi 140 is a beast (81hp) and one great machine. I know many rental places are changing to Takeuchi and I am buying a Takeuchi 150 ( 98hp ) this year as I sell some land that I don't need. If you have not been on one you should try it for a day. Now if you like showing off at birthday parties then buy a bobcat.

Do this on two wheels https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbJUtHqzbR4

Captain Mike said:

For the guy that is a expert at driving on two wheels !!! not sure how often I could get paid for that and I would have nothing but tracks. I have rented Bobcat's many other skid steers I have not ben on all of them but in all the ones worked the Takeuchi 140 is a beast (81hp) and one great machine. I know many rental places are changing to Takeuchi and I am buying a Takeuchi 150 ( 98hp ) this year as I sell some land that I don't need. If you have not been on one you should try it for a day. Now if you like showing off at birthday parties then buy a bobcat.

Do this on two wheels https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbJUtHqzbR4

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I have a tl-150 also. It is a good machine if your work is big enough for it. Most residential work is not big enough and a smaller lighter and easier to see out of machine, like a tl130 would be better. Moving around 12,000 to 14,000 lbs, uses way more fuel and tears up more. But if you are not in tight areas , it is a beast.

dave esterns said:

i have said it before. case had something with their old school skid steers. its really too bad they are gone. so what models specifically are you referring to from bobcat and case. i haven't driven too many case machines, sv185, 420, 40xt, 90xt, 465: i don't remember any of them being excessively quick. the 90xt i think had fast cycle times, the 465 was terrible. i don't see how case can be more quick if your hand has a direct link to the hydro on the bobcat. if you are saying case is more uncontrollable on the drive i can see what you mean! you do get more action from less throw... there is nothing i can't do with hand foot controls; the whole not being able to remain planted is simply not true. if it really gets that bumpy you can stand while you drive.

so it sounds like your buddy with the bobcats has all the options on them. i am referring to ones with no options, cuz options cause problems. and ctls are really not my specialty. we have been running bobcats for 45 years and have never had any major problems. we had 2 engines go out at 7000 hours years ago. one was a little 3 cylinder deutz and i don't know what the other was. on the other hand our old international skid steer was a nightmare.

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On the 75xt I use, the joysticks are less fatiguing to use than the older Bobcat's. Also Case for a long while seemed to have more HP per lb of machine weight. In reality, most guys probably think what they have is best and they get used to using it. Although for me, I jump between a tl150, cat 953, case 75xt and a tl145 quite frequently and must be able to get production done in order to move our jobs along. Every job start I am equalizing tire pressure to keep the machine grading the same.

I run a concrete crew and I am the one that gets the concrete bill so a 1" on grading matters to me at the end of the day. It is very hard for me to switch over to a bobcat machine using the other joystick machines, I can do it but it is almost like learning to walk again or something similar.

As far as who makes the best machine overall it is hard to say. To many things go into that, including ease of repairs and replacement part cost. Tak has really jumped up on the repair part costs and 100k for a tl12 is cat type money and everyone knows they have 1000% markup on some of their parts .

For the record though my guys like the tl150. The saying is "this is a very specialized machine, made for grading and it will make the dirt flat faster". They just aren't all ways on site for the demo and clean ups which is the day before the forming starts type work. The case is nimble easy to pull and easy to see out of, and it digs pretty good for its size and tires are way cheaper than tracks.

I would love to see some more opinions on this topic!

I'll take pilots or E/H controls over mechanical any day of the week, I have put quite a few hours on older machines, Gehl's, Hydra Mac's, the odd bobcat here and there, and in no way are mechanical controls fast or even that smooth. I really wish there was a way to put true pilot controls in our Cat 215 excavator instead of the pos spool/linkage controls it has now.

I have used most brands of skid steer and here is my take. Bobcat makes a solid machine but all of its safeties makes it unpractical if you have to get in and out of it. Cat older controls were horrible so I never cared much for the machine. My favorite that I have run is a tachahuchi. Ton of power and no annoying safeties like the bobcat. I don't live near a dealer so myself I will go with a case. Also avoid john deer as they have had lots of transmission problems with some of their models

Mustang

Lil' Puss said:

CAT! If you have to ask why then you don't understand. Nobody's machine is perfect, and they break - not a matter of "IF" but "WHEN".
With a question like that the OP will ultimately get a high score for every machine ever built because every owner/operator has different skill sets and all are not equal.
So, I must ask the OP: Do you own/operate a skid steer? If not, do you intend to purchase one? Have you any experience operating one? Do/would you do your own maintenance or take it to a professional shop/dealer? I'm thinking you will be able to get a more accurate assessment by asking a direct question.

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It's all about RESALE. I bought a 287B, ran the paint off of it, never spent a dime on repairs and sold it 10 year later for 5K less than I paid for it.

Please show me another skid steer that you can run hard for 10 years and only cost you the equivalent of $500.00 a year.

kendall69 said:

It's all about RESALE. I bought a 287B, ran the paint off of it, never spent a dime on repairs and sold it 10 year later for 5K less than I paid for it.

Please show me another skid steer that you can run hard for 10 years and only cost you the equivalent of $500.00 a year.

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Ten years with zero repair costs? Unless you only ran it 10 hours a year, you should go buy a lottery ticket cuz you have some really good luck!

JNB said:

Ten years with zero repair costs? Unless you only ran it 10 hours a year, you should go buy a lottery ticket cuz you have some really good luck!

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The ASV undercarriages on those MTL made up some of the highest maintenance machines ever released. They were so fragile the you could not even rent them from CAT in this area. They would rent you a CAT wheeled machine with the VTS system, but they would not rent you an MTL. Either the machine was never run or your adding machine forgot to carry a 1.

The 2 closest dealers to me, which is important when deciding to buy a machine, are John Deere and Kubota, I am gonna buy a skid steer here soon, i have only operated cat's. Which out of the 2 mentioned would be best to go with?

5 acre Acreage, all in trees, fairly soft usually.
New build
Lots of dirt moving and grading of yard
Gravel Road maintenance
Trenching
Landscaping
Snow removal(lots of snow up here in northern Alberta)

Was hoping to get away with a wheeled unit, way cheaper to maintain and operate.

TIA

cdika17 said:

The 2 closest dealers to me, which is important when deciding to buy a machine, are John Deere and Kubota, I am gonna buy a skid steer here soon, i have only operated cat's. Which out of the 2 mentioned would be best to go with?

5 acre Acreage, all in trees, fairly soft usually.
New build
Lots of dirt moving and grading of yard
Gravel Road maintenance
Trenching
Landscaping
Snow removal(lots of snow up here in northern Alberta)

Was hoping to get away with a wheeled unit, way cheaper to maintain and operate.

TIA

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I'd stay away from kubota.. to many issues with welds, friend of mines fixed more kubota units then I've ever thought possible, always see orange pieces in the shop.. right from the kubota dealer .. brand new.. another buddy had already welded on his svl75 multiple places.


That being said in just orderd myself a 333g pretty optioned out.. should be here Nov 1

I have heard so much good about the Kubota skids. They have the best warranty and the best insurance normally have the best intrest rate too. I now have 5 Bobcats because of the local dealer. They are great.

I have similar question, im old school excavator, op. but a job ill be doing in future requires lots of forklift unloading, some grading. Excavator is clumsy with forks, so track skidstear would be better ?

I have done a fair bit of dirt/rock work with skid steer as well as moving palletized materials with both a skid steer and a fork lift.

The skid steer is very clumsy with pallet forks, jerking and bouncing around and not staying level as you go up and down, compared to a proper fork lift.

If you can find a way to get a real fork lift for that part of the job it would be very nice. Although I can understand the desire to have one machine on the job. And if the ground is rough a fork lift does not do so well. We also had some good success with the baby Genie telehandler with a Bobcat style bucket on it for digging and grading and such. Although it was the boss's toy and not necessarily a good idea.