DPete
Senior Member
To add to the confusion the local Cat dealer said they were using 15-40w as fill in their shop . We still have hyd oil in our machines, I don't know what's right??
Well...we were talking about hydraulics,but you brought wet multidisk brakes into the mix,which are hydro actuated,but do not run In the hydraulic oil. Deere brakes run in J20 spec oil.If you sincerly believe that is the case why do we have Engine Oil,Hydraulic Oil and Gear Oil.......and not just Oil?
Hydraulic Oils have Friction Modifiers for very small clearances inside Pumps and Add Packs with Elements to keep the Oil Film Stable at Temperature.
Engine Oil has High Detergents to prevent Sludge Build Up, Dispersants to suspend Soot in the Oil and Add Pack's of elements that woud be Foreign/Unnecessary in a Hydraulic Circuit.
Your Argument is not Scientific. You have meerly found an example of a Manufacturer who has engineered their Product to be Durable/Versatile for the benefit/ease of their Customers/Operators.
I dont expect you to put much much value on my opinion but in my work environment we stopped using single Oil in multiple Compartments 20 Years ago. If you put Hydraulic Oil in the Hydralic Compartment (Wet Brakes) on a Large Mining Machine (Read CAT 793) it is un-drivable. They will Shudder/De-Laminate. Oil types have a very specific purpose and just because you have gotten away with it and it works does not make it right. What if running the correct oil allowed the Component to live 40% longer and cost 30% less to Overhaul???
Well...we were talking about hydraulics,but you brought wet multidisk brakes into the mix,which are hydro actuated,but do not run In the hydraulic oil. Deere brakes run in J20 spec oil.
Cat uses TDTO in the application you are talking about (as far as I remember).....
....and it's not that I "have gotten away with it".....many OEM's these dayys are spec'ing 10w30 or 15w40 as the oil used in their hydraulic systems,not me.
As for longevity, I have a customer with 2 Deere 844J's, 10w30 in the hydraulic system, one at 14000 hrs the other at 17000 hours,both run like a top,oil samples great throughout the machine history.
...but what do I know.
we used to run alot of Hitachi excavators where i was working in the past which specifies a 46 hyd oil, if you ran 15W-40 it would be fine for around 5000hrs then would cannon the hyd pump due to lack on internal lube
You can probably run a multi-grade engine oil also but why spend all that extra money.
Correct on the TDTO - incorrect on the Wet Brakes. All CAT Truck have Oil Pumped through Wet brakes in Large Volume (140 LPM) but Low Pressure (25 Psi) varies on Model/Size. On the correct Oil this workes very well. We have maintained a Brake Pack on a 793C up to 25000 Hours and CAT purchased it back off us to see what they/we did right!!!Well...we were talking about hydraulics,but you brought wet multidisk brakes into the mix,which are hydro actuated,but do not run In the hydraulic oil. Deere brakes run in J20 spec oil.
Wise Words - and I agree 100% do as the Manufacturer recommends. I am a Condition Monitor/Planner with a CAT Dealer at a Gold Mine. We have the usual 793 (at our peak there was 28 of them),D11R,854,16H,24H,994. We also now help the U/G with R2900G XTRA and AD-55B along with heaps od other varied CAT Machines. I would guess their must be 200-300 bits of CAT gear on site. Enough about me - What do you do?I guess the bottom line is, use what the OEM specifies and you should be good.
Are you involved in surface or underground mining? What do you do?
The exact opposite is correct. Compartments with Discs/Plates do not want "Friction Modifiers" in the Add Pack. Friction Modifiers in CAT Oil are for curcuits with Variable Displacement Piston Pumps and the fine clearances in Slippers and Load on Cav Plates.It needs a TDTO oil (or commercial TO-4) with friction modifiers because of the brake packs.
The manuel on my 416C calls for 10W motor oil and explains different oils that can be used. In warmer climates it says you can use 15w40 as well. I called my Cat dealer once and asked these same questions , the answer I got was pretty much the bucket that says hydraulic oil is what you get when you ask for hydraulic oil. Ask for engine oil and you get CAT DEO. Never answered my question. My local NAPA carries a hydraulic oils that says univeral tractor hydraulic fluid , ok what is it AW32 , AW 36 , 10 W motor oil , its hydraulic oil. OK still no answer. I went back to my manuels and went to a Lubricant only dealer , I got an answer. They are a Chevron Dealer and sold me 10W motor oil , Chevron URSLA , and I'm happy ever after.