580C pushing and pulling capacity

[DirtyHoe]

I have a lot of fir logs(over 300) that I need to move that I can't pick up. Any idea on how many thousands of pounds a backhoe can push or pull(with a chain) with good traction? How hard is it on the drive-train? Does it have more power pushing or pulling?

Also, how does the above scenario apply to skid steers? My Thomas Pro Tough 1700 weighs about 6,500 pounds with a 1,700 pound lift capacity. Nothing in the manual about push and pull capacity.

My goal is not to tear anything up.

Thanks!
Steve

 

[xgiovannix12]

ive pulled and pushed a lot with my case 580c . anymachine you will stress the drivetran doing this . Are you looking to buy a machine for the job or do you already have it ?

Most likey a skidder will be the right machine for the job or a dozer

 

[DirtyHoe]

Yes I own this equipment.

 

[Billrog]

I've pulled and carried hundreds of logs with backhoes with no ill effects.
But generally use my little tractor.

 

[xgiovannix12]

I mean if the machine is struggling pulling it just buck it smaller?

 

[Billrog]

I use the backhoe skidding backwards ( not long distances) when I want to keep the logs clean so the one end can be lifted off the ground. Doing this it's good to skid from the small end to deduce the amount of weight your lifting to keep the back wheels solid on the ground.

 

[DirtyHoe]

I'm not sure who is going to buy the logs yet. So I need to leave them long so I don't mess up their value. Different wood mills want certain lengths. I'm going to drag them to a staging area so a self loader can work from one spot.

Steve

 

[Grady]

How big are these logs and how far do they need to go? Was it a selective cutting where you will have to work around the remaining trees or a clear cut? Tractor Data says a 580C can lift 4700 lbs. I've lifted some good sized logs with my C to load them on a trailer but it doesn't steer very well with that kind of weight in the bucket. It also doesn't have much clearance when it comes to stumps. Billrog has the right idea and like him I usually use my tractor to drag logs.

 

[DirtyHoe]

Grady,
They are plus or minus 16" on the butt end and around 6" on the other. Most are 70 to 80 feet long. I need to move them around 500 feet. They were planted as Christmas trees, but were abandoned. I clear cut the area and cut the trees low so I can drive over them. There were planted on a 6 or 8 foot grid pattern. My machine could probably pick one up, but I don't have a 4 in 1 bucket or forks. I think a chain would be too much work and a danger. Also if I could pick them up it would be too tight to navigate other trees I'm going to keep.

I am replacing the ring and pinion is a farm tractor that was worn out. So my main question was can these machines handle a lot of pushing and puling without tearing stuff up?
The worst part is going to be pulling stumps in the path of the driveway and buildings. I may have to rent an excavator for that phase.

Steve

 

[franklin2]

I was doing a lot of grading up hill with my 480c this past summer, and after awhile I could smell the shuttle trans getting hot, so I quit for awhile.

Do you have some junk laying around and are handy? Do you have a old wagon axle or trailer sitting around that you could strap under the log to help it skid with less resistance?

 

[Willie B]

You haven't mentioned four wheel or two. 580K I know is fine with pulling, but it's a little inconvenient to chain under the hoe swing tower, and hooking to the bucket is all wrong. Using the front bucket is good if short drags. If you must pull going forward, use a heavy weight (boulder) in the front bucket, and carry it low.

USE YOUR SEAT BELT! Tire chains are useful.

 

[Grady]

Those logs probably aren't going to drag easily unless you lift one end. I still think your C would do it but it's not the best machine for that job. I don't know what tractor you have but I've dragged pine logs just as long but twice as big around with my old farmall M OS6 with chains. I wasn't weaving in and out dodging trees and I plowed some serious furrows doing it but it was all I had at the time. My tractor has individual brakes so that's how I did most of the steering. If you cut them off close to the ground, the logs usually have a lot of taper at the butt that digs in when you drag them from that end - unless lifted. My experience is that tractors are better at pulling than pushing. I never tore anything up pulling things but I did trash the differential in a 580CK pushing too much. It's not a dozer.

I used this site http://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/calculators/calc.pl to figure the weight of each one as 2167 lbs. using your figures and the balsam fir for the species. I don't know what your tractor or skid steer is capable of but logs that long increases the drag. I hope you cut the branches off close. Is there a market for logs that long out there? Around here 20' is about the biggest I see and usually 16'. Might want to find out first - shorter ones drag easier and faster.

 

[Willie B]

Those logs probably aren't going to drag easily unless you lift one end. I still think your C would do it but it's not the best machine for that job. I don't know what tractor you have but I've dragged pine logs just as long but twice as big around with my old farmall M OS6 with chains. I wasn't weaving in and out dodging trees and I plowed some serious furrows doing it but it was all I had at the time. My tractor has individual brakes so that's how I did most of the steering. If you cut them off close to the ground, the logs usually have a lot of taper at the butt that digs in when you drag them from that end - unless lifted. My experience is that tractors are better at pulling than pushing. I never tore anything up pulling things but I did trash the differential in a 580CK pushing too much. It's not a dozer.

I used this site http://www.woodweb.com/cgi-bin/calculators/calc.pl to figure the weight of each one as 2167 lbs. using your figures and the balsam fir for the species. I don't know what your tractor or skid steer is capable of but logs that long increases the drag. I hope you cut the branches off close. Is there a market for logs that long out there? Around here 20' is about the biggest I see and usually 16'. Might want to find out first - shorter ones drag easier and faster.

What is M OS6? I can't find a picture of my M (1940) I have my son's. Mine has perfect sheet metal, but faded paint. Edit: I found one! My son's M with a family friend in the pilot's seat, mine in the background. Seth has dubbed his Lindsey, after Lindsey Vonn the skier. He says she is big and beautiful.

Willie

 

[Willie B]

 

[Willie B]

It's tough to learn skidding. If you pull from too low, the butts hang up. If you pull from too high, you might flip the tractor over backwards. That won't happen with your backhoe. I use this:

With your hoetry swinging the hoe up hill, and chain to the boom a couple feet above the ground.

 

[Delmer]

I like the idea of swinging the hoe uphill to hook closer to the centerline of the axle. You increase the tendency to tip backwards, but the hoe's back there and you have a cab, and you can lower the outriggers halfway if the trail is nice enough. You should be able to tow a ton easy, just watch the temps if you go crazy doing it all at once, the torque converters aren't designed for sustained pulls IMHO.

Don't even think about using a skid steer to tow logs.

 

[xgiovannix12]

How big are these logs and how far do they need to go? Was it a selective cutting where you will have to work around the remaining trees or a clear cut? Tractor Data says a 580C can lift 4700 lbs. I've lifted some good sized logs with my C to load them on a trailer but it doesn't steer very well with that kind of weight in the bucket. It also doesn't have much clearance when it comes to stumps. Billrog has the right idea and like him I usually use my tractor to drag logs.

I picked up whole trees with my 580c and moved them around

 

[Willie B]

If you leave the hoe centered, and hook to the bucket, there isn't a boulder big enough to serve as counter weight. If you chain below the hoe, it snaggs up on every rock, and stump. Trying to compromise by swinging the hoe up hill, and hooking a couple feet above ground I'd suggest.

Skid in winter. Tractor won't overheat, driver won't overheat, If ground is frozen, no dirt. No mosquitos, no black flies. Remember, BLACK FLIES MATTER.

Willie

 

[Grady]

Willie, We live in a parallel universe. We both have M tractors, We both have the TD7E Dozer, and we both have a 580K and I'll bet your universe isn't more than a couple hours away. Pretty strange coincidence.
The OS-6 is just an M made for use in an orchard. It has shorter rear tires [mine are the 14.9 x 26], shorter steering set up, short air intake and short exhaust that makes it a good rig for working in the woods. Mine has a hand clutch so you can drive it standing up like a chariot so it's easy to jump on and off. It's got a lot of low end, too. I had the front wheels 2 feet off the ground pulling some big logs with a chain from the drawbar. Here is a picture of one I found online. I don't know how to post pics anymore since they changed it over. If someone wants to take the time to explain it to me or direct me to the instructions, I'll post one of mine. I think mine is a 1948.


McCormick-Deering OS-6, restored version captured at a California antique tractor show
Model history
Model introduced 1944
Model discontinued 1953
Model status Discontinued
Preceded by New model
Engine Specification
Engine make International
Engine model C-248
Fuel type gasoline
Power hp 37 belt, 32 drawbar
Governed rpm 1450
Displacement cu in /(litre) 248 ci
No. of Cylinders 4
Bore in (mm) 3.875 in
Stroke in (mm) 5.25 in
Cooling system water
Naturally aspirated, Turbo or Supercharged NA
Transmission Details
Transmission type sliding gear
Gearbox make International
Forward 5
Reverse 1
Drive 2-WD
General Data
Linkage Category drawbar
Tyre Sizes (std/options)
Front 6.00-16 4-ply
Rear 14-26 6-ply
Tractor Dimensions
Length (inches/metres) 133 in
Width (inches/meters) 60 in
Height (inches/meters) 62 in
Weight (nominal) lb/kg 4600 lb
Turning circle (nominal) inches/meters 25.5 ft
Wheelbase 76 in
Other info
Factories Rock Island, Illinois, USA
Plow rating 3-14"
Nebraska Tests No. 355
Approximate Cost new in (year) $2335 (1951)
This box: view · talk
The McCormick-Deering OS-6 was an orchard tractor built by the International Harvester company from 1944 to 1953 in Rock Island, Illinois, USA.

Contents
[show]
Model historyEdit
For Company history see
Main article: International Harvester
The McCormick-Deering OS-6 was basically the O-6 without the shielding. It retained the lowered air intake and exhaust, headlights, seat, and controls.

Timeline Edit

• 1940 - McCormick-Deering W-6 gasoline-powered standard-tread tractor replaced the W-30
• 1940 - Later in year, O-6 orchard, based on W-6, replaced orchard version of W-30
• 1944 - OS-6, without the shielding of the O-6, added
• 1946 - Brand name shortened from McCormick-Deering to McCormick
• 1953 - OS-6 discontinued

Factory locations Edit

• Farmall Works, Rock Island, Illinois, USA

Specification Edit
See Infobox for basic details

• Standard tires
  • Front: 6.00-16 4-ply (1946)
  • Rear: 12-26 6-ply (1946); 13-26 6-ply (1948); 14-26 6-ply (1951)

Variations and Options Edit

• Optional tires
  • Front: 6.00-16 6-ply or 6.50-16 4 or 6-ply (1946)
  • Rear: 13-26 or 14-26 6-ply (1946)

Serial Numbers Information Edit
Year Serial no. run
start[1] Serial no. run
End[1] Number Built Notes
1944 OBKS6313 9495 Serial range includes W-6, WD-6, O-6, OS-6, ODS-6, I-6, ID-6
1945 9496 14152 Number built included with W-6
1946 14153 17791
1947 17792 22980
1948 22981 28703
1949 28704 33697
1950 33698 38517
1951 38518 44317
1952 44318 45273
1953 45274 45843[2]

ShareMore Info
McCormick OS-6.jpg
See full size image

Added by Edrob Posted in McCormickMcCormick-Deering OS-6User:Edrob/McCormick-Deering OS-6

 

[Willie B]

Willie, We live in a parallel universe. We both have M tractors, We both have the TD7E Dozer, and we both have a 580K and I'll bet your universe isn't more than a couple hours away. Pretty strange coincidence.
The OS-6 is just an M made for use in an orchard. It has shorter rear tires [mine are the 14.9 x 26], shorter steering set up, short air intake and short exhaust that makes it a good rig for working in the woods. Mine has a hand clutch so you can drive it standing up like a chariot so it's easy to jump on and off. It's got a lot of low end, too. I had the front wheels 2 feet off the ground pulling some big logs with a chain from the drawbar. Here is a picture of one I found online. I don't know how to post pics anymore since they changed it over. If someone wants to take the time to explain it to me or direct me to the instructions, I'll post one of mine. I think mine is a 1948.


McCormick-Deering OS-6, restored version captured at a California antique tractor show
Model history
Model introduced 1944
Model discontinued 1953
Model status Discontinued
Preceded by New model
Engine Specification
Engine make International
Engine model C-248
Fuel type gasoline
Power hp 37 belt, 32 drawbar
Governed rpm 1450
Displacement cu in /(litre) 248 ci
No. of Cylinders 4
Bore in (mm) 3.875 in
Stroke in (mm) 5.25 in
Cooling system water
Naturally aspirated, Turbo or Supercharged NA
Transmission Details
Transmission type sliding gear
Gearbox make International
Forward 5
Reverse 1
Drive 2-WD
General Data
Linkage Category drawbar
Tyre Sizes (std/options)
Front 6.00-16 4-ply
Rear 14-26 6-ply
Tractor Dimensions
Length (inches/metres) 133 in
Width (inches/meters) 60 in
Height (inches/meters) 62 in
Weight (nominal) lb/kg 4600 lb
Turning circle (nominal) inches/meters 25.5 ft
Wheelbase 76 in
Other info
Factories Rock Island, Illinois, USA
Plow rating 3-14"
Nebraska Tests No. 355
Approximate Cost new in (year) $2335 (1951)
This box: view · talk
The McCormick-Deering OS-6 was an orchard tractor built by the International Harvester company from 1944 to 1953 in Rock Island, Illinois, USA.

Contents
[show]
Model historyEdit
For Company history see
Main article: International Harvester
The McCormick-Deering OS-6 was basically the O-6 without the shielding. It retained the lowered air intake and exhaust, headlights, seat, and controls.

Timeline Edit

• 1940 - McCormick-Deering W-6 gasoline-powered standard-tread tractor replaced the W-30
• 1940 - Later in year, O-6 orchard, based on W-6, replaced orchard version of W-30
• 1944 - OS-6, without the shielding of the O-6, added
• 1946 - Brand name shortened from McCormick-Deering to McCormick
• 1953 - OS-6 discontinued

Factory locations Edit

• Farmall Works, Rock Island, Illinois, USA

Specification Edit
See Infobox for basic details

• Standard tires
  • Front: 6.00-16 4-ply (1946)
  • Rear: 12-26 6-ply (1946); 13-26 6-ply (1948); 14-26 6-ply (1951)

Variations and Options Edit

• Optional tires
  • Front: 6.00-16 6-ply or 6.50-16 4 or 6-ply (1946)
  • Rear: 13-26 or 14-26 6-ply (1946)

Serial Numbers Information Edit
Year Serial no. run
start[1] Serial no. run
End[1] Number Built Notes
1944 OBKS6313 9495 Serial range includes W-6, WD-6, O-6, OS-6, ODS-6, I-6, ID-6
1945 9496 14152 Number built included with W-6
1946 14153 17791
1947 17792 22980
1948 22981 28703
1949 28704 33697
1950 33698 38517
1951 38518 44317
1952 44318 45273
1953 45274 45843[2]

A handsome tractor!
Born in 1956, the IH dealer was 1/2 mile from home, mother kept the books. Most models were represented in new, or service. Without the badge, I'd have assumed yours was a W-6. I've always preferred the low center of gravity models.
In recent years we have gotten into antique tractor pulling. For reasons I don't understand, the utilities don't do as well as row crops. Mine has no added weight. Seth does remarkably well with his M. He is licking his wounds, last fall a 560 found its way into his weight class. He took second place.

ShareMore Info
McCormick OS-6.jpg
See full size image

Added by Edrob Posted in McCormickMcCormick-Deering OS-6User:Edrob/McCormick-Deering OS-6