Work shop/buildings'; Steel vs. Clear Span fabric...

[LowBoy]

I'm on a mission to put up a workshop after 30 years of hallucinating about it finally.

The question is, do I want the fabric one (I know, MANY, many different opinions about to come from this now,) or a steel building. Cost is the deciding factor first. This is LOW-BUDGET stuff here...not building the Garage-Ma-Hal or anything. No floor at first, all as cheap as possible. Getting the drift?

I'm at around 16-18K for spending money, so that will have to be it for a standing building over my head. I was inside a brand new 36X72 Clear Span fabric building recently that is set up nice. Plenty of room, light, and easy to deal with, and cost him 12K with a 6" floor all completely wired and all. Not bad. My concern is snow loads. They shed snow well, but it builds up on the sides, so you'd have to have it set up to plow along the sides to keep that from happening. They still make me nervous about the possibility of failing in heavy snowfalls like we get here all winter long even in light winters like last year.

Next thing I'm considering is a steel building with a better than average snowload rating of 65. They're one of the MANY steel buildings offered online and in magazines, all set up in about one day with a crew they supply. Just wondering if anyone's put one up recently within these paramiters? Curious to hear a few suggestions on what's out there, and financing options, etc.

 

[Randy88]

The only thing I can tell you about hoop buildings is what my customers tell me, most are not impressed with them long term, the last one we did the landscaping for ended without it being put up, the owner told me after considerable pricing, the hoop building was a lot higher in cost over a standard pole building, I can't personally verify that, but other have told me the same thing this year as well. I've been around the steel buildings simular in shape as the hoop buildings, they last longer and built to last in my opinion, I wanted one for myself, but we ended up doing a remodel for a shop instead on an old barn. A steel building can be spray foamed to insulate later on if you want to, a plastic hoop can't. If it were me I'd never buy a hoop plastic building from what I've seen and been told by my customers that have them, at first they are happy, then over time they become upset with them, several I know have had to replace the plastic portion a few times already and said never again would they do that. If you can put the building up yourself, like a steel building or any building for that matter, the components package isn't that high priced, compared to hiring it all done, I'd certainly give it a shot to put up a steel building, not sure its realistic to do in one weekend by yourself, with enough people you certainly could, just make sure its secured down as you go and not wait till its done to do that, seen one blow away over night and they started over the second time, surprisingly it goes faster the second time around putting up the same building though. Best of luck

 

[TheOldMan]

I have a 30X50 free standing steel building, looks a lot like a quonset hut. The secret to assembling it is two sets of rolling scaffolds, double height, with 2 long 4X4 beams on top, with about 8 people. Mine is 14' in the center, and took 6 panels for each section we bolted the center and 2 panels together, passed them up to 2 people on top who then bolted a panel to either end. People on the ground bolted the other panes together, stood them and bolted them on. You cannot assemble them on the ground and stand them up as the mfg advertises, they aren't rigid enough. We tried the first one and almost destroyed it. 2 things I did wrong - I only bought 2 skylight sections, should have had at east 4, and I didn't spray foam insulate before putting anything into it. Ten years old, and still looks brand new. If you decide to go this way, contact me and let me give you some pointers from my experience. Good Luck

 

[LowBoy]

Thank you both, for the input. I'm not really in love with those "hoop buildings" either. I'm scared of them given the climate and snow situation where we are here. We get snow only like you'd read about, while 10 miles either side of this God-foresaken mountain, the sun is shining.That's what 2290' ASL does for you.

That 30X50 quonset style sounds OK, but unfortunately, I don't know 8 people who like me enough to be here to help me put one up, so that's out too.

I'm looking at regular rectangular steel buildings actually, to be honest. 30X50 or 60' long would be the cat's meow. I don't see it as a reality getting it built before winter, but I do see me getting the dirt work all done so it can go through a freeze/thaw cycle this winter which will do it good.

Appreciate the input guys.

 

[TheOldMan]

The company that mfg my building advertises that it can be put up in a weekend by 2 people. Guess that's possible if they're both 18' tall. We worked one weekend with 2 people, then 2 days w/8. Cost was the deciding factor. This was much cheaper than a "red steel" bldg.

 

[LowBoy]

The company that mfg my building advertises that it can be put up in a weekend by 2 people. Guess that's possible if they're both 18' tall. We worked one weekend with 2 people, then 2 days w/8. Cost was the deciding factor. This was much cheaper than a "red steel" bldg.

Hahaha, can't say I know of any 18 ft. tall fellas around here anyways, so that's out.

I'm with you on cost...I'm trying to keep it to bare-bones minimum at all costs. I think it's going to be built by me, myself, and I with some help from a couple dead-men made out of wood or something to hold things upright. No help around here at all...kind of far away from all my buddies out in the wilderness.

Just got a couple "quotes" today over the phone. Hahahaha, it's plum amazing how many of these buildings are allegedly ordered, under contract with deposits, and then cancelled and discounted and are on "sale"...what a crock. Then they are willing to take my deposit (one was for $3,800.00,) and hold it for 6 months until I secure the funds. The problem I have with that deal is, I plan on getting the funding secured FIRST...not the other way around. 2 out of 3 of the calls I got today from my inquiring about a few buildings resulted in this same scam.

So far, I've got this 30X41X12 steel carport as the cheapest one at $13,280 all built, labor included. I really need to add 13 more feet of depth to that yet to make it deep enough. The next one is around $16,300, but a nicer looking barn-style with a lean-to off both sides. They sure do get pricey as you start adding little stuff. That's not with any floor either. That'll come later in life I'm afraid, but oh well.

 

[Randy88]

Lowboy, have you priced a pole style building, from say menards or something simular, I'd opt out of the call by scam places, also look online for complaints of the companies, I've found after looking, there are more complaints on companies taking orders and downpayments and then not delivering anything. I guess I'm not trusting enought to send off a check and hope to get something delivered in a few weeks or months, I'd rather go get and pay for it as I pick it up, and that way its in my yard and the worry is eliminated from the equation completely.

I'll toss this out there for something to ponder over, rent some hands, like telehandlers and manlifts, the telhandler is for rafter setting if you go pole building, and the manlift is for raising and lowering yourself up and down and having a platform to work on and you can drive it around the building as you need to work in different area's, toss the ladders in the trash and by having a manlift on site, you can save about three people, especially handling and putting on tin, setting poles, bracing and etc. No they are not cheap to rent, but worth every penny you spend on one, if for nothing else safety. I've seen a single guy put up a pole building 60x100x14 feet tall, don't get me wrong, it took him a while to do it, but he took his time and did plenty of raising and lowering of the platform, but once he had his pace going, the building went up pretty slick, two people working goes even faster, but it doesn't take an army to do every job, especially if you don't have access to help. Also not sure if your married or have a girlfriend or kids, but every body counts in my opinion. I know of another building 50x100x14 feet tall I did the landscaping for and the owner and his wife put that one up, and the wife's idea of helping was to bring out sandwiches for him and a drink of water and maybe hold the end of the measuring tape for him occasionally and he had a full time job during the day, took him all summer to get it done, but its sure nice now that its done.

Also the cheapest cost is the span in the middle between the end sections, so to make the building 10-20 feet longer is only some more tin and one or two rafters, the ends are already there and most times the doors are aleady figured in, so its just some extra space for little dollars. Yes extras get expensive when you add them on, especialy leans off the side of the building, its usually cheaper to go wider right off the bat than put a lean on a smaller building, thats what I've found over time pricing buildings.

 

[Effinay]

I looked into one of those on-line steel building companies and got the same high pressure, full of bull, sales pitch. I could never get a straight answer from any of the sales weasels, and then after telling them I needed to think about it, I was getting phone calls every two or three days that were bordering on harrasment. Finally told them to "F" off and do not call, EVER! I've seen a couple buildings for sale on craigslist and was tempted. Just not in the cards this year so my stuff will have to stay out in the snow again.....

 

[JBGASH]

A metal pole building would be a way better option. Had a neighbor have a 30x50 put up for $8500.00 less the garage door,opener and no concrete floor. He is adding those items as funds become available. IMO the metal building will outlast the fabric by a country mile with considerable less maint. issues.

 

[LowBoy]

A metal pole building would be a way better option. Had a neighbor have a 30x50 put up for $8500.00 less the garage door,opener and no concrete floor. He is adding those items as funds become available. IMO the metal building will outlast the fabric by a country mile with considerable less maint. issues.

I'm with you on the fabric shelter for sure.Not really impressed. And this building you just described is a good option...I'll look into that more now.It's the same way I have to do it...get the structure up and finish it in time. My biggest problem is I'm "machine-less" at the present time. So having to rent one daily is a tough deal...at around $300.00/day. I wish I could find someone that'd rent me one with no pressure for a month, for a set figure so I wouldn't be so nervous while having to use it and get it back like it always seems to be when I rent something.I have an existing building I need to demo, then have to have about 300 yards of good fill dumped, I need to get it to grade...so ultimately a 311 Cat with a thumb and blade would be the ideal situation to have sitting here for a month.

You don't know how badly you miss your own equipment until you get rid of it, I'll tell you...

I work every day, so I only have weekends to prep my site, build it, etc. I spend more stinking time going to get, and returning equipment I rent, than working it sometimes given my distance from civilization here.

JBGASH...that metal/pole building your neighbor put up...was that a whole package or some kind of kit, or did he just buy everything piece meal such as poles, tin, etc?

 

[LowBoy]

I hear ya Effinay. I'm not interested in this whole scam anyways. Hahahaha, I got a call yesterday from some shyster trying to get me to throw $3,800.00 down the chute for a downpayment on a building someone "cancelled", started off at 38K, was selling it to me for 18K...boy, that sure is mighty nice of them, eh? The only problem I had was the guy selling me this pile of manure had a thick, almost obnoxious Long Island/Brooklyn Joey Buttafuco accent that was like nails on a chalk board. I asked him where he was calling from, and he said Indiana. Ba hahahaha. Nothing against "New Yawka's..." I have a couple buddies from the city and they're great people...but this guy was too much, and when he said he was from Indiana I almost fell out of my seat of the truck I was in from laughing.
I'm not a farmer, but I can still smell a pile of manure when it's in front of me...
That was as bad as that SNL skit the Coneheads, when asked where they were from, they would say "France"...hahahaha.

 

[LowBoy]

Lowboy, have you priced a pole style . I guess I'm not trusting enought to send off a check and hope to get something delivered in a few weeks or months, I'd rather go get and pay for it as I pick it up, and that way its in my yard and the worry is eliminated from the equation completely.

Also not sure if your married or have a girlfriend or kids, but every body counts in my opinion. I know of another building 50x100x14 feet tall I did the landscaping for and the owner and his wife put that one up, and the wife's idea of helping was to bring out sandwiches for him and a drink of water and maybe hold the end of the measuring tape for him occasionally and he had a full time job during the day, took him all summer to get it done, but its sure nice now that its done.

I'm going to start looking into it Randy. I'd never send a check out to one of those swindlers either...don't worry about that.

And I do have a wife that is willing to help in the same EXACT way...I'd have plenty to eat, drink, wear, snack on, etc. but just to get her to hold the dumb end of the tape measure tight and at the right height sometimes is aggravating enough to just do it myself altogether unfortunately. But, my sock and underwear drawers are always full...
Kids...that's another sore subject. 2 of them, but both AWOL. It's just me and the dogs. They help me more than they know sometimes with their moral support.:thumbsup

 

[SVTSHELBYGT500]

I Just Ordered A 55'X 100' Clear Span Building For Screened Topsoil Storage & Equipment Storage .Building Will Set On 6' High 2' X 2' X 6' Concrete Blocks . Gives Me 26' Of Headroom . Will Pave The Floor. These Buildings I Think Are Like Anything Else You Can Buy Cheap Or Pay A Little More For Quality.Or I am Hoping So. Check You Local For Property Taxes . In My Area They Do Not Assess This Type Of Building . No Property Taxes ! State & Local Road Departments Use These For Salt & Equipment Storage.

 

[TheOldMan]

If I had it to do over again, I would build me an extension on the FEL that would be high enought to lift each assembled section and stand it up. I think you would still need the scaffolding and 4x4s to hold the assembled sections while you bolted the next one to it. Since you are only going to be working weekends, if you could find a couple of helpers part time, it would be a feasable operation. The labor costs of assembly I'm sure are more than the price of the building.

 

[LowBoy]

I agree. I'm gearing up for the task every day now...selling one of my trucks that I love, to start the process asap. I can always get more trucks. I need this shelter soon. Been dreaming about it for 30+ years, and not getting any younger.

 

[JBGASH]

Lowboy, that was the total cost, labor and material. Thecrew put it up in 2 days and was gone. It did not include the site prep. It was a company in Oaklahoma and very organised when they arrived to do it. Sometimes it is cheaper to hire people that specialize in certain areas - they seem to have all the pricing and problems figured out because they deal with it all the time.

I'm with you on the fabric shelter for sure.Not really impressed. And this building you just described is a good option...I'll look into that more now.It's the same way I have to do it...get the structure up and finish it in time. My biggest problem is I'm "machine-less" at the present time. So having to rent one daily is a tough deal...at around $300.00/day. I wish I could find someone that'd rent me one with no pressure for a month, for a set figure so I wouldn't be so nervous while having to use it and get it back like it always seems to be when I rent something.I have an existing building I need to demo, then have to have about 300 yards of good fill dumped, I need to get it to grade...so ultimately a 311 Cat with a thumb and blade would be the ideal situation to have sitting here for a month.

You don't know how badly you miss your own equipment until you get rid of it, I'll tell you...

I work every day, so I only have weekends to prep my site, build it, etc. I spend more stinking time going to get, and returning equipment I rent, than working it sometimes given my distance from civilization here.

JBGASH...that metal/pole building your neighbor put up...was that a whole package or some kind of kit, or did he just buy everything piece meal such as poles, tin, etc?

 

[tuney443]

I'm going to order my fabric garage from Northeast Shelters from West Hurley,NY.They are a custom manufacturer,small mom and pop biz that's been around for 22 years now.Can attest to their quality from people I know,what just recently sold me was their demo at our recent county fair where they had this new awesome extreme heavy duty new vinyl with a 20 yr. life expectancy that meets our military specs.Typically, their HD steel members are every 4' OC,they will customize if you wish for closer OC spacing if you desire.The great part of a fabric garage is there is no increase in your property taxes because it is deemed a temporary structure,even with a concrete floor.If you're interested their # is 845-338-8823

 

[LowBoy]

I'm going to order my fabric garage from Northeast Shelters from West Hurley,NY.They are a custom manufacturer,small mom and pop biz that's been around for 22 years now.Can attest to their quality from people I know,what just recently sold me was their demo at our recent county fair where they had this new awesome extreme heavy duty new vinyl with a 20 yr. life expectancy that meets our military specs.Typically, their HD steel members are every 4' OC,they will customize if you wish for closer OC spacing if you desire.The great part of a fabric garage is there is no increase in your property taxes because it is deemed a temporary structure,even with a concrete floor.If you're interested their # is 845-338-8823

I like the fact they can't tax them. I'm still worried about the longevity issue. I went to a Public Works Expo in Mass. Thursday 9/27/12 and looked into 2 different structures. I didn't get the answers I expected in terms of "How Long" the fabric will last. They recommend the 12.5 oz. vinyl, with extra hoops, etc. for my location. At that point they become comparable to a normal steel building then cost wise. I think I should stay the course and get going on either a pole structure or a steel prefab. Taxes are inevidable unfortunately. If they don't tax me on this, they'll tax me on that...

 

[lowbed driver]

We have a tent on order. 50ft x 80ft and our snow loading here in town is 115lb/sq ft!! There are a couple in town already and they hold the snow no problem, however make sure they are a continuous curved arch. They can have the fabric pulled tighter, the one in town that is ripping has a prominate eave line(straight up form ground and the the roof line takes off from there to the peak). The fabric can't be pulled as tight from the ground because it starts 'digging in' to the eave corner. Also a few of the long lasting tents had a heavy rubber type tarp installed over the tent structure and this helps for sure.
Also the tents are placed on concrete loc-blocks 2-3 high. This help with snow removal as the loader can run parallel to the building without damaging the tent. Snow removal is important in our area as we get 20-30 ft accumulated snow each winter and 3 times in my life we have gotten 5 ft in 24-30 hrs and 2 ft in 12 hrs is not uncommon.

Cheers Lowbed driver

 

[LowBoy]

We have a tent on order. 50ft x 80ft and our snow loading here in town is 115lb/sq ft!! There are a couple in town already and they hold the snow no problem, however make sure they are a continuous curved arch. They can have the fabric pulled tighter, the one in town that is ripping has a prominate eave line(straight up form ground and the the roof line takes off from there to the peak). The fabric can't be pulled as tight from the ground because it starts 'digging in' to the eave corner. Also a few of the long lasting tents had a heavy rubber type tarp installed over the tent structure and this helps for sure.
Also the tents are placed on concrete loc-blocks 2-3 high. This help with snow removal as the loader can run parallel to the building without damaging the tent. Snow removal is important in our area as we get 20-30 ft accumulated snow each winter and 3 times in my life we have gotten 5 ft in 24-30 hrs and 2 ft in 12 hrs is not uncommon.

Cheers Lowbed driver

I'm hearing ya Lowbed. I just got back from Tractor Supply a minute ago, with a "garage-in-a-box" 10X20X8 shelter I'm gonna use for practice. I actually had one a few years ago for my son. We built it and I had to go away for a few days, so I asked him to make sure it was secured down really good so the wind doesn't grab it. At 17 yrs. old, I guess that really meant, "OK, dad's gone for a few days, so I'm free"... and when I got home the whole tent was up in the highest maple trees on the property, the frame work all mangled. Been using the tubing for various projects for the past few years from that thing. Made a couple cool chock blocks with tube handles so I don't have to bend down to drop a chock block, and several other inventive things around the farm. I figured those chocks cost me about $175.00 each with the special handles... This time though, I'M in charge of the building so it'll be done according to spec's.