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What makes a good operator?
- Thread starter terrasmooth
- Start date
robin yates uk
Senior Member
I agree about at the heavy drinking operators who strangely enough seem to be good timekeepers and look after their machine.Many sites in the UK have breathalisers at the site entrance.
tuney443
Senior Member
REPETITION and more REPETITION-plain and simple,alcohol has absolutely NO place in the excavating world--I don't care how good someone thinks they are when they've been drinking,because they don't belong in the seat--PERIOD
terrasmooth
Well-Known Member
I agree, however; it is what it is.
ih100
Senior Member
I can't believe anyone nowadays accepts drunks have any place on heavy equipment, that attitude probably says more about the people who accept it. Who accepts drunk drivers sharing roads with their wives/children? I've worked with operators who could operate while drunk, trouble was I never got to see what they old do sober. If anyone can't live without drink, they've no business working with machinery.
terrasmooth
Well-Known Member
Thanks Austin, I am not passing judgement, just stating a fact, some of the drinkers and druggies were horrible employees too.
terrasmooth
Well-Known Member
Detecting and proving substance abuse is tricky... I have seen people that I knew were "dirty" sent them in for a test, they carry ziploc bags of someone else's urine, (that is clean) taped to their body to keep it the correct temperature. There are products out there to give a false reading on drug tests, and some say they forgot their I.D. there are many ways to cheat.. Then you basically have to find another reason to get rid of them. Most companies I have worked for put more of an emphasis on drugs than alcohol... weed stays in your system for 30 days and alcohol is gone quickly... the dilemma is trying to control what people do in their private time that does not affect their work... maybe the breathalizer is the answer, I do not know how accurate they are. Then you need to address whether or not to do it to everyone... I have seen just as many alcoholics in management as in the operator/ labor pool.
ih100
Senior Member
Don't know about you, Austin, but I'd be embarrassed to to be outperformed by an overhung drunk. Not that it's ever happened. I have worked with some jerks who think they're outperforming everyone else, but the sober majority know the truth.
Terra smooth, drugs is a different ball game, but you and I know when someone turns up drunk or hungover, and you and I know saying that they're better operators than a sober guy is kinda burying your head in the sand.
Generally you don't find drunk managers meeting you at 25mph on a scraper or grader, or swinging a bucket of rock over your head.
Last edited:
ih100,
I'm in no way condoning it, but it is the truth. I'm just agreeing with terracon when he says that in this business you will find hard living, hard partying guys that are good at what they do and are better operators than others. It's a fact.
What a guy does on his own time after work is of no concern to me as long as it doesn't affect his performance at work. Some guys can do that, stay up late and show up to work and finish base, load trucks, build a surge pile, or pull a slope better and faster than others.
I'm in no way condoning it, but it is the truth. I'm just agreeing with terracon when he says that in this business you will find hard living, hard partying guys that are good at what they do and are better operators than others. It's a fact.
What a guy does on his own time after work is of no concern to me as long as it doesn't affect his performance at work. Some guys can do that, stay up late and show up to work and finish base, load trucks, build a surge pile, or pull a slope better and faster than others.
ih100
Senior Member
I've been operating since 1975, and the BEST operators I've worked with are the ones who don't burn the candle both ends. Can you imagine applying your theory to piloting planes, or brain surgery? Equipment ops aren't stand-alone guys with a unique metabolism. These super-operators might shine by midday, but aren't worth a light first thing in the morning.
What theory? And I thought we were talking construction and not brain surgery. I'm not trying to argue with you.
BTW, and this is in no way meant to be a personal attack but I know guys that have been operating since 1975 too that aren't that good. Years in the seat doesn't always mean better. Some people have it, some people don't. Some people can see grade and some people can't. Some guys can take 2-3 stakes on successive 100' stations and can carry that grade for 400' or more, by hand so to speak, and be within a few tenths. Some guys will grade that 200' then stop and holler at you to set some more stakes.
And SOMETIMES, the operators that can do that also happen to be living hard. I've seen it more than once.
BTW, and this is in no way meant to be a personal attack but I know guys that have been operating since 1975 too that aren't that good. Years in the seat doesn't always mean better. Some people have it, some people don't. Some people can see grade and some people can't. Some guys can take 2-3 stakes on successive 100' stations and can carry that grade for 400' or more, by hand so to speak, and be within a few tenths. Some guys will grade that 200' then stop and holler at you to set some more stakes.
And SOMETIMES, the operators that can do that also happen to be living hard. I've seen it more than once.
Buckethead
Senior Member
I don't know how guys can work with a hangover. Some people can do it, I guess, but not me. I found that out early, before I even really got in the seat. Work nights I'm in bed usually by 10 o'clock. Unless I can't sleep, but even then, I'll only have 2 or 3 beers.
terrasmooth
Well-Known Member
I never said or implied that a drunk operator was better because of it; I was making a point that many alcoholics I worked with had a good work ethic in spite of their addiction. And I have never been outperformed by someone that was drunk or high.
Your point about managers being less of an immediate threat is taken... however they can still make decisions that get someone injured or killed.
robin yates uk
Senior Member
the breathaliser used in the UK is 100% accurate.If a reading is positive then another test is taken on a bigger machine, usually at the police station
ih100
Senior Member
I guess you aren't very old, Austin. I can assure you that you don't lose operating skills when you get to 30. Interest, perhaps. Youthful exuberance and a very large trumpet to blow doesn't equal good. However this is a well beaten track we've set down, and all the older hands will be smiling while the younger ones are steaming, so over and out.
You are totally missing my points ih100. What you said is extremely true as well. I in no way implied that I personally am better than anyone else, as you inferred that I did.
I think what makes a really good operator is someone that has a great attitude and thinks about all the pieces of machinery or phases of construction that come behind them and thinks about little things, takes care of them, and most importantly, knows their role in an operation.
Some examples that I can think of right off hand:
The hoe operator that digs the bell hole for RCP without having to wait to be told by the groundman to mark out where it's going to be.
The hoe operator that honks his horn to tell the truck he's loading to go just as he starts to dump into the box on his last pass because he knows it takes a few seconds for the truck to begin to move.
The hoe and loader operators that don't sit there and wait for trucks when there is a lull in the cycle. They are always moving, building a pile close to the loadout so that in the event he gets slammed with several trucks in a row, he's got a really short cycle to get them out of there in a hurry if he has to, and doesn't have to work the entire face.
The loader operator that doesn't wait with his bucket in the air for a truck to pull up and when they don't spot right, has to back up and readjust.
The loader operator that dumps a small pile of dirt in the haul road next to pile to keep trucks from crowding too close to him.
The blade operator that gets out of the way when laying gravel to allow the trucks to keep dumping, knowing that there are two seperate operations involved with gravel, the laydown & finish.
The dozer hand when dumping a string of trucks leaves the last few dumps in a ribbon for a later time if he wants them to start another, backs up and catches the trucks instead of letting them come all the way down to the end of the fill with their load.
There are more little things than that, just what I could come up with quickly.
I may not have been operating since 1975, but I have been in this business long enough to see operators that do the things I mentioned above and I have seen operators that don't do the things above, and I tell you what, it wasn't always age or years operating the separated the two.
And I have also seen and heard operators that when shown or told the things I mentioned above, (not necessarily by me either) nod and say "yeah, that makes sense" then two hours later go back to what they were doing before.
I think what makes a really good operator is someone that has a great attitude and thinks about all the pieces of machinery or phases of construction that come behind them and thinks about little things, takes care of them, and most importantly, knows their role in an operation.
Some examples that I can think of right off hand:
The hoe operator that digs the bell hole for RCP without having to wait to be told by the groundman to mark out where it's going to be.
The hoe operator that honks his horn to tell the truck he's loading to go just as he starts to dump into the box on his last pass because he knows it takes a few seconds for the truck to begin to move.
The hoe and loader operators that don't sit there and wait for trucks when there is a lull in the cycle. They are always moving, building a pile close to the loadout so that in the event he gets slammed with several trucks in a row, he's got a really short cycle to get them out of there in a hurry if he has to, and doesn't have to work the entire face.
The loader operator that doesn't wait with his bucket in the air for a truck to pull up and when they don't spot right, has to back up and readjust.
The loader operator that dumps a small pile of dirt in the haul road next to pile to keep trucks from crowding too close to him.
The blade operator that gets out of the way when laying gravel to allow the trucks to keep dumping, knowing that there are two seperate operations involved with gravel, the laydown & finish.
The dozer hand when dumping a string of trucks leaves the last few dumps in a ribbon for a later time if he wants them to start another, backs up and catches the trucks instead of letting them come all the way down to the end of the fill with their load.
There are more little things than that, just what I could come up with quickly.
I may not have been operating since 1975, but I have been in this business long enough to see operators that do the things I mentioned above and I have seen operators that don't do the things above, and I tell you what, it wasn't always age or years operating the separated the two.
And I have also seen and heard operators that when shown or told the things I mentioned above, (not necessarily by me either) nod and say "yeah, that makes sense" then two hours later go back to what they were doing before.
terrasmooth
Well-Known Member
Thank you kindly Rabia , I appreciate you taking time to read it... hope it helps in some way.This blog shows your great effort. It is worth seeing.