Terex-2003-860 Backhoe -TurboCharger Problem?

[DoubleNickel]

Hi Everyone: I haven't been posting for some time. I have a problem with my 2003 Terex 860 backhoe. I only have 335 hours on it. In the fall (November) the tractor started just quitting on me. Run a little and stop, run a little and stop. Well it was cold so I said to myself, ah I gotta change the fuel filter, I'll wait till spring.

Well last week I changed the fuel filter and it continued to run and stop, run and stop. So I put additive in the tank to see if any moisture was in the fuel. I notice no water while changing the filter. Run and stop, run and stop. I also could hear a small knocking in the engine.



Then I checked the Primary Air filter. It was somewhat dirty. Took the shop-van and sucked it clean. Took it to my brothers for a job and also compare it to a new air filter, yup it was dirty, but not that dirty and changed it. It's been running now for 4 hours, but It seems not to have the power it had.

I wonder if the turbocharge is working, I don't hear any spooling noise, I'm not sure but I don't remember hearing any spooling noise since I have owned it. I could alway hear the turbo spinning when I shut down my 92 MF Backhoe.

On my way to my brothers, there is a big hill and it just didn't seem to have the power, even in first, I didn't think I was gonna make the a large hill on the way back. When I rev the engine, I can only get 2200 RPM, this normal? red line is 2300. I had a problem getting up a hill coming back. I drove up this hill many times with no problems before.
I think I got a problem, any help will be appreciated. Thank you,


DoubleNickel

Oh, the knocking seem to go away. Hmm

 

[RenoF250]

Not familiar with that engine in particular but 2 things I would look into. Have you ever run it out of fuel? If you get air in the lines it can cause problem quite awhile later. Also, on my truck the is an exhaust back pressure valve that closes to help the engine heat up quicker. That could be stuck or broken causing problems. On my truck it is right under the turbo.

 

[willie59]

You should be able to take the piping off of the turbo inlet and see if it's working with the engine running, just be very careful not to let anything near the inlet when it's running. Does the turbo have a wastegate valve? I still haven't figured out how the "run a little and stop" problem got solved? :beatsme

 

[RenoF250]

You should be able to take the piping off of the turbo inlet and see if it's working with the engine running, just be very careful not to let anything near the inlet when it's running. Does the turbo have a wastegate valve? I still haven't figured out how the "run a little and stop" problem got solved? :beatsme

That seems to be risky with little reward. If it spins freely with your finger it will definitely spin with the engine running whether it is really creating boost or not.

What about putting a boost gauge on it? That should be relatively cheap and could be useful for the future.

 

[willie59]

That seems to be risky with little reward. If it spins freely with your finger it will definitely spin with the engine running whether it is really creating boost or not.

Unless there's something wrong with the exhaust turbine side. I've seen stranger things happen. If it spins with your fingers, it "should" turn running. I just like to see it for sure. It's really not that hard or risky to do this, just wanted to point out to DoubleNickle to insure the area is tidy.

 

[RenoF250]

Unless there's something wrong with the exhaust turbine side. I've seen stranger things happen. If it spins with your fingers, it "should" turn running. I just like to see it for sure. It's really not that hard or risky to do this, just wanted to point out to DoubleNickle to insure the area is tidy.

I am just used to my luck, I would check all over and it would still find some label or rag to suck in there.

 

[willie59]

I am just used to my luck, I would check all over and it would still find some label or rag to suck in there.

Reno, now that's a funny mental picture! You mean, like a rag that was 5 miles across town that happened to be picked up by the wind and carried to you and while you were standing there watching the turbo the rag zero'd in on your turbo like it was guided by a lazer??? :Banghead :lmao :drinkup

 

[RenoF250]

Reno, now that's a funny mental picture! You mean, like a rag that was 5 miles across town that happened to be picked up by the wind and carried to you and while you were standing there watching the turbo the rag zero'd in on your turbo like it was guided by a lazer??? :Banghead :lmao :drinkup

Sure wouldn't be the first time. Too many times just as my brain was saying make sure no ... DOH!!!!! it happens.

 

[DoubleNickel]

Run and stall, run and stall, got resolved when I cleaned the secondary air filter, seeing that, I installed a new filter.
It stays running now What symtoms would show up if the turbo was not operating right? Would it run at all? It just doesn't feel like the turbo kicks in or power kicks in. It will go full throttle to 2200 rpms. I don't know how high rpms can go on a tractor like this.

Can it run without the turbo working, I guess that's my main question?

Thanks for the responces. Keep them coming. I just don't want to damage the engine if thats possible in this case.:usa

DoubleNickel

PS: Could be just in my psyche to, but I don't think so.:beatsme

 

[willie59]

Yes, the engine would still run if turbo was not working, it would just have less horsepower between, say, 1,600 to 2,200 rpm. It has no effect on engine "going" to full throttle, just how much horsepower is there at full throttle. 2,200 rpm is about normal max goverened rpm on a diesel. What kind of engine does the machine have?

 

[RenoF250]

HAve you checked for exhaust obstructions? Besides a back pressure valve you could have a crushed pipe or baffle plugging a muffler.

 

[DoubleNickel]

ATCOEQUIP: Perkins 1004-40T, Displacenment 3.99 litres, cylinders 4, bore stroke 100x127, Fuel injection Fastran direct, compression 17.25:1, sae J 1394 horsepower 71.5kW (96hp) @ 2200 rpm, iso 9249 horsepower 66.5 kW (hp) @2200rpm, iso 9249 maxium torque 371 Nm @ 1400 rpm, Air filter Dry type-Two stage- Restriction indicator.

Restriction indicator did not come, hmm


Thank you,:notworthy
DoubleNickel

 

[willie59]

Yeah, we have a lot of ground to cover here RenoF250. I still don't have enough info to work with. If the air filters were clogged up, there would be low power and should have been black smoke because of a rich fuel/air mixture, not enough oxygen to burn the fuel put out by the injection system. Is the fuel system working properly? Is their a wastegate valve that's stuck open? Does the injection pump have a turbo boost line that goes from the intake manifold to the injection pump? I think the first thing we need to do is check that the turbo is producing pressure. The ideal way is with a boost gauge and compare to the engine specs. If that's not available, you should be able to remove piping coming out of turbo, rev engine up, and see if it's putting out good air pressure. This is a little safer method than removing turbo intake piping with engine running.

 

[willie59]

ATCOEQUIP: Perkins 1004-40T, Displacenment 3.99 litres, cylinders 4, bore stroke 100x127, Fuel injection Fastran direct, compression 17.25:1, sae J 1394 horsepower 71.5kW (96hp) @ 2200 rpm, iso 9249 horsepower 66.5 kW (hp) @2200rpm, iso 9249 maxium torque 371 Nm @ 1400 rpm, Air filter Dry type-Two stage- Restriction indicator.

Restriction indicator did not come, hmm


Thank you,:notworthy
DoubleNickel

I had a feeling the Terex used Perkins engines. I would be surprised if the turbo was bad on a machine with just 300 something hours on it, but I am concerned about severely clogged air filters and how much dust got through them. I'm not certain about your Perkins, but most I have worked on have a strainer screen inside the fuel lift pump. Take a look at you lift pump and see if it has what looks like a cover on top of it with a screw in the center. If so, remove the screw and pull off the cover and you'll find a strainer screen in there that might be clogged.

 

[DoubleNickel]

A good mechanic isn't expensive, he's priceless! Right on there bro.

You just may be right with the strainer. I did not take that apart and clean. It says to do that when replacing the filter. When priming, I remember I could feel it pump some fuel and then felt like nothing. You are smart! Thats the first place to start. I will clean it tomarrow. I bet your right!!

Sincerely,

DoubleNickel

PS: Then I will take it to an even bigger hill down the road. I bet yo right, yuppers. Well maybe.

 

[willie59]

A good mechanic isn't expensive, he's priceless! Right on there bro.

You just may be right with the strainer. I did not take that apart and clean. It says to do that when replacing the filter. When priming, I remember I could feel it pump some fuel and then felt like nothing. You are smart! Thats the first place to start. I will clean it tomarrow. I bet your right!!

Sincerely,

DoubleNickel

PS: Then I will take it to an even bigger hill down the road. I bet yo right, yuppers. Well maybe.

Now let's not go countin' our yard trotters 'till they hatch. I "hope" I'm right and it fixes your problem, then I'll be happy as a hardwood tree.

 

[DoubleNickel]

Oh, just my luck, the fuel lift pump is a sealed unit. No screw on top of the dome and the 5 screws that hold the dome on are rivited The owners and parts manual show the opposite. It show it comes apart.

I forgot to tell you that a lot of pressure builds up in the fuel tank, like I mean alot. You run it for an hour and unscrew the fuel cap, it will actually pop off. I told my brother, that can't be normal (but he never saw the pressure), but he says it's normal to have pressure in the tank, but that much?

It does have a breather hole on top of the fuel cap. You can hear it hissing out when not running. Hmm, maybe the pressure is not releasing fast enough?

Now, why would they make it a sealed unit. It shows its got a screen in it. Do I have to buy a whole unit? That don't make sense. I am trying to find a filter after the fuel tank, but I don't believe there is one.

I believe the fuel goes through the fuel lift pump first, then the water seperator and the filter to the pump. I guess.

Just my luck on this lift pump, all happy to do the job, pop the hood and see that I could take the pump off and drill the rivets, look for the screen and tap the holes for screws. It does have the gasket between the dome and the base. Somethings in there. ah, just my luck:duh

DoubleNickel

 

[DoubleNickel]

ah, I better go back to bed. There's no rivets. There's 5 screws that screw up from the bottom. 4 bolts hold it on with a input and output line.

It's a (ULPK0034) Perkins Lift Pump--That's the # in my parts manual--googled it and it came right up.

I guess I take it off, as you can't get to the screws from underneath, well I better go out and make sure about dat. I get out of bed again first:sleeping

DoubleNickel

 

[DoubleNickel]

:sleepingWell, back to bed again. Crawled under, looked up. There rivets peened underneath. Felt like screws from the top. I bet there is a screen in there:dizzy?


http://www.swdieselinc.com/ULPK0034_Perkins_Lift_Pump_p/ulpk0034.htm

 

[willie59]

If the lift pump is riveted together, it's unlikely there's a screen in there. I'm puzzled over the fuel tank pressure though. If it's building enough pressure to pop the cap when your loosening it, that seems odd to me. :beatsme Have you tried running the machine with the fuel cap loose and see how it acts?