Question for Nige

[Shimmy1]

I don't have the serial number because it's some farmer, but the machine is a 2004 Caterpillar 420D. Question was what to use in the transmission, front axle, and rear axle. It's not a 4-wheel steer.

It should use TDTO 30 in the trans, TDTO 30 in the front axle, and MTO 30 in the rear axle. The guy decided to use CNH HyTran in the trans, and 85-90 gear oil in the front and rear axles. Thoughts??

 

[AzIron]

In the axels if your not in supper cold weather 90 it is going to be fine

The hytran probably is going to be fine its all about oil specs
420 d had the zentwen transmission as well as the c series and that's also the a simalar trans to the one zemtwen makes for deere backhoes now and they run hygaurd in that those transmission seem to have a wide tolerance on oil specs

 

[Shimmy1]

I wouldn't be terribly concerned so much about the trans, either. The axles I feel are the main problem. Book states you can use 50 in the front for temps 50-122F. 80-90 is not going to do very well in the hubs in cooler temps. Also, doesn't that machine have inboard wet brakes? Gear oil isn't the best plan for them, is it?

 

[Delmer]

Wet brakes would be my biggest concern also. Gear oil is a different scale than engine oil, 50 is close to 80w90 gear oil.

 

[kshansen]

Wet brakes would be my biggest concern also. Gear oil is a different scale than engine oil, 50 is close to 80w90 gear oil.

Agree not sure 80W90 will play nice with wet brakes. I know for the front end loaders (980's) from Cat we had at the quarry with wet brakes we used Mobiltrans HD50 and added Cat 1U9891 additive to each planetary.

Without that additive the brakes would make bad noises and not stop smooth. Seem I recall adding about a pint to each hub and drive around for a few minutes and all was nice and smooth again.

Was told that if you used Genuine Cat Oil it came with the additive already in the oil.

 

[AzIron]

In a machine that old with Manny hours the wet brakes are probably not an issue if they still work especially if they are still the brass version mid series updates on the d series went a kevalar type pad that lasted a lot longer so in that instance the oil will probably matter a great deal

 

[Nige]

The guy decided to use CNH HyTran in the trans, and 85-90 gear oil in the front and rear axles. Thoughts??

He's likely to be replacing Duo-cones in the rear end in short order. The Toric Rings don't like the additives in EP oil, it turns them into jelly.

The rear axle is the kicker. It all depends on what type of brake discs it has in it - which is going to be S/N-dependent unless anyone has been into the brakes at some point in the past.


(2) Add one quart of 197-0017 Axle and Brake Oil Additive. Do not add to final drives.
(3) A commercial fluid that meets Ford/New Holland M2C134-D specification.
(4) Add 150 mL (5.1 oz) of 197-0017 Axle and Brake Oil Additive. Do not add to final drives.
(5) Do not use Cat MTO or commercial M2C134-D specification oil with the 230-4017 brake disks.

EDIT: The info above is for a machine with an FDP S/N prefix. Other models of 420D may be different - TBH I didn't look.

 

[Shimmy1]

He's likely to be replacing Duo-cones in the rear end in short order. The Toric Rings don't like the additives in EP oil, it turns them into jelly.

The rear axle is the kicker. It all depends on what type of brake discs it has in it - which is going to be S/N-dependent unless anyone has been into the brakes at some point in the past.

View attachment 303821
(2) Add one quart of 197-0017 Axle and Brake Oil Additive. Do not add to final drives.
(3) A commercial fluid that meets Ford/New Holland M2C134-D specification.
(4) Add 150 mL (5.1 oz) of 197-0017 Axle and Brake Oil Additive. Do not add to final drives.
(5) Do not use Cat MTO or commercial M2C134-D specification oil with the 230-4017 brake disks.

EDIT: The info above is for a machine with an FDP S/N prefix. Other models of 420D may be different - TBH I didn't look.

The book says MTO in the rear axle.

 

[Nige]

The book says MTO in the rear axle.

Which book are you referring to.? Does the tractor owner have one.?

 

[Shimmy1]

Which book are you referring to.? Does the tractor owner have one.?

 

[Nige]

Do you have a Reference Number (top RH corner of front cover) and publication date for that book in the photos.?
Does the book refer to the particular machine model you are asking about.?