mismatched tires

[martinf]

Hey all,
I've got an AC M100B grader, mid sixties. Needs 4 new tires--both tandems. I can't afford new tires (don't use this old girl much), but I've found some used ones with 60-70% tread. Since I use this only on dirt and gravel, about 100 hours a year max, how crucial is it to have the tire circumference exactly the same on all four? I understand about the different circumferences tugging on the drive chains, but on dirt, where scuffing isn't such a big issue (I wouldn't think) how critical is this?

Also, the 4 tires I'm getting are two matched sets of two, so should I put the sets one pair on each chain box, so if there is some differences in rotational speed if would work the differential and instead of creating issues within a chain?

Lastly, Les Schwab is charging me 250 a piece for them. Seems reasonable?
thanks for any help!
~martin

 

[562C]

Makes sense to me, especially if you have a differential.... Price isn't way out of line if the tires are decent. You're using it about the same as I use mine, and I'd do it if I had a decent set of tires come up. I've got no diff in my old champion either!

 

[tireman]

Hey all,
I've got an AC M100B grader, mid sixties. Needs 4 new tires--both tandems. I can't afford new tires (don't use this old girl much), but I've found some used ones with 60-70% tread. Since I use this only on dirt and gravel, about 100 hours a year max, how crucial is it to have the tire circumference exactly the same on all four? I understand about the different circumferences tugging on the drive chains, but on dirt, where scuffing isn't such a big issue (I wouldn't think) how critical is this?

Also, the 4 tires I'm getting are two matched sets of two, so should I put the sets one pair on each chain box, so if there is some differences in rotational speed if would work the differential and instead of creating issues within a chain?

Lastly, Les Schwab is charging me 250 a piece for them. Seems reasonable?
thanks for any help!
~martin

First of all,what brand and ply rating are the tires you're referring to? And yes,that's the way I'd install them.Make sure that whoever mounts them for you takes the time to wire brush the bead of the wheel as well as the o-ring gutter and the bead band where the o-ring seals so that they seal properly.Also check the rubber grommets on the valves to make sure they aren't cracked/dried up.DO NOT let anyone talk you into putting tubes in them.STAY TUBELESS!!

 

[martinf]

First of all,what brand and ply rating are the tires you're referring to? DO NOT let anyone talk you into putting tubes in them.STAY TUBELESS!!

Two are Michelins and two are Goodyears. Tell me more about why you feel so strongly about staying tubelless. I think the Les Schwabbies are gonna tell me that, since the rims are old and rusty they wanto tput tubes in to make sure that they hold air! I don't want to have to hassle with flats out in the field but, at 80 bucks a pop, I''d sure rather NOT have to put in tubes. Educate me, please!
~martin

 

[tireman]

There are many reasons to stay tubeless.First,and foremost,that's the way they're supposed to be.Tubeless tires have many advantages over tube-type.They run cooler because there's no friction between the tube and flap(the other required piece to go tubed that they haven't told you you'll end up paying for.Tube-type tires come with flaps,but they'll charge you for them in your scenario.Without them,the rust on the rim base will puncture the tube.) and tire.Another advantage is that if you pick up a nail/screw/stick,etc. and it remains in the tire,it's just a slow leak because it's filling the hole,restricting air loss.If there's a tube in the tire,there's a hole in the tube,which loses air into the inside of the tire,where it can escape from not only the injury but the beads and the o-ring channel and the valve hole-none of which are seals in a tubed tire.As far as the wheels being rusty,well they're supposed to clean the mounting surfaces when mounting a tire anyway.That is proper procedure,although it's nowhere near as common a practice as it should be.The only places that need to be rust/dirt free are the beads of the wheel,the o-ring gutter and the ledge on the bead-band(the ring that's behind the lock ring) where the o-ring seals and the area around the valve hole for the grommet to seat.If they don't wanna properly clean the wheels with a wire wheel,refuse to buy the tires.Worst case scenario,if the wheels are that severely rusted,have them sandblasted.You should be able to get that done a lot cheaper than 80 bucks a pop.All you really need to have is an angle(or air) grinder with a braided wire wheel and a little time to descale them.Besides,a new valve stem(worst case scenario)and o-ring per wheel is less than the price of a tube.Bottom line is there are NO advantages to putting tubes in and many advantages to staying tubeless.Oh,you can always plug a tubeless tire in a pinch out in the field.Can't do that with a tube.A good tire service man knows what needs to be done to "make sure they hold air",and installing tubes is not it.Always,however,insist on a new o-ring every time.
Assuming that the Good-fer-nothings are radials(don't buy them if they're not)you'll be fine with the two pairs.Keep them together on the same side of the machine.They'll dry rot before you'll ever wear them out.DO NOT mix bias and radial on the drive axles.If you have any issues,PM me and I'll give you my phone number and hopefully be able to at least prevent you from being taken by a shady deal or line of BS.

 

[DonBC]

I have an AC D grader and there is no differential so it is important to me to have matched tires on all four drive wheels as I have to travel some on paved roads. If the M100 has a differential then keep the matched sets on each side. A little bit of motion on the differential gears would not be a problem. This is similar to having dual wheels on a truck. If you can only afford to buy two new tires you put both new tires on the same side and the two used tires on the other side and never mix a new tire and an old tire on the same side. I guess it depends on how old the M100 is as to whether it even has rims designed for tubless tires.

 

[Radrock]

I haven't heard if all four tires were bias or radials either as that would be a big no no. If it were me and I had two tires that were a little large than the other two I would want to put the taller tires on the right side. You probably wouldn't really know the difference

 

[martinf]

DO NOT mix bias and radial on the drive axles.If you have any issues,PM me and I'll give you my phone number and hopefully be able to at least prevent you from being taken by a shady deal or line of BS.

Maybe this is a stupid question, but why is mixing bias and radials a big no no? Is it mainly an issue of the tire's circumference?
And thanks for the offer of assistance...I'll definately keep that in mind as this plays out. Right now the tires are enroute from the source to my local Les Scwab. I've got a call in to find out if any of them are radials...I don't believe so, but I'll double/check.
thanks again all.
~martin

 

[tireman]

Michelin does not make a bias ply tire,so there is no question about their construction.You don't mix bias and radial because they perform completely different.Radials flex,bias don't.Mixing them will over stress the bias tires and cause the radials to develop an irregular wear pattern from which there is no escape,thereby causing both to wear out or fail prematurely.Your machine won't handle or perform the way it's supposed to.Anyone that's ever had a machine with bias then went to radials can attest to the difference in the two.

 

[Radrock]

Maybe this is a stupid question, but why is mixing bias and radials a big no no? Is it mainly an issue of the tire's circumference?
And thanks for the offer of assistance...I'll definately keep that in mind as this plays out. Right now the tires are enroute from the source to my local Les Scwab. I've got a call in to find out if any of them are radials...I don't believe so, but I'll double/check.
thanks again all.
~martin

Looks like tire man answered that question. I have ran both. Radials have more give to them and make an excellent ride when plowing snow and general grading. However if you are riding a slope I would rather have a bias tire as the radial will tend to roll on you. That might not be as critical using a wide tire but I have never had that option before.

 

[martinf]

Michelin does not make a bias ply tire,so there is no question about their construction..

Just heard back about the tires and I spoke incorrect--the two are not michelin and though I don't know yet what brand, they are definately bias. So, that's good. Now I'll just have to see what the Les Schwab boys say about the tube/no tube issue when they they get the old tires busted off. Tireman, if I have any problems with that I'll give you a shout...thanks for your assistance.
~martin

 

[tireman]

There should be no issue with the tube/tubeless situation.YOU are the customer.You want your tires tubeless.End of discussion.Glad to help,anytime.Best of luck.

 

[toomanymachines]

If the tires are that bad that they need tubes, you should look elsewhere.

 

[tireman]

How did your purchase adventure turn out there,Martin?I'm assuming things went well?