John Deere 410 rear axle replacement

[Eagle 1]

I am replacing the rear axle on my john deere 410 backhoe (1983 I think).
The question I have is how to properly torque the bolt that screws into the axle shaft on the planetary pinion carrier. The book says to torqe the bolt 180-240 foot lbs to get the preload set to 8-12 lbs, which I understand, however do you have to then remove the bolt to install the lockplate?
If I am understanding the book, the lockplate is installed after the bolt is torqued which doesn't make sense to me.
If anybody can help, thanks.

 

[GOINGBROKE]

Eagle 1
Torque the axle nut so that you have a rolling torque of 8-12 ft lbs then install the lockplate. It should fit over the bolt head. The updated procedure is to install 2 lead balls between planetary and axle, torque, remove and build a shim pack the thickness of the lead balls. Then your final torque is much higher. This is the method I use on ag tractors and sure they are the same axle.
Could get more info it if your interested

 

[Eagle 1]

Oh I see, the locking plate slides over the outside of the bolt head to keep the bolt from sliding out after you get the rolling torqe set.

Now this step makes more sense:
31. Install lockplate (29) on screw (30) and planetary pinion carrier (32). Tighten screw as required to seat lockplate.


Heres the story behind this axle job. When I bought the tractor, the planetary gears were stripped and locked up. I bought a used complete axle assembly on line that was suppose to be good. Evidently somebody had worked in it before because the locking tab was on first and then the bolt slid through the hole. I lasted that way about a year before it stripped out the axle and the assembly came apart. This explains why the bolt stripped out the axle.
So where do you get the lead balls? The JD house possibly?
Also I am interested in any information you can provide me.
Thanks.

 

[clay digger]

Where to find lead balls?

Shotgun shells... at least in the old days before they made us buy steel shot....:Banghead

 

[coalrulz]

Solder works well also. Just install under planetary assembly tighten down until get correct rolling drag, then remove planetary and measure solder/lead ball and install that thickness of shim. Reverify rolling drag after reinstalling planetary. Sometimes the lock plate has tendancy to fall off of bolt head, just put sticky grease to help keep this from happening when mating axle to diff housing.

 

[Eagle 1]

I have plenty of solder, so I will probably use that.
So just to clarify, the solder will go in place of the shims (leave the shims out) first to make a pattern so I will know the thickness of shims I need?

I had already thought of the grease and you confirmed it.
Thanks for the tips.
I got the fender removed and come Tuesday I will start removing the axle housing.
I'm sure I will have more questions to come.

 

[clay digger]

Yes. Measure the thickness of both pieces of solder with a micrometer and average the two readings. That should give you the thickness of the required shim pack. If you want a little preload on the bearing, subtract a couple of thou.

 

[Eagle 1]

Well I got it torn down today and it was a little worse than I expected. The outer bearing had failed and the axle done damage to axle housing where the outer oil seal goes. I still have the original housing but I will have to swap the ring gears. Is there a special puller that I will need to do this or will I have to fab one?

I am also going to swap the planetary housing, the needle bearings on the gears and the thrust washers. Also the brake disc while I am at it. When I'm done I don't want to have to tear into this again.

 

[Eagle 1]

I am still waiting on some parts to come in before I start reassebling, but I have been thinking about this.
The outer bearing is lubed by grease via the fitting on the housing. My question is, should I pack that bearing with grease after I slide it on the axle or will this interfer with the axle bearing preload?

 

[clay digger]

You should coat the bearing cone and race well. This should not affect any preload. In my experience these bearings only need grease once or twice a year unless you're using it all day every day. I have seen farm tractors with the whole housing full of grease!

 

[Eagle 1]

I finally got all my parts in and the planetary housing I ordered is defective. The first planetary gear I installed hits the housing on one side and there is a good 1/4 gap on the other side. I called the company I got it from and tried to explain to them what was happening. So finally I took some pictures and emailed them. It was closing time for them, but the guy said they will send me another one. Of course these things are built overseas by the cheapest bidder and this what you get. I'm thinking about taking my old carrier to a machine shop and see if they can just repair it. Another thing I noticed is the new planetary slides down past the splines on the axle shaft and the old ones I have dont do this. I also think this will be a problem too when I get to the point of building the shim pack.
The first picture shows where the gear is hitting the planetary.





The second picture is the other side of the gear that is not touching at all.

 

[Eagle 1]

I got the replacement planetary and all the parts.
I done a rolling torque to 55 lbs and built a shim pack approximately .016 based on the readings of the two pieces of solder.
The book says to do a rolling torque of 180-240 on the bolt securing the planetary, so I torqued it to 180 lbs.
Then I spun the axle 3 times and checked the rolling torqe which should be 8-12 lbs, but it is about 19 lbs.
All three of the planetary gears stick out of the ring gear about 1/2 inch. (see pictures below)
Is this normal? Should the planetary gears go flush with the ring gear on the outside?
If so, do I need to just torque it more and the recheck the rolling torque?
Thanks.

 

[Eagle 1]

I'm still working on this, but now I am waiting on the new brake disc to come in.

 

[Eagle 1]

The after market brake disc I ordered online had a problem with the splines and would not fit the sun gear shaft.
So I sent that one back and ordered one from John Deere. It came in today and had the same problem. So the salesman at RDO called John Deere and talked to one of their representatives on the phone. It turns out this is not the first time this has happened. Come to find out the manufactor of the brake disc (over seas of course) stamped out the wrong measurements on the splined part of the disc. Needless to say they had to order another brake disc. I left them the sun gear shaft so when the brake disc comes in they can see if it will fit. Frustrating to say the least.

 

[Eagle 1]

Update:

I finally got the right brake disc in and everything back together last week.
Thanks for the post replies.

 

[willie59]

I bet you're glad to get that thing put back together Eagle 1.

 

[Eagle 1]

Oh yea, I even used it this morning. We are adding on to our house and I used the bucket to lift 3 squares of shingles, decking etc. up on to the roof of the house.

 

[Aruba1]

After closing up everything how did you bleed your brakes? I still have issues with mine, I have no brakes on the side of the axle I took off but the opposite side has good brakes.

 

[Eagle 1]

I didn't have any problems bleeding the brakes. I just had somebody pump them up, and I bled them at the bleeder valve. I did replace the brake disc while I was in there.