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John Deere 310D Reverser

Discussion in 'Tractor/Loader/Backhoes' started by Bandit305, Jan 24, 2015.

  1. Bandit305

    Bandit305 New Member

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    Do you have to remove the torque converter when you remove and replace the reverser unit in a 1993 John Deere 310D Backhoe? All the info I see in manuals show pulling the reverser and torque converter as a unit.
     
  2. Deon

    Deon Senior Member

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    Although I don't yet need to do this I would also like to know the answer to this question. Any one that knows the old Case backhoes will also be able to help as the 580s built throughout the 1980s use the same Borg Warner reverser so the process should be the same.
     
  3. melben

    melben Senior Member

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    The converter can be left in place as long as you have rearward room enough to disengage and clear the input shaft. I spent many years as an Case tech and have rebuilt many dozens of them and the way Case installs them the converter cannot be removed till the PS unit is on the floor.

    Case sells individual parts kits, seal , bearing, clutch and all these kits will rebuild a BW JD shuttle as well as Case. The only difference I saw in the JD reverser's internal parts and Case was that JD uses a fiborous reverse lining and Case is solid sintered brass, The Case front pump will work as well but I stayed with a JD converter because of differences in engine ratings, etc. At the time a Case rebuilt converter was in the $300. range and the JD was over $1000 but may have been a new unit.

    IIRC, the directional spool is sealed a bit differently but I had excellent results on ones I did.

    HTH.

    Mel
     
  4. Deon

    Deon Senior Member

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    Mel, thanks for this info. We love guys with your experience. I'm attaching a photo of the underside of the 310D. Does it look like there is enough room to remove the shuttle once the drive shaft is removed? Also, how many hours would one expect from a shuttle like this between rebuilds and is it wise to replace the torque converter at the same time or do they normally last a lot longer? We're you using the Case parts on the directional spool as well?
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jan 24, 2015
  5. melben

    melben Senior Member

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    you should have plenty of room by the pic you have posted. I had no problem on the JD I did. On Case units we remove the fill tube before dropping it.

    Many people reuse the torque converter but I do not recommend it. The TC rotates at engine speed and any sludge or particles from clutch failure will be thrown to the outside like a centrifugal filter on some engines.

    I would imagine a good independent transmission shop has equipment to clean and flush the converter and give a opinion on reuse, I just don't think it wise to do a fresh rebuild and reuse a TC that has 5-6 thousand hours on it.

    When u get it on the floor send a pic of the LH side directional spool area, it has been many years.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2015
  6. Deon

    Deon Senior Member

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    Thanks again Mel,
    My machine 9,100 hours and the shuttle and TC are still working perfectly but I bought it at 8,300 hrs so I don't know if it has been rebuilt or not. I know of a local 310C with 13,000 hours that is still running on the original shuttle and TC that have never been worked on. I'm just arming myself with as much info as I can for if or when it quits.
     
  7. melben

    melben Senior Member

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    That's a good plan many have been reused without incident, I guess when you are in a professional shop as I was you have to cover all bases. Good luck,
    I definatly would run it till it gives trouble, the forward clutch bellville washer was the biggest offender and when it failed you could lose fwd or it could lock in fwd and bind up when you try to reverse. 90 percent I'll bet are dropped for that reason.
    Mel
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2015
  8. Bandit305

    Bandit305 New Member

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    Just an update. I pulled the reverser and left the torque converter in place and it came out with no problem. Getting the reverser lined up in the torque converter on the reinstall maybe a bunch more fun. I will probably pull the torque converter anyway because the pump drive ears where a little chipped on the corners. I really didn't want to have to figure out a good way to support the engine. I worry about bending the oil pan. My forward clutch was totally fried and the Bellville washer was broken into two pieces.
     
  9. melben

    melben Senior Member

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    The C & D Cases has a similar issue with engine mounting, removal of the bell housing was required and support of the engine was always an issue also, the E series and up used a SAE bell housing so removal of the TC became a piece of cake as the mounts stayed in place.

    Ideally Case says to install a new cooler as well but that seldom if ever happens, However if the unit could be flushed thoroughly It would be advisable.

    Bandit, yours is the typical failure, If you have access I would advise you to get one for reassembly, if read carefully it will save you much aggravation getting clutch plates lined up on the hub of the FWD clutch. If you do not have access to one get back to us and we will talk you through it, The first one of those I struggled with, reading the book the rest were easy.
     
  10. Bandit305

    Bandit305 New Member

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    I'll bite, what is the best way to line up the clutch plates.
     
  11. melben

    melben Senior Member

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    Put the shaft vertically in a vice and let it down to the slight raise at the hub, protected from damage of course, Leave the bearing out of the drum and you will have the flexibility to wiggle the splines into the plates. When the drum is down then install the bearing and snap rings. The first one I did I really made a fool out of myself.

    Be sure to select the proper snap ring to set up plate clearance, I like .015-.020, To tight and you will have clutch drag and not be able to shift.
     
  12. Monserandsons

    Monserandsons Well-Known Member

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    ive replaced everything in my reveser but my manuals do not tell me the clearances for the new front cover bushing to input shaft, also what is the correct method to size this bushing? bush part num is AT101012
     
  13. Monserandsons

    Monserandsons Well-Known Member

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    this is why i didnt take it to a "pro" likely this and all the other technical stuff wouldve been skipped. anybody can replace the discs!
     
  14. Johnp19

    Johnp19 Member

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    Yesterday afternoon my 2wd '94 310D lost reverse. I could not move the transmission shift lever unless I shut off the engine. I could then shift and restart the engine. When in reverse the rear wheels were locked as they skidded when I pulled myself back with the hoe. With the shuttle shifter in neutral the rear wheels turned when pulling myself backwards. I believe forward still works, but forward was not a direction I could go at the time. From the comments Melben made it sounds like my problem could be the forward clutch bellville washer. Any thoughts or comments?

    This backhoe only has 4000 hours on the hobbs. It was owned by a rental company and then a local contractor who probably never did any maintenance based on what I found after purchasing it. I changed all of the fluids and filters when I got it several years ago and have only put a couple of hundred hours on it. It worked fine until yesterday. Does anyone have any recommendations for where to get a service manual? I have to go out of town for work for several days and am hoping to start working on this next week.

    Thanks,

    John
     
  15. Johnp19

    Johnp19 Member

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    I just opened up the reverser. The reverse clutch looked great, which worried me a bit since I lost reverse. However, when I pulled out the shaft from the forward gears about six pieces of the belville washer came out. Everything else look great. There was very little in the pan or filter. The belville washer has numerous cracks on the remaining unbroken section. I think I will just replace the washer as everything else looks good. The hoe only has about 400 hours on it an I only use it around home. I'm not looking forward to reinstalling it but I am glad that it appears to be a simple fix.
     
  16. Johnp19

    Johnp19 Member

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    he washer is included with the seal kit, PN A502002. I just ordered one from reliable aftermarket parts. I found the washer itself on the case parts list, PN D50047, but I need some of the seals and gaskets. Below is a picture of the washer. 310D Bellville Washer.jpg