HELP - I am pulling my hair out and I am already BALD...

[YourPalAL]

Hi Everyone,

I am new to the forum and have a real head scratcher. Equipment is a 2006 Bandit 250 XP with the John Deere 4045. It has an electronic DE10 injection pump.

Ultimate Problem = NO START >>>>>>>>>>>>> HOWEVER - when I use Ether in the air intake it starts and runs PERFECTLY ------ And stays running perfectly even when Ether is stopped. As soon as I shut it down it needs the spray to get it going again (hot or cold does not matter).

I have checked the as much of the wiring as possible (i have a schematic) however this is a brush chipper so the wiring is not the best for sure. I have had the DE Injection pump rebuilt as it was leaking from the weep hole on the bottom and I thought that the control solenoid may have been the issue.

I have checked the output of the crank sensor and it is at 140 - 160Hz when the ECM is unplugged and the engine is cranking.

I am now thinking ECM (RE532628 L12 / 12v EXT) however this is a Major purchase especially right after a new injection pump was installed.

What ECM inputs are required to begin the injection during cranking? Am I missing something obvious..... ?

ANY HELP WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.

YourPalAL

 

[Cliffy]

I would get injectors tested,
I have seen this issue a number of times (not jd) where worn injectors have excessive leak off and wont build rail pressure to crack pintal.
They will normally start on ether.

 

[YourPalAL]

Very interesting reply Cliffy. Thanks so much for the speedy reply as well.

Do the injectors leak off immediately? My problem happens the second i shut it off and then try to restart.

Also this is not common rail injection. Does that make a difference?

 

[Truck Shop]

how many hours on this piece?

 

[YourPalAL]

easy 17 years of operation... hr meter is not working anymore

 

[YourPalAL]

tones of power and chips amazing... just this starting issue is the problem

 

[Truck Shop]

easy 17 years of operation... hr meter is not working anymore

so average hours of operation each week for the last 17 years?

 

[YourPalAL]

3 to 4 hrs a day - 5 days a week. = 17680 hrs?

Not sure how long injectors are supposed to last.

 

[Truck Shop]

Any major engine work in that time>

 

[YourPalAL]

Nope, I don't think so.

 

[YourPalAL]

To test the excessive leak down injectors theory, do u think I can remove the high pressure lines at the pump and see if I have fuel spitting out during cranking ? This should prove if the ECM is controlling the pump or not...thoughts?
Your Pal Al

 

[mg2361]

Do you have a water separator fuel filter that has a clear bowl at the bottom? The seal for that bowl in place?

Engine serial number?

Any codes?

 

[YourPalAL]

No clear bowl on the water seperstor fuel filter. All seals on the filter assembly look good and are in place. I have no ability to retrieve any codes..
See Pic of serial number.
And thank you for helping.
Your pal Al

 

[YourPalAL]

I just did a voltage check on the power going to the.fuel control solenoid
There is NO 5v AC during cranking. This is very good to know however do I condem the ECM or is there an input that the ECM needs to zee
I have checked the crank sensor and it is working during cranking and running.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Your pal Al

 

[mg2361]

Serial plate is behind the fuel filter on the "side" of the block. Should begin with PE or CD.

Is this something that started all of the sudden or has gotten worse over time?

 

[YourPalAL]

I decided to pull the entire harness, nspect and make all connections more robust. I then found the 5v reference wire had rubbed through and was shorted to ground. This could cause some issues I am sure of that. I plan to reinstall the harness tomorrow and report back to you all.
YourPal AL

 

[YourPalAL]

OK folks. The problem is now fixed. There was a short in the 5v ref wire as shown in previous pic. I fixed that and then reinstalled the harness and it was better but different. Sometimes starting without ether and sometimes not depending on if i wiggled the harness. So I kept going further. In diagnosing I found green water intrusion fungus inside one of the main fuse holder wires. See Pic. Someone else probably jammed a test light in there years ago. I put a new one on and BINGO everything works amazing. Thanks for all your help people...it is nice to bounce ideas off other technicians.
Absolute Best Regards
YOUR pal AL