ford 4500 starting issues

[shopteacher 1]

I have a ford 4500 with a diesel and have some starting issues.

1st, it will not start without a shot of ether. I assume this is not a good thing. What is not functioning that is causing me to have to do this.

2nd. she does not want to start again after she has been running. If I shut her down and go to re-start it won't start until it have cooled down.

Any thoughts?

 

[oldseabee]

Have you bled the air out of the fuel system? Does your transfer pump have a priming lever on it? transfer pump could be worn out, it needs to supply a certain amount of pressure into the injector pump. Engine compression could be low, does the engine burn oil and blow blue smoke?

 

[shopteacher 1]

I have not had it long enough to know if it burns oil. It does put out a little smoke, I am not sure what color.

 

[Phil]

Seabee,
I'm not sure that he has a transfer pump, I think that model may just a gravity feed from tank.

Shopteacher,
Do you have a good fuel flow at the injection pump? Even when it won't restart? In other words are your fuel filters good and is your tank vented properly? Is fuel coming back into your tank via the return line when the engine is running? Phil

 

[daman]

What year 4500 do you have?

 

[mitch504]

I still have a 3400 and a 4500 for spare, occasional, or around the shop use, mostly to make my yard look full, but they are almost unkillable (if that's a word).
If they get air in them they sometimes refuse to sputter untill the injector lines are cracked (I even showed them the service manual where ford says just bleed the filter and the screw on the side of the injector pump). It could have a cracked fuel line between the tank and the pump and be sucking air which collects when it is stopped. Crack the injector lines when it is hot and refuses to start, see if you get bubbles. I don't think this is the problem though.
You should also check the pump timing.
I have seen an old ford with a worn out injector pump housing exhibit these symptoms but my money is on low compression. The compression rings could be bad with good oil rings (it does happen) or these old things are bad about leaking valves. I would start with a compression check I am sorry this is all out of order but I was writing as I was thinking.

 

[ror76a]

I have a 4500 that acts the same way (won't start without either, won't start when hot). The only way I can get it started when it's hot is to push start it, just hope the buckets are up. I suspect that the engine and/or injection pump is worn out. It does however still run alright, and for as often as I use it, it does not bother me too much. Mostly just when I am out of either or stall it in an inconvent situation.

 

[Tinkerer]

I ran Caterpillar D8s and D6s at work with those same identical problems. Also they would not run at idle speed. The throttle couldn't be slower that 1/4 speed or the motor would die. As soon as the shop foreman heard that either was being used on a hot engine a mechanic would be sent out and take off the fuel injection pump. They would then send it to a Cat dealership for repairs . When it was reinstalled the problems were gone.

 

[fishangler]

my 4500 started the same thing the other day had my brain in a tissy trying to figure out why it wouldnt start again.i noticed a little hint of smoke when i used ether.so i said not enough fuel so i checked filter and connections all was good.then by chance i checked the bolts from the filter line to the pump.theres a small plate that attaches to the pump body with 2 small bolts sure enough it had worked loose and was sucking air i tightend them up and she cranked and has been doing good since.thanks to my uncle for this 1 he told me as long as a diesiel gets fuel and electric to glow plugs itll run.so some smoke meant it was burning in cylinder just not enough fuel.so had to be a fuel issue.
hope this helps

 

[mitch504]

my 4500 started the same thing the other day had my brain in a tissy trying to figure out why it wouldnt start again.i noticed a little hint of smoke when i used ether.so i said not enough fuel so i checked filter and connections all was good.then by chance i checked the bolts from the filter line to the pump.theres a small plate that attaches to the pump body with 2 small bolts sure enough it had worked loose and was sucking air i tightend them up and she cranked and has been doing good since.thanks to my uncle for this 1 he told me as long as a diesiel gets fuel and electric to glow plugs itll run.so some smoke meant it was burning in cylinder just not enough fuel.so had to be a fuel issue.
hope this helps

You got a 4500 with glow plugs?

 

[fishangler]

well what ever it is that burns the fuel.im not a diesiel guy at all.just learning from hands on.

 

[daman]

No glow plugs in the cylinders in a 4500 just one thermostart in the intake to aid in cold starts,compression is what fires the fuel.