Erosion control

[jcrane]

I have been thinking about getting into erosion control. Primarily installing silt fence. I would like some opinions about the erosion control business and what the going rates are for silt fence. I am looking into a machine which slices silt fence into the ground rather than trenching. I'm located in Georgia.

Thanks

Jeff

 

[triaxle]

Erosion Control Business

The easiest was to get a current price list is to call a provider of silt fence services and ask for them to fax you a price list. Erosion Control Professionals in Dawsonville or All Points Eroision Control in Clermont are two Georgia silt fence vendors who have price lists and since most potential customers ask for a faxed price list, you have ready access to their price list as a potential customer.

I saw a demo of a earth slicing silt fence erector. It worked nicely but hilly terrain can change that quickly as can brush. The unit I saw did not do "type C" so I did not take it seriously but there are several larger environmantal services off GA 400 between Roswell and Cumming who supply environmental vendors who may sell the device you're looking for. Their names are Robert Hood and VECO.

Although there is lots of competition, the EPD is making sure theres plenty of work. The silt fencers we use are frustrated by the cut throat nature of the business and the seasonal nature of the business.

I have noticed that silt fence vendors in this area often install environmental blankets and do grassing, too.

 

[jcrane]

Triaxle, thanks for the reply. I have been looking at a machine called a Tommy. It looks like it will do a pretty good job. I'm not sure how well it will work in this Georgia clay though. Here is the link.
http://www.tommy-sfm.com

 

[2004F550]

We use the tommy on our JD 1070. It works great. You have to have a hydralic top link however.

 

[jcrane]

I have been talking to a friend that does lot clearing and foundation excavation work for new homes. He thinks that the erosion control business is going to become more and more important and there is a need good dependable contractors.
I was thinking about getting a skid steer with a trencher to start doing this work, but after doing some research it looks like their may be a better way. The folks that sell the Thommy say that slicing is much more efficient and will make a stronger fence than trenching does.
I have been seeing a lot of fence going in with wire fence backing. The video for the Thommy suggests that their method builds a better fence than the wire backed method and is easier to clean up and dispose of when the fence is removed. My concern is that wire may be required more in the future and I would have the wrong equipment.
These machines seem to work better with a compact tractor. They require a 30hp 4wd tractor or a 60 hp skid steer with tracks. They recomend the tractor. I trying to decide weather to go with the tractor or a skid steer. A trencher or a machine like the Thommy.

 

[triaxle]

There is no question that erosion control measures will increase.

There is agreement that several machines are able to put up silt fence but not type "c". (the stuff with the hog wire fence behind the fabric).

Every set of commercial plans or DOT plans require the Type "C".
Most plans with any water feature require type "C".

Most silt fence without hog wire is residential in nature.

In many places, residential silt fence is a market that may vanish during winter, so being able to do commercial silt fence is very important for your business to profit and last. Commercial projects pay better than residential and the install volumes are usually larger so you can't be businesslike and ignore your best potential market.

There are several silt fence operations that we subcontract. They expect to get 500' per day for each crew person. ( five man crew does 2500' per day)
We put up or hired erection of 26, 200 feet of silt fence last year on our 37 housesites and 3.2 miles of county roads.

They all use a bobcat with trencher to dig the fence line in and follow with a hand crew to erect the fence. The bobcat brings silt fence while the crew erects.
When it becomes steep they dig in the fence trench with matte axes.

Maybe it would be useful to talk to a successful silt fence crew in your area. Find out what they use and why.
Contractors, builders, developers, doctors, lawyers, and Indian Chiefs all know environmental issues will increase, but the people who are already making a living putting up silt fence may provide the most useful insights regarding equipment, technique, and most important, profit.

The tommy may be ideal for residential purposes but I can't help wondering why the silt fence pros aren't using it around here?

I would like to note that, increasingly, the silt fence guys are complaining to me that there are so many people doing silt fence now that the market has become over loaded and prices have fallen. I work the GA 400 corridor north of Atlanta, every area is different, thats why I suggest talking to the guys who are trying to make money doing what you're thinking about in your area.

Inspectors in this area will measure to verify the base of your silt fence is 6" sub-grade. The trencher approach seems to insure the depth. I would check to make sure the tommy ( basically a roll over plow with fence holding attachments) can penetrate clay and heavy soils to the install depth.

 

[jcrane]

I was wondering about the Georgia clay also. They also say a 30 HP tractor is the minimum, but that might be a little light for plowing in the Georgia clay.

Another thing that I was wondering about was driving the metal posts in our ground. In their video they show driving the posts in with the front end loader. I've never tried that.

Also the Tommy folks make a case that their method of installing fence is just as good as ,or better than fence with the hog wire backing but if the local agencies are requiring C3, then you have got to be able to do C3 or you have limited your business.

 

[nitescapes]

I use to be a foreman for an eriosion control contractor. We had a Tommy Style plow for silt fence and found it to be more of a pain in the butt the useful. The only time it was profitable was when it was a flat open lot with nothing to fight to put it in the ground.

However trying to use it in hilly terrain or in the woodline was a pain in the rear end. We ended up useing one of two machines to put in 99% of all of our fence. We used a Case maxi sneeker to trench it in, we also used a rubber tracked mini loader with a trencher atachment to trench it in. I usually tried my hardest to make sure that I had the tracked machine with me most of the time. We did alot of commercial devolpment work which means alot of putting in fence in the woods before any clearing was done.

With the mini loader I could go in with a 4-n-1 bucket and clear a trail where the fence was going and then switch attachments and go trench it in. The hand crew followed by one guy (sometimes two) setting posts and then two stretching and tying (or tacking) fence. Most of our work required chainlink backing which was nice since we could use a post drive to set post rather than a sledge. We could knock out some serious silt fence unless it was super poor conditions.

Another nice thing about the tracked machine is we would work rain or shine. I could still get up and down the hills 90% of the time when a tractor wouldnt. Another thing alot of the counties around here are starting to require is a dirt berm in front of two layers of "C" fence on large projects. On a few of our accounts we were also contracted to do these as well. So while the crew was putting in fence I would work on these berms. for bigger projects we would use a D3 to do them if there were alot of them.

But dont think it is all happy go lucky there are times when you could have a tank and it isnt going to help put it in. You have to resort to the old mexican backhoe and alot of sweat. I odnt know how hard your clay is in GA but up here in VA, in the summer its like diggin through a cement parking lot