1693TA
Senior Member
Took these to a guy this morning and brought back his trades. All New Holland stuff and only a couple years old I'd delivered new then. The excavator is larger than the trade, but the skid steer is an equal:
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End of year money:
- Thread starter 1693TA
- Start date
sillej
Well-Known Member
Does not even look broke in.
Welder Dave
Senior Member
The machines in the pic. are new. Curious how the New Holland machines to compare to Cat, JD, Tak, etc.?
1693TA
Senior Member
They really seem to do pretty good in comparison. The guy that traded for these is really rough on equipment and really the only problems either have had on the trade in units have been DEF injection pumping units. The skid steer has had two entry doors installed but that is operator error.
The trade excavator was an E-37 and an open operator station where this one is an E-57, (larger and full cab w/HVAC). The skid steer traded was a 237 series and the new one is a 337 which are basically the same machine. Both 74hp so just under the limit on emissions garbage. They do run well and are smooth.
They are the same models as the equivalent Case, just in different colors. The skid steers are true Case machines and are quite good, mini ex not so much. They are made by Hyundai and are nothing to write home about. I rented that exact same machine in the Case version last year, CX57c I believe, and it was so bad I took it back within 30min. Thing wouldn’t pull a greasy string of of cats a$$. Bucket breakout was less than my 3.5t Kubota and it didn’t have auto downshift on the tracks, so any slight hill or turn you had to stop and shift the tracks to low. Cab was pretty crude and rattled a lot, I think it only had 100-200hrs on it IIRC.
1693TA
Senior Member
None of that has been my experience at all with them. I've delivered either seven, or eight of the E-57 models this, and last year to local folks who use them often. Some are construction, some are farmers. Nary any problems of any kind except last year with the DEF pumping unit problems which plagued the line. A replacement is now implemented and no problems I've seen over the past six months at least.
Highest hour machine I remember was 2700 and that one is well maintained. I suspect the unit you had access to was lackluster in maintenance at best. I routinely pick up, and deliver them after service and minor repairs.
I'll ask but have never heard they are built by Hyundai. I will have this ascertained later this morning. I talk to a lot of people who ask me about several machines as they know I don't mislead and see a lot of them. I certainly don't want to misrepresent anything so will delve a bit deeper.
Sorry to read of your experiences.
Truck Shop
Senior Member
One has to remember---making an opinion about a certain model or brand of equipment that is
from a rental company--that just possibly has had a horrible first 200 hrs put on it is probably
not on the fare side----even though it still could be a turd.
from a rental company--that just possibly has had a horrible first 200 hrs put on it is probably
not on the fare side----even though it still could be a turd.
excavator
Senior Member
I've also found that you can take a Hitachi, paint it Kobelco colors and rent it to a confirmed Kobelco guy and it will be the best machine he's ever run. And vise versa.
I am a CASE guy largely. The NH 337 and the CASE version 370, perform well (similar to a 289D). Pretty popular since they don't have DEF but are large frame so you get the weight to push and the lifting capacities and breakout are strong. I haven't owned one but a company we do a lot of work with has a 370 and I have spent a lot of time in it. The updates made to the B series/300 series machines really solidified the machine. I still prefer running (which I own) the 450B, just for the power and increase capacities but for a lot of guys the 370B/337 make a lot sense.
The excavators I am not as keen on. I rented a 60C for a week. I thought the cab was the best part of the machine (machine was new). Well laid out ergonomically speaking. I just didn't find it that stable, I was pulling concrete with it, I thought the breakout was fine, it just wouldn't plant well. I much prefered my Taki 257. These are selling, so it probably just depends on what your used to and how picky you are. I think however that the Kobelco machines that they used to sell under CASE and NH were better running machines.
The excavators I am not as keen on. I rented a 60C for a week. I thought the cab was the best part of the machine (machine was new). Well laid out ergonomically speaking. I just didn't find it that stable, I was pulling concrete with it, I thought the breakout was fine, it just wouldn't plant well. I much prefered my Taki 257. These are selling, so it probably just depends on what your used to and how picky you are. I think however that the Kobelco machines that they used to sell under CASE and NH were better running machines.
Nothing wrong with the machine I rented as far as I could tell, just lack luster performance compared to other 6 ton mini excavators. The average user may not care, but when you have it side by side with other machines it is very noticeable. If you are digging stumps or clearing land the lack of breakout force is disappointing. It’s further compounded by the pin grabber type quick coupler they use.
I’m a big Case guy myself and was seriously considering one of their mini excavators. When I was talking to the Case sales rep about the mini excavators his reply was “We’ve had great luck with the 8-ton machines, people love them and we haven’t had one back in the shop.” He wouldn’t say anything bad about the smaller models but it was implied. The 8 ton and larger machines are made by Sumitomo, the smaller machines are made by Hyundai, take it for what it’s worth...
I’m a big Case guy myself and was seriously considering one of their mini excavators. When I was talking to the Case sales rep about the mini excavators his reply was “We’ve had great luck with the 8-ton machines, people love them and we haven’t had one back in the shop.” He wouldn’t say anything bad about the smaller models but it was implied. The 8 ton and larger machines are made by Sumitomo, the smaller machines are made by Hyundai, take it for what it’s worth...
fiat41b
Senior Member
Fiat bought the great O&K excavators up to the Rh25.5 which was the same machine as my Fiat Allis fx600 a 140.000lb 6yd ran all day long aside of a Cat 365clME excavator a great machine same machine as a New Holland EC600. Both the fiat fx600 and ec600 had the O&K name cast into their structure its no wonder what those machines were and are very good Fiat group bought Case Farm and construction New Holland and a few others the were partnered in the past with Hitachi and later Kobelco those joint ventured deals ended Fiat stands as the 3rd largest to this day in the heavy machinery Cat 1st then Komatsu 2nd go to your local case farm dealer and pic up a few items might have Fiat group written on them.
Welder Dave
Senior Member
New Holland heavy equipment is on the bottom of the totem pole as far as popularity and dealer support. How often do you see a New Holland dozer on a jobsite or even in general? They don't measure up. Even the newer backhoes that were originally sourced from Ford don't measure up to the old Ford machines and are nowhere near as popular for good reason. As far as Fiat being number 3 in heavy equipment you're also including farm equipment. Can John Deere add their farm and turf equipment to the heavy equipment category too? Some New Holland equipment is good, some not so much. Their farm equipment is generally good. The actual heavy equipment like dozers is likely to never be very popular. Case is generally good equipment and on par with other name brands.
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Old Growth
Well-Known Member
We have a nice Ford 555 and also a Ford/NH 575.
The triple nickel will run circles around that newer NH anyday. So much better quality, design and power.
The ol ford could scoop up a house. It got a ton of lifting force.
The only thing I like more about the NH is the noise. The turbo sure is quieter. The ol 555 is a loud ass rattly hoe.
Welder Dave
Senior Member
The 555 was a productive hoe. My dad worked at a Ford dealer for a couple years in the early 80's. The catalogue had a side by side comparison of all the most common backhoes in the 555 size. The operators all had to switch between different machines to keep it fair. The Ford 555 won both competitions in the first comparison and again when the B model came out. I think one competition was a 4' trench and the other one an 8' trench or something like that. I know a guy who worked for the city and he much preferred Ford hoes. He didn't like when they went to a curved back window though. It caused distortion in some sunlight situations. He was a good operator and came 2nd in a backhoe competition I think put on by Case.
When it comes to Skid Steers and CTL's, CASE and NH are the same thing minus some very subtle and inconsequential differences. Recently CASE expanded their backhoe line considerably, that includes some lower priced (NH similar) backhoes. The N series is still the top of the list, but they have other models now that span different price points and different uses. They now have a Utility model now that I think is an interesting, purpose built backhoe without a lot of the price laden options that the N series comes with standard.
NH years ago tried to make entry into the construction market, offering excavators, dozers and so forth. It was kind of a Chevy/GMC approach, using mostly CASE equipment, but not entirely. Clearly that didn't work. NH does well where they have traditionally done well. They do sell a lot of skid steers and CTL's and obviously farm equipment. Some guys prefer the NH relationship to the CASE relationship. Many have bought NH skid steers for decades before. They offer mini excavators (Same machines as CASE) and they sell, at least here, more than I would have thought they would.
Sometimes, as a lesson to all of us in business, it is best to stay where you are strong, and that was a lesson that was learned by NH and CNH. The NH brand was never able to cater fully to the heavy construction market, and they should have been able to recognize that before hand.
NH years ago tried to make entry into the construction market, offering excavators, dozers and so forth. It was kind of a Chevy/GMC approach, using mostly CASE equipment, but not entirely. Clearly that didn't work. NH does well where they have traditionally done well. They do sell a lot of skid steers and CTL's and obviously farm equipment. Some guys prefer the NH relationship to the CASE relationship. Many have bought NH skid steers for decades before. They offer mini excavators (Same machines as CASE) and they sell, at least here, more than I would have thought they would.
Sometimes, as a lesson to all of us in business, it is best to stay where you are strong, and that was a lesson that was learned by NH and CNH. The NH brand was never able to cater fully to the heavy construction market, and they should have been able to recognize that before hand.
Mike L
Senior Member
Welder Dave
Senior Member
New Holland was big in farm equipment. Their first skid steers were better suited for farm use and weren't built as tough as other brands like Bobcat. There was a reason you didn't see them on construction or even landscaping projects. They were poor for fine grading because you sat too low in them and couldn't see the bucket edge. New Holland were almost famous for making frames and such out of formed sheets of steel rather than using heavier structural sections like square tubing. Cracks in skid steer frames weren't uncommon. Trying to market New Holland in construction equipment was a mistake and I agree they should have known better. Case has dabbled in construction equipment for a long time slowly getting bigger and more powerful equipment to compete in the medium size market. Their backhoes are what really helped to establish them as major players in the lighter construction market. They have a very loyal following so that's where construction equipment should be marketed. The NH backhoes are a lower end option and not on par with the Case machines. However the older Ford backhoes were in the same league as Case backhoes. They were cheapened when they became NH machines. Probably so they weren't direct competition.
Willie B
Senior Member
Friends bought a few years ago a demo New Holland excavator. 5.7? metric ton & a big CTL. I haven't run the CTL, but I've run several mini excavators, it is best I've tried.
These people also have an early 2000s backhoe. It is no better than my case in many ways, but they make the point you can see over the hood. In every way it is equal to my Case.
Willie B
Senior Member
I hadn't noticed commonality with Case & New Holland. In fact I used a New Holland a couple weeks ago to load a truck 1 load. Took a while to familiarize myself with control placement, everything is different from Case.