drill bits, easy outs, taps

[Randy88]

After a cold day of fixing, due to broken bolts, drill bits and easy outs, I'm curious as to what everyone else uses for brands, that are good quality and also affordable, due to the fact they are after all a consumable items that has a fairly high turnover rate, due to many factors. Also taps and dies, which I've gone to only high speed steel, which has helped a lot but for hand tapping, so what brands do others use and recommend?

For drill bits we used to use triumph twist drill bits, maybe its just me, but it seems nowadays they are a one time use item if even that, we've been buying a brand that the name escapes me now, the welders shops in the area sell them, seem to last, but for some reason after some use, we don't even get to sharpen them, they just flat out snap off due to no real reason. I don't buy the sets of bits, we buy bulk of the sizes we use the most to have plenty on hand. Taps are bought the same way, along with dies to use as thread chasers mainly and due to the fact they get misplaced, or like yesterday, my 1/4 inch tap fell into the trench and I gave up looking for it so I hunted up another one out of the service truck, rather than make a 80 mile round trip to town to buy another one.

 

[mitch504]

I used to use only Turbomax bits, but then one of the big companies bought them out, changed the design but kept the name, then they disappeared. Now they are back out with the original design, I just bought some, we'll see how the quality is.

 

[Old Doug]

I use about any good brand that i can find. I dont have very good luck useing easyouts so i dont even try. The small easy outs brake and the bigger ones dont do the job most of the time so i end up drilling and retaping most of time. If i find a drill bit or a tap that has been broken i will regrind it. I step drill alot and i think its easyer and puts less stress on the bit. Any more if i have to tap threads in hard materials i will use a size biger bit to make the hole than what is recommended. One of the worst taping jobs i did was on a 955 cat that i was told had been in a used to load ironore. It need a finaldrive and bottom rollers. Every bolt twisted off. I torched out the ones that went through and drill the others.

 

[JBGASH]

I like and use Snap On drill bits and tap and dies they carry a lifetime warranty on breakage. They stay sharp with proper cutting oil use, they are expensive but nice when you need to drill a hole in a piece of steel or cut a set of threads..

 

[Randy88]

I've been buying the norsman bits, pretty high priced but they do last better than some of the others, not sure they're worth the cost, they seem to break a little too easy lately for what I've been doing with them I think.

I bought a few two flute taps, high speed steel, I'd have to look at the name again, but they have been really good and for some reason they tap really nice compared to the four flute taps I've had in the past. Any carbon steel tap or die is basically junk in my opinion, the taps break far too easily and the dies chip teeth out it seems, I've tried many different brands but they all seem the same.

I also do a lot of step drilling.

As for easy outs, I've tried the square one's, wasn't impressed at all, I have a short stubby set of spiral point easy outs, I was thinking Erwin but I maybe wrong on the brand, they seem to work half way ok I guess you could say, as for easy outs working, for me its sort of hit and miss, if the bolts not been in very long, I feel its worth a try to use them, if its been years, I try to step drill them as big as I can without getting into the threads, then add some heat and attempt the easy out approach, if that fails, we opt for melting the remaining bolt out of the threads and then go back and clean the threads up with a tap. I've tried several different tap designs, I really like those meant for a tapping machine, that force the chips forward into the hole, for some reason they use less effort to turn by hand than the taps that pull the chips out.

 

[willie59]

The short story nuts and bolts about drill bits, taps, and easy outs (which is an oxymoron), if they're too soft, they dull easy, or in the case of an easy out, the flutes just ream off, but if they're too hard they're brittle...snap! Simple metallurgy. With drill bits, I choose a good quality split point and use cutting fluid. But even the best drill will wear out, that's a given. Same thing with taps. But easy outs, like I said, it's an oxymoron, rarely does a "sheared" bolt come out easy, especially if it snapped off because it's stuck. The most reliable trick I've used in removing stuck bolts is weld a washer on the stuck bolt, then weld a nut on top of the washer. I've had bolts stuck from rust so bad that I've had to repeat the process 5 or 6 times, but eventually the heating/cooling from welding the washer and nut eventually makes them let go. BTW, I use Nitro drill bits made by Drillco.

 

[FSERVICE]

invest in a set of left handed drill bits I have a set of small easy outs that I think are Mac that have served me well for many years. but im with willie on if its sheared off cause of rust you might as well not even try the easy out or you will be trying to get it out also.. I have set Artrue drill bits that are the cats meow for hard stuff. my taps are all Snap On or Mac mostly. snap on makes a thread chaser that everyone needs in their toolbox, comes with different thread pitch jaws that you can change, you adjust what size by a thumb screw.

 

[td25c]

I also have a set of Mac left hand drill bits & easy outs FSERVICE . Come in handy at times .

For the most part when I need a drill bit , extractor , or tap & die I try local hardware store first , then go to http://search.ruralking.com/search?view=grid&w=drill+bit

In the end they all fail on a rusted up stubborn bolt snapped off in a threaded housing .

Welding the washer & nut on top as willie59 suggested works most of the time .

If it don't then I resort to drilling a pilot hole for the flame and proceed to blow the broken bolt out with " Old Smokey " Oxy torch .

 

[Shimmy1]

I have had the best luck drilling a pilot hole and then using the washer/nut trick. It really helps on the bigger ones ⅝" and up to drill the hole half the size of the broken bolt. I feel then that getting the weld down the core of the bolt will shrink it, thus loosening it up. Also, if time permits, wait for it to cool completely before trying to move it. As far as bits go, most of the time the stuff I'm drilling you can't use a drill press, and broken bits happen frequently, so I have been using drill bits from Northern Tool. After the factory edge is gone, a thorough dressing with the drill doctor and they are as good as any other. I also prefer step drilling.

 

[MitchSA]

I find these work but for smaller bolts.

 

[caterpillarmech]

Love the pilots but I have broken that set all to heck. I use Irwin bits and Snap On square extractors. I also bought the larger Square Williams set. I am fixing to buy a set of Cat drill bits. That way when it breaks, I'll have the part number to charge to the job.

 

[Randy88]

Keep the brands coming, most I've never heard of before, let alone know where to get them from, never knew mac or snap on even offered drill bits for sale.

If there's room to work, I don't mess with the washer and nut idea, but rather take a flat steel piece, like 2 inch wide and drill a hole and weld that on, keep the piece as long as possible and use that for a breaker bar, if not cut it short and weld the nut on next to the hole welded up, that way you don't have to keep welding the same nut on, just redrill the hole and reweld that on. I've also bought clamp nuts for milling machines, the extra long nuts that come in the clamp set, to put two bolts together, that way the nut is three times longer than normal, and weld the snot out of it around the entire nut, leaving more than enough room to put a socket or wrench on, then keep that flat piece of steel to use again later, just grind off the old weld hole and drill another hole again, saves a lot of messing around, and trying to only weld inside the nut to allow the wrench to fit on the outside, just a suggestion if room allows.

Has anybody seen an easy out, oxymoron, that's not only hilarious, but very true, anyhow, anybody ever seen one that turns the bolt in?? I've often thought if I could attempt to turn it in, then take another correct one to turn it back out, that way I could rock the bolt both ways after heating the snot out of it a few times, using the drill bit most times won't be enough to ever get a stuck bolt to turn in. I've asked but nobody locally knows of anything, quite a few times, the edge of the hole is buggered up enough, all I'd need to do is turn it a few turns, die grind around the hole and then they would turn out the stud out with an easy out. Just had one this week that had sheared off, its all I needed to do, just couldn't get it to turn in, so instead we dismantled the entire part, took it home and counter bored from the back side, used an easy out from that side and pulled the bolt into the hole deeper and die ground the first thread off and then used the easy out to remove it. The whole while cussing up a storm thinking, someone somewhere has to have one to save a whole day's work and four people standing around waiting for my machine to get fixed.

I've also got a few sets of reverse drill bits, if that's all that's needed to get the bolt out, its not really stuck, just in far enough to not be able to get ahold of it and turn it out by hand.

I've also been known to use a ball end die grinder bit, and forget the drill bit completely, just grind into the end of the stud with that, to make a slot for the easy out to fit into, as they say, whatever works and a persons patience allows.

 

[Heavey Metal]

'' anybody ever seen one that turns the bolt in''

See post # 10 this thread.

These work real good :http://www.drillout.com/

The way the tip is made you can walk the bit to the center of the bolt.

Also use the easy outs with a drill.

The shock from using a drill instead of a wrench will often bring a broke bolt right out.

For real bad ones use the torch only turn off the acetylene once you get it burning so you dont bite the good part or ruin the tip.

If you burn alot of bolts buy chrome plated tips or better yet turn down a regular tip and have it plated.

If your real pickey and dont like burning (some customers are rather anal about this) than just drill big enough to not get into the threads

and die grind the rest out.

 

[SE-Ia Cowman]

My snap on man will not warranty any cutting tool. I use a nickel welding rod and the nut and washer trick works almost every time I drill a small hole in the center of the bigger bolts to get some kind of lube in the bottom of a blind hole and crayon or bees wax candle is always one of the first things I use. I have a set or Irwin colbalt drill bits in the service truck that I have had good luck with but any quality high speed drill will do the trick with proper speeds and feeds. I am not a big fan of split point drills I keep a set of center drills handy for the initial getting the hole centered then a 118 degree regular bit works fine the split point drills break more often right at the cutting edge because there is less material there to keep them strong and the 118 are a lot easier to sharpen with out a drill doctor

 

[SE-Ia Cowman]

I think Hanson makes a real good tap, right out of college when I was in a production machine shop all taps and drills were Hanson I have a few left in the tool box from 20 years ago and they still drill good, I haven't bought any for a long time I don't see them for sale at local stores any more they are probably to good of quality or to costly for stores to sell

 

[JBGASH]

My snap on man will not warranty any cutting tool. I use a nickel welding rod and the nut and washer trick works almost every time I drill a small hole in the center of the bigger bolts to get some kind of lube in the bottom of a blind hole and crayon or bees wax candle is always one of the first things I use. I have a set or Irwin colbalt drill bits in the service truck that I have had good luck with but any quality high speed drill will do the trick with proper speeds and feeds. I am not a big fan of split point drills I keep a set of center drills handy for the initial getting the hole centered then a 118 degree regular bit works fine the split point drills break more often right at the cutting edge because there is less material there to keep them strong and the 118 are a lot easier to sharpen with out a drill doctor

SE-IA, I was told from the Snap On man that the bits I purchased were lifetime warranty against any breakage or defect. I have had the set for appox 2 yrs and have not had to test the warranty yet.

 

[JD955SC]

The common style of easy out is a No Go in my book. I have never had success with them. The squarish style and the multisplines are better.

Irwin/Hanson taps and dies and extractors are a very common brand. Good quality. The tool trucks pretty much all relabel them as their brands. The difference is cost and the Irwins are not lifetime warranty, while tool truck brands will commonly warranty.

 

[Shimmy1]

I sharpen the big bits with a grinder but the small ones I've had better luck with the Drill Doctor. Anybody worn out the stone on the doctor yet? Just wondering in case I ever do.

 

[Slidey]

I've been using a different approach for a long time with a high success rate. It should be noted that nearly every bolt I work with will have been given a lick of anti-seize when fitted.

I drill the offending bolt and hammer in a torx but that's slightly oversized. It gives you the option of rocking back and forward. If you have drilled all the way through and break the torx bit you can also hammer it back out from the other side

I've just bought some Sutton bits after using a mates set. I need to learn how to sharpen bits using a stone wheel

 

[Shimmy1]

I've been using a different approach for a long time with a high success rate. It should be noted that nearly every bolt I work with will have been given a lick of anti-seize when fitted.

I drill the offending bolt and hammer in a torx but that's slightly oversized. It gives you the option of rocking back and forward. If you have drilled all the way through and break the torx bit you can also hammer it back out from the other side

I've just bought some Sutton bits after using a mates set. I need to learn how to sharpen bits using a stone wheel

Best way to learn to sharpen a bit is grab some junk ones and have at it. All you really need to know is the trailing edge needs to be lower than the cutting edge. I taught myself to use a 4½" grinder to sharpen. I found I could see exactly what I was doing. After I'm done they usually won't start a hole but I like to step drill anyway so they cut like new in an existing hole.