Could REALLY use some input on a Cat D6-9U dozer...........PLEASE and THANK YOU!!!

[JDDozerman]

Hello guys,
I've really missed talking with everyone, but I had to have another surgery so I've been "out of commission" for a while. I can't seem to catch a break lately, but that's what happens when you get your legs crushed I guess. Anyhow, I'm back for now at lease, and I just had a guy offer to trade me a dozer, but I'm not sure it's going to work. I tried looking through all the old posts, but couldn't find the information I'm looking for, that's the reason for this "new" post. I have a guy who wants to trade me a Cat D6-9U dozer, he is supposed to send me pics and a video of it later today, it was a cable model that has been converted to hydraulic blade. It of course has a "pony motor", sweeps and canopy, and the remnants on back from the old cable winch set up. Could the old "winch mechanism" even be used for anything, like a winch? Most of them I've seen that have been converted, just leave the winch on back, but don't use it! He has no idea how many hours are on it, supposedly, it was used to farm with years ago, then "sat for about 30 years, but was started periodically". The person who owns it now says it has almost brand new tracks on it, and states it runs very good, and that ALL the fluids were changed, and they have been "trying to restore it as they use it", for whatever that's worth!?!!? The things that I'm most concerned about are:

1.) Being it's probably a 40's or 50's model, would it not have the lowest horsepower D318 motor? Which if I'm not mistakin' only puts out about 66 horsepower? Doesn't seem like much to me!?!!?
2.) Would it not also have the "dry clutches" instead of the "oil clutches"? I've heard some pretty negative things about the "dry clutches", like they don't last very long!? Is this a fact?
3.) What would I look for to tell if it's been "retrofitted", from cable to hydraulic, properly, or correctly???
4.) He also states that they usually "pull start" it instead of using the pony motor, makes me wonder why??? He does say the pony motor works, so why would they not use it? I'm not very fond of pony motors to begin with, would this be easy to convert to "direct electric start"???
5.) What is this dozer worth? The tractor I'm trading is worth $14,500.00 to $17,500.00. From what I could find, these old D6's are only worth around $8-10,000.00 at most! I found only ONE D6-9U that was "supposedly MINT" that was selling for $13,000.00, other than that everything was much lower!!! What do you all think a "fair" price would be for one of these? I'm just looking for a "ballpark" idea.
6.) Are parts for these still readily available?
7.) It is a "pedal steer", but has a "hand clutch", which I'm not very familiar with, were these any good, or is it something to avoid?
8.) What else was "good" or "bad" about these old D6-9U's???

Really the only things that make me even consider trading are the fact it's a "Cat", and it's the right size for what I'm needing, although, if it's NOT producing much horsepower I'm not very convinced that it will work for me! ANY input, and expertise you can give me would be VERY greatly appreciated!!! What things should I look for, or at, or what should I avoid, etc.? I just can't afford to trade for something that isn't going to do the job for me, and I don't have any time, or money, to be repairing things right away, I need to get out and get working, like yesterday! Thank you everyone for all your time, experience, input, and kindness! Best wishes to all!

JDDozerman

 

[r_steven]

Considering your circumstances, I'd say leave it where it is. We've got a '53 d2 5u with a pony motor, it can be a real pain to start. Parts are hard to come by for the d2 where I am, but it could be a different story in your side of the world!

 

[smokey1]

I ran an maintained a D6 9u for three years while building a large farm pond , the pony motor was a bit of a pain. but if you kept clean gas in it it usualy started right up . That had an electric starter, but would start up also with a few pulls. You can covert to direct electric start , for the price of two hd batteries and the starter, $600 range. Mine was also converted to hydraulic blade, worked fine. The hydraulic steering only works while the machine is moving... The 318 cummings is a great engine and plenty of power for that machine . If you could find a good runner for about $10,000, you would have a good buy. Most parts for that machine are still available from CAT. The machine Im refering to is still working today

 

[JDDozerman]

Thank you VERY much Smokey, that is EXACTLY the kind of info I'm looking for! I really appreciate the input and your expertise, as I am not very familiar with these. How about the "dry" vs "oil" clutches, do you have any input on them, I've heard the "dry clutches" don't last very long? Thanks again!
JD

 

[51kw]

The dry clutches dont last as long. But as with most clutches...the more you slip them the faster they wear out. You also have to remember that those horses are more like clydsdales than the newer shetlands.

 

[JDDozerman]

So, even if it's only producing 66 "horses" they are BIG horses?!!? lol! Could a person put add a turbo to these D318's and boost the horsepower some? I have a LOT of trees to push over, good sized Locust, some pin oaks, and such, so I could really use as many "BIG horses" as possible! I also have a lot of leveling, not much rock thank God, and some pond repairing, to do as well. I've also heard of people switching these over to "oil" clutches, does anyone know how to do this, how hard it is, and what the cost might be? I would really like to buy a "Cat", since they are the best known, and most common, but I just have to get past the "reservations" I have because of it's age. I have to make the wisest choice I can on what ever I get, because I'm already WAY behind where I should be right now, and I need something that has the "power" to do the tasks at hand. Thanks 51kw, and Steven, for your inputs, I really appreciate it a LOT! Where in Minnesota are you 51kw, I was born and raised on a farm there, down in the southeastern part of the state?
Thanks guys,
JD

 

[Greg]

First off smokey1 calls it a cummins engine. It is not cummins it is Cat all the way through. Only 66 HP out of a CAt 318 sounds pretty low. I have a 318 in a Cat No. 12 Grader with a pony motor. That series of pony motor is only 6 volt electrical system. Switching to direct electric would mean going to at least 12 volt, 24 would be better. Depending upon the age switching to direct electric can be easy or difficult. At some point in time, I am not sure of the year Cat started producing clutch housings with a hole in them for electric starter installation. Earlier ones requires the cutting of a hole in the clutch housing as well as drilling three holes for the starter and tapping them.

These are not pedal steer. They have a lever for each steering clutch but some brake is usually required also.

As far as the pony goes, the one on my No. 12 grader works just fine. Use premium gasoline with out any ethanol in it will go a long way to making them run better. Carburator is what usually gives most trouble. Also shut gasoline off when pony is not running.

Parts should not be much of a problem. Machinerytrader.com is a good source.

 

[Old Magnet]

Nothing wrong with a 9U D6, one of the best tractors Cat built.
Need to know the s/n of the unit you are considering as that will determine the ease of direct start and oil clutch conversion if required.

The cable control units are not equivalent to say a Hyster D6 winch. They are limited to about 5,000 lb pull for ccu use and depend on multiple wrap and shieves for required pull.

The success of the blade to hydraulic conversion depends on how it was done. Is it a Cat conversion using the #46 hydraulic control?

The Cat D318 is a real work horse, reliable with parts still available. Yes it would be desirable to have the oil clutch.....the dry version was the weak link.

 

[smokey1]

JD, my machine, was a 1961 if I can remember, it had the plate and cover on the flywheel housing for the starter convertion, it had dry clutchs, that liked to rust up after sitting out the winters. I did pull one out and took it to cat, for rebuild. if I remember uit was about $900.00, and it took me 3days to change it, I had to remove the fuil tank to do the job, but at the same time I put an oil seal in the steering pump, that would leak down about once a week. The machine i had had lever steering, but hudraulic assist to disingage the clutchs. The engine was more than likley a CAT, all I ever had to do with that was change the oil and filters, and it would always srart with a shot of either . The pony engine starter was 6 volts but I used a 12 volt battery, and it never hurt the starter, The convertion kit at the time was a 24 volt system, but very expensive from CAT. good luck with it if you buy it....

 

[JDDozerman]

Thanks guys, this is all VERY helpful information, I am still waiting on the pictures and video of the "Cat" in action, as well as the serial number, etc. I'm really confused now, because he did say it was a "pedal" steer, which makes me wonder if they were "riding the brakes", due to lack of knowledge in how to properly run it??? They are "willing to trade" it because they just got a D8H, but the D6 was the first dozer they ever owned, or operated, so it's possible they didn't know much about it either. I'm going to really take my time on this before "jumping" into any decision, in fact, one thing I'm considering is seeing if they are willing to have a certified Cat dealer inspect it. Any thoughts on this? Seems to me that would be a very wise move, considering all that's been changed on this dozer, as well as, because of it's "questionable" history. Thanks again for all this GREAT information, it is not only VERY helpful, but very educating as well!
Thank you kindly,
JD

 

[Old Magnet]

A few stats:
There were 29,764 9U's built from 1947 to 1959.
s/n 13,263-up came with oil clutch (main)
1954-up models came with provision for/or direct electric start. Pony motor was still standard.
hp rating of 75hp, plenty enough to spin the tracks.

 

[JDDozerman]

Thank you VERY much Old Magnet, that's great info!!! I had read that the earlier D318's only produced 66 hp, but that just goes to show, don't believe everything you read! I'm hoping the guy will send me the serial number, pics, and video, soon so I can start checking it out further, but all of this info will certainly help me once I get it! I really appreciate every ones time, and input, thank you all!
JD

 

[JDDozerman]

I'm wondering, just out of curiosity, or maybe even "stupidity", does anyone have any input as to how these D6-9U's would stack up against say a IH TD 15, or a Fiat Allis 14C, in other words, could the D6 with only 75 hp, do about the same jobs? I can't help but wonder if this D6 could push over trees as well as the IH, or Fiat Allis, and without slipping the clutch, or bogging down the engine, etc.??? I DO realize it depends on a lot of factors such as, the size of the trees, as well as the roots, soil type, etc., so let me put it another way, if you had a good sized tree that a IH TD 15 could easily push over, could the D6 do it as well, even with the rather large horsepower difference??? I'm just having a hard time grasping the concept of why it has so much less horsepower than similar sized dozers of other brands, and is it as capable of doing the same job, as other brand dozers of the same size? Also, why don't they have turbo's on these? Can they be turbo'ed, or would it even help much? 51kw said "these are clydesdale" horses, compared to "shetland" horses of the newer dozers", which I'm not sure I understand, maybe I could get some clarification on that? It really does seem odd to me that they only produced 75 horsepower for a substantially sized dozer!?!?!? Call me "stupid", I just don't quite understand it, that just doesn't seem like much for a dozer this size?!?!?!? Ok I'm done rambling, I already feel like a "babbling idiot", but maybe someone can enlighten this "dummy"??? I AM trying to learn more, so I WON'T feel so DUMB!!! Thanks again guys!
JD (Jumbo Dummy)

 

[grandpa]

I know im getting old.... but I can't recall ever running into a 9U D6 with peddle steer...... help me here Greg, is my memory totally shot,,, i thought cat's first peddle steer were in their traxcavators.

 

[spanner]

I'm guessing he means the brake pedals are not linked to the steering levers like later models. "Hand clutch" would be the direct drive master clutch.

 

[Old Magnet]

If your looking to do some serious pushing it's weight (traction) you need more than hp. The D6-9U is capable of spinning it's tracks under load but it's only a 20,000 lb+ tractor as opposed to say the D8H which is a 50,000 lb+ unit with almost three times the hp. Don't know anything about your TD15 or Allis 14c other than I would consider them to be orphans come parts needing time.

 

[surfer-joe]

A 9U in good condition would be a decent Cat, and parts are still quite available for them. However, a newer TD15 International would be a better machine as would an HD11 Allis-Chalmers. This from a standpoint of being much easier to operate. They are direct electric start also, so you would not have to mess with a pony engine, a manmade curse if there ever was one. The AC and the International, even if newer would likely be about the same money as the 9U.

Good Luck!

 

[Greg]

Your memory is totally still there gramps. No pedal steer until the traxcavators. I think in the K series if I remember correctly. No pedal steer in a 9u D6. Pedal steer on dozers confined to D3's D4CBs and up with the exception of the D's which came before the B's for what ever reason Cat did it that way. Never spent any time around D5's later than the B's so I can't say anything there either.

Spanner I agree with what you say there too.

 

[FSERVICE]

i had a d69u it would push down any tree you have. of course it depends on the operator. mine had a 12foot blade, it would roll dirt over the blade. pony motor can make a preacher cuss tho. i changed mine to 24 volt electric. i got it off a cat grader worked great. took a weekend to change out, make battery tray,wire up. it would make a great farm dozer, for occasional use. i wouldnt want to use it every day its a workout to operate!!!

 

[JDDozerman]

You guys are AWESOME! This is EXACTLY the kind of information I was looking for, since I'm NOT familiar at all with the D6-9U's! I still haven't gotten the pictures, video, serial number, or rest of the information the guy was going to send, so all I have to go on right now is what he told me previously. He said it was a "pedal steer", with a "hand clutch", and from what I'm reading here, he either really doesn't know how to operate it, or something is really messed up!??!??! He said it was converted from a "cable" to a "hydraulic" blade (I have NO idea HOW it was converted at this point), and supposedly the pony motor works but they always "pull/push start it". Well, I don't know WHAT to think at this point, I guess I will just wait and see if he sends the rest of what he said he would, or maybe he was just smokin' some crazy cigarettes when I talked to him, who knows????? All I can say is "thank you ALL for the great education I'm getting on the D6-9U's, I think joining this site was the BEST thing a person could do, who wants to find out ANYTHING about heavy equipment"!!!!!!!! From a rickety disabled farmer, I say "THANK YOU"!!!!!
JD