CAT D5G code 245 (solenoid valve, transmission pilot pressure)

[Timber Farm]

Hello all.
I have a D5G (serial RKG01403) that will no longer track. It abruptly stopped while tracking without pushing a load, the parking brake light and the action? (exclamation point with gear around it) came on. Shut the machine off for 15 minutes, started it up and light were off and it tracked for another 5 minutes then happened again.

It has a code 245 Solenoid valve (Transmission pilot pressure), according to the documentation I could find.

I’m not 100% confident in the code table I’ve found although it looks good to me.

If anyone has any insight or can offer direction on this I’d appreciate it.

 

[Nige]

Use this document and try pulling the Codes again.

Be aware that once you are into the Code menu the Active codes do NOT increment (scroll) automatically and you have to manually move on from one Code to the next by shorting Pins 1 & 2.

 

[Timber Farm]

That’s the document I found, glad I can trust its accuracy now. I do need to scroll the codes and see if there are others. I may try to make it out to the machine shortly and do that.

 

[Nige]

do need to scroll the codes and see if there are others.

Yes you do. Another poster came up against the same issue a few weeks ago and it turned out he had four Active Codes, not just the one he thought he had.

 

[Timber Farm]

It’s my understanding that when 1 and 2 are jumped per the instructions it will continuously scroll through all codes. When I jump them I do get code 178, but only that code repeatedly. If I remove the jumper and cycle the key off and back on it will show code 245 again.

 

[Nige]

It’s my understanding that when 1 and 2 are jumped per the instructions it will continuously scroll through all codes.

That's what I also thought up to not long ago ago, but it is not correct. The increment (scroll) function for the Codes is not automatic. The reason I thought that is because a different type of Diagnostic Tool for this type of equipment, works that way. Shows I should not assume.

When you first turn on the key after disconnecting the two halves of the Harness Code connector the first Code on the list will automatically start to flash on the Diagnostic Indicator. It is not necessary to install the "scroll" jumper at that point.

After noting the first Code insert the jumper momentarily between Pins 1 & 2 and remove it. The next Code on the list will start to flash on the DI. After noting each Code continue to jumper Pins 1 & 2 momentarily until the first Code you noted is displayed again, confirming that you have gone right the way through the list of Active Codes.

 

[Timber Farm]

Double checked. It’s just those two codes.

 

[Nige]

So as you will already now from the list 178 is the air intake heater relay. This could potentially cause starting issues in winter cold starts but with your location maybe not.

245 is the one. The transmission Pilot Pressure solenoid. The unfortunate consequence of using the Blink Code method of identifying problems is that it identifies the Component Code (CID 0133 in this case) but not the Failure Mode. There are three possibilities, FMI03, 05, & 06. I've included all three below. I suggest you read through them before starting because there will undoubtedly be some Test Steps that are common to more than one procedure.

If you want a complete electrical schematic please ask. Sometimes the truncated ones included in the procedures are a bit difficult to understand.

 

[Timber Farm]

If you don’t mind I’ll take that complete electrical schematic. Also… where is the ecm located on the machine?

 

[Nige]

If you don’t mind I’ll take that complete electrical schematic.

Check your messages.

Also… where is the ecm located on the machine?

It's mounted under the LH armrest in the cab. The schematic should have some illustrations. Attached the parts diagram for the platform wiring which also shows it.

 

[Timber Farm]

Thanks for everything so for Nige. We’ve gone through every test procedure so far and everything checks out. Is there a procedure to test the ecm?

 

[Nige]

Have you removed the rear pump yet, to check for pump rotation when the engine is turning.? If not that should be your next step.

 

[Timber Farm]

I haven’t. Do you have a procedure for that or a starting point?

 

[Nige]

I haven’t. Do you have a procedure for that or a starting point?

I'm afraid I don't, because the procedure in the manual is to remove the engine and pump assembly (both pumps) as a comple unit then split the pump set off the engine. The assumption being that the pumps and/or the coupling are going to be replaced, but you aren't at that point yet - all you want to do for now is check that the engine is turning the pumps. So unfortunately it's a case of having to make it up as you go along.

 

[Timber Farm]

Do you think there’s any way this could be caused by a clogged hydraulic suction screen or clogged hydraulic filters? The filters are probably only a few hundred hours old.

 

[Nige]

Do you think there’s any way this could be caused by a clogged hydraulic suction screen or clogged hydraulic filters?

I don't think so, especially when you state that the filter is empty after doing a fluid change and has never filled up. That is a clear indication that the hystat pumps are not pumping.
What gets a lot of people confused is no drive but that the blade hydraulics will still work, but note the location of the implement pump on the front RH side of the engine - it is not driven via the coupling.

 

[Nige]

If you want to conclusively prove the pumps are not moving oil, try rmoving the most accessible sampling valve #3 from the filter head, then crank the engine for a few seconds but not enough for it to fire off. Do that 2 or 3 times. Does any oil come out of the hole.?

 

[Timber Farm]

This machine fires right up when you bump the key… lots of oil came out, lol.

 

[Nige]

This machine fires right up when you bump the key… lots of oil came out, lol.

My bad. I had to look at the hydraulic schematic and the filter is located on the return side of the shared system between the hydrostat and the implements. So what you got from the filter could easily be from the implement pump which is working.

If the electrical testing for the Pilot Solenoid points to the ECM, carefully note the following text from the troubleshooting procedure -
NO - The diagnostic code has not been corrected.
Repair: It is unlikely that the ECM has failed. Exit this procedure and perform this procedure again. Also, recheck if the diagnostic code indicator is illuminated for this diagnostic code.