Case 850 Engine Indenification help

[Jon Bradtke]

Hello all,
Newer member here so if I miss something please be kind. I have a straight 850 dozer that needed an engine rebuild. I have the engine stripped down and heads were rebuild/machined. Crank had to go to 0.030 Under based on wear. I ordered the engine rebuild kit and started to swap the liners and pistons.....surprise!! My liners didn't fit and were not large enough in diameter. Turns out someone swapped the original 301BD for a 336BD. The engine serial/model tag was missing which didn't help my situation. I'm going thru the process is validating the fuel system but I need the engine serial number for that portion.

Long story short can the engine serial number be identified from the injection pump serial number?

Injection pump info from Tag on rear of injection pump.
R5V 375 - 1100A2B2078R
CASE NO. A154779

Thanks for any help!
-Jon

 

[Vetech63]

Have you looked over the engine block good? Look for stamped numbers

 

[Jon Bradtke]

Yes all I see is casting numbers which typically don't tell the story of the engine serial number. The engine serial is suppose to be on a tag above the starter. I can see the 2 marks from where the tag was mounted but its gone.

 

[Welder Dave]

Hopefully the pumpguy sees this. If anyone can determine just what you have from the IP numbers, it's him.

 

[Tinkerer]

All of the 301 and 336 blocks have casting numbers on them.
As far as I know the IP will not identify an engine serial number. The 336 used two different ip's on them.
Whomever sold you the liner kit sold you the wrong one. If they are too small you may have a 301 kit.
You need a service manual if you don't have one.

 

[thepumpguysc]

336BDT
THE RSV # is just the gov #..
The A154779 is the Case inj pump assy #..

 

[Jon Bradtke]

They didn't sell me the wrong kit. I got what I ordered but I didn't confirm the engine model in my machine before ordering so its on me. The 336 was never offered in my machine as an engine which is why I should have confirmed liner dimensions before ordering. I was just trying to validate what injectors should be in my engine and I can't go by the parts catalog as my engine is wrong for my machine.

 

[Tinkerer]

You didn't include the all important model number of your 850 in your opening post.
The machine serial number eliminates a lot of confusion in any post or thread asking for information.
There are were 7 different 850 models through the years.
The 336 was in all of them up to and including the 850C.
It was replaced when the 850G came out with two different configurations of the Case-Cummins 6T-590.
The engine configuration is dependent on the on the machine serial number.

 

[Jon Bradtke]

I hate to do this over the interwebs but you are wrong. My original post said "straight 850". The "straight 850" machines were shipped with the 301BD. The subsequent models 850B, 850C, etc. were switched to the 336BD and eventually like you said the 6T-590. Again, it doesn't matter because someone swapped my orginal 301BD for a 336BD.

 

[thepumpguysc]

My goodness people.. all this can be avoided if u just search the inj pumps CASE #..
It even states at what serial number breaks it is..
Look it up.!!

 

[Tinkerer]

Of course the early (straight) 850's had 301's in them.
I was thinking of the letter series and forgot about the first model.
This is a classic example of an engine swap that was made with one that is different from the original.

 

[Welder Dave]

My goodness people.. all this can be avoided if u just search the inj pumps CASE #..
It even states at what serial number breaks it is..
Look it up.!!

This is good information for any engine. I think it should help when ordering parts for the particular engine it's on. A little off topic but related, the grader I purchased is missing the engine data plate. It is a Cummins 8.3 rated at 207 HP. My machine is a 1986 and I came across a 1989 being sold for parts with the same engine so I took some pics. of the engine data plate. I've heard that Cummins requires serial numbers for most parts. Now I'm wondering if the IP numbers could identify the engine serial number? Of course this is based on everything being original. If not should the data plate and serial number from the (newer) parts machine be sufficient for getting parts requiring a serial number? Hoping I won't require any major parts but would be good to know just in case I should need a specific part(s).

 

[thepumpguysc]

In most cases the inj pump # will not help w engine serial number..
We just got lucky with this pump.

 

[Welder Dave]

Should it help for engine parts?

 

[thepumpguysc]

When searching the pump #, you’ll
Most likely get the engine it goes on.. but.. as we all know, there’s serial number breaks..& parts changes.. that’s why it’s always important to jot down your engine serial number in your service manual when you find it..

 

[Welder Dave]

Just saw a link that says Cummins stamps the serial number on all engines. That's good to know.

 

[thepumpguysc]

When dealing w Cummins parts dept directly, most knowledgeable parts guys keep a list of serial numbers by year mdl at the ready and can do their best to get u the right part..
The LESS knowledgeable will simply say, “I gotta have a serial number”..
I’ve had customers go to salvage yards to get a serial number..

 

[Welder Dave]

I've also read the CPL (critical parts list) number is sometimes more important than the serial number. There's a bunch of info on the tag so that's why I took some pics. of a similar engine in the same model grader albeit 3 years newer. A just in case kind of deal. I'm sure if I ever had a problem Jade Equipment is close by and could help me get the right parts. They bought the parts machine I took the pics. off. I saw it in their yard when I went to get a fuel sender... a very expensive fuel sender $225.00!!! and that's after a $20.00 discount.

 

[Jon Bradtke]

Does anyone know the injection pump timing specification? The manual says go to 35 degrees BTC, then CCW using the spec on the valve cover for actual timing. My valve covers don’t have a sticker or spec from what I see. I found 32 degrees from another post?

Thanks
-Jon

 

[Tinkerer]

I am quite familiar with setting the 336 timing. It is a two step operation.
35° on the crankshaft damper first. Then go to the window on the injection pump and set the timing there.
I have never heard of rotating any engine counter-clockwise when setting the timing.
All the timing gear backlash is eliminated turning the crankshaft clockwise.