Case 1840c do I have a bad tilt cylinder?

[oachs83]

Removing some fill and grading for a concrete slab at home and suddenly the back drag felt very weak and noticed the tilting felt strange. The hydraulic filter light started blinking and sometimes would be solid a couple hours prior so I figured maybe I had a clog? I planned on getting a new filter tomorrow anyway so I stopped for the night. Climbing out I noticed the right tilt cylinder was disconnected from the bucket pin. No biggie all it was is the pin rattled out due to the bolt breaking that holds the pin.

I started the machine to reattach the pin and the cylinder won’t extend. I didn’t try much diagnostic as the sun was coming down but I find it odd the cylinder wouldn’t extend out. The left cylinder seems to be doing all the work. I did just purchase this loader a couple months ago so it’s very new to me. Do I have a valve issue or a bad cylinder issue or? Where do I start? Thank you

 

[alrman]

If the tilt cylinder wont move in or out, there is something seriously mechanically wrong with it.
Maybe the rod got bent as you continued to use it after the pin fell out?

The issue with the filter light may not be associated - but first thing to do is check & replace the filter.
Cut the old one open & see if there is anything in there that shouldn't be.

 

[oachs83]

If the tilt cylinder wont move in or out, there is something seriously mechanically wrong with it.
Maybe the rod got bent as you continued to use it after the pin fell out?

The issue with the filter light may not be associated - but first thing to do is check & replace the filter.
Cut the old one open & see if there is anything in there that shouldn't be.

The cylinder moves in and out if I pull it out manually but doesn’t move when I use the controls.

 

[alrman]

Ah! It sounds like the cylinder piston has parted from the rod.
Hopefully it is just a broken retaining bolt.
Working with broken concrete is a common denominator with this problem.
Bolt is 3/4" x 2" UNF (Grade 8)

 

[oachs83]

Ah! It sounds like the cylinder piston has parted from the rod.
Hopefully it is just a broken retaining bolt.
Working with broken concrete is a common denominator with this problem.

Okay thank you. I suppose only way to find out is to take it apart. My only issue is I absolutely need to finish grading this fill. Is there any further damage that can be done if I just reattach the cylinder and finish the job? Honestly this could have already been broke when I bought the machine for all I know.

 

[92U 3406]

I wouldn't use it. If its damaged internally you're going to contaminate your entire machine.

 

[alrman]

Technically speaking, the tilt operation should not be working at all in this situation.
Usually, when the loader is raised, the bucket just flops into the full dump position..... & we are only assuming a bolt is broken - it could be worse!
I would check it out & fix it first.

.... both hoses are still attatched to each end of this cylinder - right??

 

[oachs83]

Technically speaking, the tilt operation should not be working at all in this situation.
Usually, when the loader is raised, the bucket just flops into the full dump position..... & we are only assuming a bolt is broken - it could be worse!
I would check it out & fix it first.

.... both hoses are still attatched to each end of this cylinder - right??

Yes hoses are attached and nothing is leaking and I have full hydraulic fluid. I’m assuming just the left tilt cylinder is doing all the work and this right one is going along for a ride

 

[alrman]

And the hoses are connected to the T piece fittings at the RHS of the loader frame?

I ask this because those cylinders are connected in parallel together - one shouldn't work without the other cylinder rod not being attatched to the hitch frame.
When the pin fell out, the bucket should not be controlable as the RH cyl would retract or extend before any movement would happen to the LH cylinder.

Neither should you be able to move that RH cylinder by hand if the piston is still connected to the rod.

What you are describing, can't happen if the RH cylinder is still connected to the LH cylinder.

 

[oachs83]

Everything appears to be connected properly yes. I wouldn’t say it moves by hand with ease. If I put the pin in the cylinder end and twist while pulling on it (and it takes some grunt) I can get it to extend.

 

[alrman]

Well, if the rod is reasonably firm to move, it would seem that there may not be a problem with it, apart from the fact that you said it would not move when trying to move it with the controls.

There's the possibility you were moving the lift lever & not the crowd lever??

There may actually be nothing wrong with the cylinder, apart from the pin falling out!

 

[Delmer]

The way it seems to me, if the piston came apart or broke off the rod, then the cylinder would extend, but not retract? If you lift the boom slightly with the bucket tilted back, then the bucket will pull down the attached cylinder before the free one moves. If you lift the boom all the way up, I bet the free one extends after the attached cylinder extends all the way to the stop. But don't try that! hook it back up with the pin and see what it does then.

 

[oachs83]

I’ll have a much better chance to look at tonight after work. Hopefully I just over reacted as it was a long day and the sun was about gone and I have no lighting in my Quonset shed.

One thing I can assure it would not extend with the control lever. I pulled it down a few inches by hand and that’s all I did for the night. I’ll get a new hydraulic filter when I’m in town today and hope for the best. Thank you all and I will keep you updated.

 

[oachs83]

Update:

It is working again. I have a feeling when the pin first fell out the bucket could have pushed the rod up in to the cylinder, possibly causing it to be stuck. Like I said, it took a good amount of force to get it to move about the first half inch but then I could get it to move 3 inches by hand, but it definitely had some resistance. Being that it was so late last night I never even fired the skid steer back up.

I snuck home on my lunch break with a replacement bolt, and when I fired it up, the cylinder was moving up and down with the controls. I didn’t notice however, I lost one bushing that my local dealer had on hand. I tried a quick back drag and scooping, and everything seems to be working like it previously did, but I did not have very much time. The real test will be when I get the bushing put in and start to work with it again later tonight. My thinking is I accidentally bottomed the cylinder out, causing it to be temporarily stuck. I will probably end up pulling the cylinder and taking it apart this winter just to make sure everything is up to speed. Fingers crossed that is all my issue was. Thanks again for all the help.

 

[Welder Dave]

It seems crazy to me to continue to run a machine when one of the bucket cylinders became detatched.

 

[oachs83]

It seems crazy to me to continue to run a machine when one of the bucket cylinders became detatched.

Me too which is why I didn’t and in my last post said I got it to work again and reattached it. It’s been working good so far.