Buying a d9h that's been sitting for years

[Neily]

Hi all. Heard on the grapevine of a d9h that's for sale and rang the owner about it. So the back story, guys old man bought it out of the mines, spent almost as much again on the rear end before using. Used it for a while on the farm and cooked it, apparently one of the heads cracked and it lost coolant and overheated. ( you would assume it would most likely happen the other way) anyway a mechanic pulled it down to rebuild it and ended up leaving town and it has never moved since. I have seen this tractor years ago and I know it's been sitting for at least 15 years Mabe longer. That being said what would you say this is worth and would it be viable to fix? Obviously this depends on price and condition just after a few thoughts from people in the know before I go for a look. He is going to do some research about price and get back to me, it might be out of my league to begin with lol.
Ps they have 2? New heads for it aswell.
Cheers all will appreciate any suggestions and advice.

 

[Cmark]

A good runner sold at Ritchie bros a couple of months ago for $37K. Bearing in mind it's an oversize load to float out of there ($$$) and it's been sitting with the heads off for 15 years, I would be looking at paying scrap price.

 

[Neily]

Hi Cmark, yeah I figure its only worth scrap value also tbh. It's only just up the road from me which kinda makes it attractive to me, (can probably sneak down a back road lol) float costs compared to anything else could be spent on parts. The big factor I suppose is how good the rest of it is, I'm pretty sure this tractor would be a1 mechanically other than the engine. Well it's suppose to be. Might go for a look on the weekend and post some pictures up. Thanks

 

[fast_st]

Pictures are always good. If you can make a bid on scrap value that covers your trasnportation costs, even better, Jack and chain up the blade and drag it onto the trailer.

 

[Neily]

Hahaha yeah worst part is scrap is worthless now aswell. Anyone know what an engine rebuild kit would cost roughly? Probably sounds silly to buy a machine like this but in all honesty it's the only way I can afford gear, buy and fix. I can't justify a runner for the little bit of work it will do, need to rip and push a heap of gravel and I don't think my hd9 is up to the task lol. What is a realistic price? It has to be worth something, what's the difference between this any other piece of equipment that needs an engine rebuild?

 

[CDUB]

You might try pricing a running take out engine and figure the purchase price of the dozer that way. Then you'll be covered if the cost to repair the engine gets too high. I imagine the price range for a rebuild would be considerable depending on what parts are salvageable.

 

[Tarhe Driver]

What is this "X" or "Y" or "Z" worth?

What is this "X" or "Y" or "Z" worth?

This question seems to arise about every day on HEF.

“What’s it worth?” really means, “What is its market value?”

But, what is market value? Market value is the collective opinion of buyers, sellers, lessors (owner who rent out), lessees (non-owners who rent from owners) and, to a degree, industry lenders, of the value of a specific property in a specific location as of a specific moment. Any price, or any offer, is a fact, and may have nothing to do with market value, which is an opinion of market value which can change on a moment’s notice, depending on an infinite number of variables.

Market value cannot be “determined,” but can only be estimated, albeit strong data support and a knowledgeable analysis of the market can provide a much more defensible opinion of market value than the opinion of the old fella who based his opinion on the distance to the moon strictly on the fact that he’d watched the moon every night for 70 years before he went to bed.

In the d9h, Neily may have found a “diamond in the rough,” or he may have found “the ultimate in a money-pit losing project.” I certainly don’t know, and this “nerdish” dialogue is not meant to advise anyone on the value of anything, but to perhaps lay out a procedure for valuing “stuff” that needs substantial mechanical work.

Okay, we’re all experts on automobiles, right? I am, because I drive one (snark, snark).

So let’s talk about an older Rolls Royce I have been, hypothetically, offered. I know that a highly similar but properly restored Rolls recently sold at auction at $37,000. That’s probably the highest that I can make this car worth after I’ve done all the work it needs, which includes
another engine (or a lot of work on the existing engine), transmission work, a paint job, a new interior, new tires, and body repair from when it swiped a float-loaded D8 in a parking lot.

Following is how I would try to ball-park an estimate of value. Also remember that once I’ve got that jewel into great shape, I must still consider the costs of selling it in the estimation of market value (also, neither your labor, nor mine, is free, so don’t sell yourself short by saying “I can do that cheaper than any shop.” The next owner doesn’t care who did the work, so long as it was done correctly, and if you want to put your sweat equity into it, that’s fine, but always remember, “Your labor is not free.”

Thoughts? Questions? Challenges? From your experience, what did I leave out in the below?



Value as restored: $37,000
COSTS TO RESTORE THE ROLLS ROYCE

Engine repair $5,000
Transportation of the Rolls to various shops. $500
Transmission repair $4,250
body & paint work $6,500
New interior installation $4,750
Tires, installed $1,250
Subtotal $22,250
Profit & Management @ 20% $4,450
Insurance $750
Property Taxes $100
Contingencies @ 10% $2,225
Subtotal $29,775
add loss on substitute investment @ 5%, $1,489
Subtotal $31,264
Sales Commission to sell the Rolls @ 5% of $37,000 $1,875
Total soft and hard costs for restoring the Rolls $33,139
Value of the Rolls as unrestored. $3,861

 

[Neily]

That's the worst thing about buying something like this, sellers always seem to think they have an a1 machine that just needs the engine put back together, if it was the case they would of just paid cat to rebuild it in the first place. My opinion of what it is worth to me would be what the wreckers would pay for it and that's all. There has to be some money in it, for eg if this has realy good tracks on it they have to be value to someone that could use them etc. I suppose at the end of the day a d9 delivered at my place is gonna be $50k+ this could be a realy cheap tractor. I know it's an every day question to ask and hard to answer but I don't know what I'm looking at, I need some advise as to what to look at to assess what condition the machine is in to make a good assessment of what's its worth to me. I suppose I'm thinking $20k if its looks good and allowing $10k for the engine which is what float cost would be for them to get it to Tilly's or for me to get anything simmilar delivered.

 

[mitch504]

I've bought a few machines that have sat for years, and worked on a bunch more customers have bought; and I can tell you from experience, It's not in great shape.

Things will be stuck, rusted, seals and hoses will be dry-rotted. It may still be well worth fixing, but I personally would make sure I could scrap it or part it out and get my money back.

 

[MrMajestical]

Does it have a D353 engine in it? I did alot of repairs on a D9G w/ a 353 there ain't nothing cheap on it. Going to Empire it is hard to find some parts, it is so old the manuals ain't available on their networks. If it's 55 tons and scrap is $50/ton or so, that's $2750, your gonna be at least that much just getting the engine done. Then you have to look at track condition, sprockets, rollers, trans, diff, finals, and whatever cooling issues, as well as any hydraulic issues. I had to put a pump on that 9G, no kit for the original, it was $2000 for the pump. I did the equalizer pad, it was $1200 for those 4-5 parts. The diffuser for the air cleaner came up missing somehow, it was $1200 for that. It broke a track shoe and a 100 ton press wouldn't budge the pin, $2000 to fix that. So, if you're thinking about it you better go over it with a very, very, very fine tooth comb.

 

[Welder Dave]

Sitting for 15 years could have brought on problems as big or worse than the engine. I wouldn't look at a D9 unless I had a lot of work for a D9. It's expensive to run even when everything works and you better have pretty firm ground to run it on. The engine could cost well over $15,000 to fix and then you have no idea what the transmission or finals or anything else is like. I wouldn't consider a D9 a DYI fix it project. It's just up the road, that does mean you hope to get it going and drive it to your place? Even for a parts machine you need to have a buyer.

 

[Neily]

Hi guys, all sound advice and its what I need to hear, I will have a good hard look at it before I make any decisions. I'm pretty confident this guy is gonna want way to much for it anyway. I bought the neighbouring farm and it has a gravel hill eg quarry hence wanting something sizeable to rip with. Welder Dave, no don't intend to drive it home but it just wouldn't cost much to have it moved. This isn't what you would call a big earthmoving area so there isn't much around so basically it would cost $10k just to get anything delivered.

 

[Welder Dave]

Ok it's real close but nothing on a D9 is going to be cheap to repair and you'll need a hoist to lift pretty much everything. I think you'd be better off looking at something like a D6 that would likely have used parts available and much more common.

 

[nicky 68a]

Assume,you got it for free (which you know isn't going to happen)
A machine of this size ain't for the faint hearted that's been sat for years.
D9's are a whole different league of their own.
The advice already given here is spot.

 

[Neily]

Yep would have to agree on advice nicky. Mechanical work means nothing to me, it simply comes down to cost. Ill ring the guy and see where we're at with it tomorra and go from there. I'm confident he is going to want top dollar for it anyway which makes it unviable to begin with.

 

[Scrub Puller]

Yair . . .

Neily. I have been thinking about this dilemma and, as I see it, the machine as it stands probably has almost a negative value . . . that is to say the owner would have to pay someone to take it off his hands.

It would have some value to an outfit such as Tillies or some other tractor breaker but loading and freight could kill the deal . . . depending where it is there could be several thousand dollars involved just in getting onto a float.

If you could really use this tractor I would print out this thread as reality check for the owner and see if he will agree on a price with the machine up and running ready to walk onto the float . . . a realistic price that reflects your labour and he supplies all the necessary parts.

If, part way in, you find the engine to be beyond repair you can walk away with the experience.

Cheers.

 

[Old Magnet]

Even at bargain prices there's plenty of "Flintstone" D9's around!!!!

 

[d9e]

hi nearly
we bo0ught a d9e at a clearing sale near us in running condition for $16000 bout 5 yrs ago, (deceased estate), walked it home an started work on it. tracks were 90%, an engine claimed to be overhauled before owner died(so couldn't ask what was done). during a total fluid replacement, noticed crown wheel an pinion looking REAL SAD. started blade ploughing and tractor just paid for itself (equivalent to paying a contractor to do same work) before BANG went the pinion. direct drive gearbox, OH ,, got new crown wheel easy BUT pinion took us 12 mths to find a good take out from the states. cat classic parts helped source us wreckers for us (THANK YOU CAT CLASSIC) we had to buy and import though 2 gearboxes to get the best pinion. gave tractor a total backend rebuild (clutches, brakes, etc) . anyhow the old girl has now paid for itself and repaires, many times over in ploughing done and still going strong, the power of these old girls is awesome. so consider the cost of purchase and repairs vs hireing a contractor for job , or smaller tractor, for us it worked but for others it might not

 

[Neily]

Hi all, old mate is still trying to research what the tractor is worth. I'll Let yous know when I find out. My guess is $30k anyone else wanna put a guess on it lol.

 

[Nige]

Selling something like that D9 is similar to an estate agent selling a house with "character" - in other words something that only appeals to a certain type of buyer. They can say "it's worth so-and-so" until they are blue in the face but at the end of the day it's only worth what a potential purchaser is prepared to pay for it ....... I'll bet money the owner will come up with an extremely inflated number for it. If he does tell him it can stay where it is for the next 15 years.....