Any seasoned wrenches on CTLs? CAT 299D, got a few issues.

[fastline]

Ended up snagging the one we were looking at. Right or wrong decision, it is here. We were aware of some issues and made an offer accordingly. Of the issues, I will explain them below.

1. Hydraulics for implement functions are not smooth to start.. All 4 main functions seem to not have any fine motion at all. I observed the service page in the display for the joystick and shows that it goes to .3%, then jumps to .6% and bucket will move but abruptly start and will sort of jerk or stutter. Once you command enough motion, it is normal and smooth. This really feels and seems like an electric servo issue to me. Tuning or something. I did work through the display to select fine motion as it was set on course and it made absolutely no difference. The track system seems to act perfectly normal and smooth. Again all 4 main functions on right stick do the exact same thing.

2. Bucket/boom does not lift right and I am trying to understand what I am seeing. If bucket is on ground, when it starts to come up it is obvious that the left side comes up first and bucket is slightly angles. Not obvious, just subtle. When that happens the pivot arms in the back jump to one side as well. Nothing appears bent. I have no time in machine to figure out if there is a weak cylinder but with piston bypassing heat would certainly be a telltale. I just can't think of any other reason for what I am seeing. Are the cylinders not on the exact same circuit?

3. I thought there was one bad lower track roller, but there is more. I am looking for rollers if someone has any economical sources? trying not to put too much in this bird just yet until I can use it and see if we even like it.

 

[ahart]

Post serial number for accurate information. There is likely min/max solenoid currents for all implement functions that can be programmed with ET. Both lift cylinders operate off the same valve section. A simple air check on the suspected cylinder would likely confirm an issue there. Once you post a serial number I’ll be able to see what bottom rollers we are looking for.

 

[fastline]

Dammit, thought I put serial prefix in. It is a GTC serial prefix. I can PM the full serial if needed. I just try to keep ours off public pages.

Good point on the air in a cylinder. When inspecting the cylinders, they appeared to be original with no rebuilds, but I guess if one was done, certainly possible no purging was done.

I'm a bit frustrated with the electronic side of CAT. I love the tuner friendly side of electric, but CAT wants to make sure you pay the piper. If I would have to pay the dealer to work on my machine (never happened in my life), I am curious if we can invest that cost into CAT ET? Is there another level up to be able to adjust parameters and reflash the ECM? I see "diagnostic" software, but I take that as one way observation data, not programming level?

 

[Shimmy1]

Implement functions not smooth? Typical Cat skidder, it's why I run Bobcat.

Loader lifting uneven? Probably pins/bushings fagged out. Have someone watch each joint closely as you raise it. One must be completely gone.

 

[fastline]

Implement functions not smooth? Typical Cat skidder, it's why I run Bobcat.

Loader lifting uneven? Probably pins/bushings fagged out. Have someone watch each joint closely as you raise it. One must be completely gone.

I read somewhere about another 299 acting like this and someone tuned the hydro system and seemed like it was smooth as glass after that. I don't know but I'm not going to accept this.

On the pins/bushings, are you saying you think one is so sloppy that one side of arm moves while other is trying to take up the slop? The geometry of these vertical lift machines is complex. Lots of joints in that system.

 

[Shimmy1]

I read somewhere about another 299 acting like this and someone tuned the hydro system and seemed like it was smooth as glass after that. I don't know but I'm not going to accept this.

On the pins/bushings, are you saying you think one is so sloppy that one side of arm moves while other is trying to take up the slop? The geometry of these vertical lift machines is complex. Lots of joints in that system.

I've ran quite a few Cat skidders, when they're brand new they feel ok to me, but get some hours and it seems like the fine control goes away.

Yes. Don't know what could cause it to move unevenly besides that since the cylinders are tied together.

 

[Nige]

Is there another level up to be able to adjust parameters and reflash the ECM? I see "diagnostic" software, but I take that as one way observation data, not programming level?

There is, but officially it’s only available to dealers. The two versions are known respectively as Customer & Dealer ET.

Do you have the LCD Advanced Display on the RH panel.? If not you ought to consider updating to it, then you wouldn’t need ET for diagnostics.

 

[Mobiltech]

You can fine tune the hydraulic control but they will never feather as well as a hydraulic pilot control will.
The uneven loader arm lift is likely a twisted loader arms.

 

[fastline]

There is, but officially it’s only available to dealers. The two versions are known respectively as Customer & Dealer ET.

Do you have the LCD Advanced Display on the RH panel.? If not you ought to consider updating to it, then you wouldn’t need ET for diagnostics.

It does have the LCD but when look at the "diagnostic" screen, it just has some basic values like rpm and joystock position data presented in %. I am hoping there is another level of diagnostic data where I can see pump and pressure data. Haven't found that yet.

 

[fastline]

You can fine tune the hydraulic control but they will never feather as well as a hydraulic pilot control will.
The uneven loader arm lift is likely a twisted loader arms.

Have you found a way to check for twist? I will admit that was my first suspicion but things are looking straight visually. If I had to estimate, the left side lifts about 3/4" higher than the right.

Komatsu excavators have been electric over hydraulic forever and smooth as glass. CAT can't figure it out? The reason I suspect hydro tuning is you can literally hear it surge like to pump is coming in and out. I might call it hysteresis tuning. But it doesn't sound like I will get to make my own adjustments and stuck having to hope/pray some tech will have enough skill to do it right. I have other machines they they touched. Not good! I think once they get to a certain age, they put the rookies on them.

 

[Mobiltech]

It will straighten out as the cylinders each bottom out and pull it straight so you will have to lift it up a few inches then hook it to a crane in the Center of the front cross bar. Shut it off and let it relax for a bit. Then check cylinder pin and loader pin bushings for wear by moving everything by hand. If it wants to stay uneven and always returns to an unlevel point then the arms are tweaked.

 

[fastline]

I should mention that I noted that the main boom arm attachment at the back main black support arm would move in and out probably 1/2". Like it needs shimmed quite a bit. As well, I noticed the other pivot pins/arms that run just over the front of the engine move in and out quite a bit as well. I am not sure if that is a continuous shaft going through there or not. I don't really see a way to shim that. Those arms actually will make contact with the inner side of the boom arms.

 

[KSSS]

I am morbidly curious what made you want to buy this machine so bad? It clearly had issues to start and as you get into it, there are more. I would guess that you got a great deal on it? Seemed like it was an avoidable purchase, the issues were pretty evident, unless you just really wanted a 299 for some reason.

 

[fastline]

I am morbidly curious what made you want to buy this machine so bad? It clearly had issues to start and as you get into it, there are more. I would guess that you got a great deal on it? Seemed like it was an avoidable purchase, the issues were pretty evident, unless you just really wanted a 299 for some reason.

Not everyone can afford to skip down to the CAT store and pick up a low hour diamond with a warranty. .

 

[KSSS]

No doubt. Hopefully the numbers work out in the end.

 

[Zewnten]

I’m more curious why someone would be concerned posting a machine serial number on a forum they’re asking for help on.

 

[Tyler d4c]

I’m more curious why someone would be concerned posting a machine serial number on a forum they’re asking for help on.

There's been case where fake paperwork as to the owner of the machine was drawn up and and ownership was fought in court.

 

[KSSS]

That issue could happen anywhere, since the PIN numbers are clearly visible on machines parked on jobs and dealerships all across the world. Filing false paperwork to claim ownership would be a quick and easy to find yourself guilty of fraud, since true ownership is easy to prove. No different than VIN numbers clearly visible on cars.

 

[CM1995]

It's the equipment with no VIN # or ID plate you have to worry about..

 

[CM1995]

There's been case where fake paperwork as to the owner of the machine was drawn up and and ownership was fought in court.

There must be more the story than just forging a serial # document. If not I am going to be the proud owner of a brand new D8 down at the dealer.