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TheDud
Member
DMiller
Senior Member
If it is seized to the point of a rebuild you may be as well off to reinstall a old NH250. Damn things would run seemingly forever and financially could be the better alternative.
kshansen
Senior Member
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Yes, if you don't "need" the 350 horses and can find a good running 250 that would be a good idea. Nothing against "MORE POWER!" but horses cost more money. A nice running non-turbo NH 250 with minimal care could out live most of us old timers on this forum!
TheDud
Member
Once I pull the heads and see what I’m dealing with I may look for a good used engine. The spare 250 I have isn’t complete so it’s a dead end.
Former Wrench
Senior Member
I too think good money chasing bad. It would be cheaper to buy a used or rebuilt engine from a dismantler than to open this can of worms.
kshansen
Senior Member
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- Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
Just doing a quick Google search came up with this place that specializes in military truck and appears to have several NH250's in various conditions $4,650 for a complete running take out. Sure would be something to at least think about before putting a pile of money in to the 350! Just looking online for rebuild kits for the 350 the best prices are in the 900 to 1,000 range and I have no idea of the quality of the parts in them. then if your turbo has a problem did not check price on that. Then add in maybe some basic head work and injectors, as if the water even touched them that would be a no go to reuse them.
As much as I like fixing things unless you have something you are trying to keep 100% original, which is not the case here, some times you will be better off just tossing the bad engine and slip in a good used engine. Instead of spending weeks of your spare time rebuilding an questionable core engine you and a couple buddies could take a long weekend and have a running machine. Might even have some time to go play in the dirt that weekend!
DMiller
Senior Member
Welded block, uncertain the internals, uncertain if EVER was or will be functional, buy the runner and swap!!
RZucker
Senior Member
One thing to consider too, these 5 tons had enough transfer case troubles with the 250 and overloads. Originally that series truck was designed with a Continental 6602 gas burner. Worked on a few being used to pull semi trailers loading potatoes, the farmers went back to using a 4 wheel dolly pulled with a big tractor.
crane operator
Senior Member
RZucker has it nailed. The driveline in those 5 tons will never handle a 350 or 400 cummins.
But I don't think what you have is a 350 with no aftercooler.
If this was never a completed truck, you may have other problems - a gen set motor will typically have a different governor set up than a truck engine.
The newer 5 tons- some have 250 natural aspirated big cams. Some have 8.3 cummins. Either ones are good engines.
I don't know what you gave for the truck, but used military 5 tons in running and driving condition don't bring much on the military surplus sales. I bought two a couple years ago, they were both under 30,000 miles, drove on my trailer for under $4,000 each. not a thing wrong with either one.
Sell/ part yours out for a rock crawler (for the axles) and find a runner.
You'll have way too much into this one.
But I don't think what you have is a 350 with no aftercooler.
If this was never a completed truck, you may have other problems - a gen set motor will typically have a different governor set up than a truck engine.
The newer 5 tons- some have 250 natural aspirated big cams. Some have 8.3 cummins. Either ones are good engines.
I don't know what you gave for the truck, but used military 5 tons in running and driving condition don't bring much on the military surplus sales. I bought two a couple years ago, they were both under 30,000 miles, drove on my trailer for under $4,000 each. not a thing wrong with either one.
Sell/ part yours out for a rock crawler (for the axles) and find a runner.
You'll have way too much into this one.
kshansen
Senior Member
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- Retired Mechanic in Stone Quarry
Would be interesting to know the design criteria for some military equipment like those trucks. I doubt they are designed and built to be running hauling loads a couple hundred thousand miles a year like say a Peterbilt or KW! Probably more effort is placed on profit for the contractor building them than anything else.
Birken Vogt
Charter Member
Yes, if experience with generators is any indication, they build them to a set of specs drawn up by a bureaucrat with no consideration for how it actually works, if at all. Then somebody gets the contract at an extreme low bid, builds a bunch of them, and goes out of business. Then maybe a different builder picks it up, builds some more, and goes out of business.
DMiller
Senior Member
As well documented, they are designed to be 'Expendable' and short lived but durable enough to get a job done.
RZucker
Senior Member
The average mileage I saw on M-123 10 ton trucks was around 2500 miles when they were surplussed.
kshansen
Senior Member
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Don't anyone get me wrong on the comment I made regarding design life of some of the military equipment. I fully understand that it is a sad fact that many of them have to be considered disposable so to speak.
Back before my dad was shipped overseas during WWII he was working as motorcycle escort duty in the Southern states. I forget the miles he mentioned but there was a set mileage that they would use the Harleys then a new engine would be installed. Faster and easier to keep a bike ready to go that way than to have trained mechanics fixing problems that might come up. The time needed to replace an engine was way less than doing even a simple bit of trouble shooting and repair.
Back before my dad was shipped overseas during WWII he was working as motorcycle escort duty in the Southern states. I forget the miles he mentioned but there was a set mileage that they would use the Harleys then a new engine would be installed. Faster and easier to keep a bike ready to go that way than to have trained mechanics fixing problems that might come up. The time needed to replace an engine was way less than doing even a simple bit of trouble shooting and repair.
Birken Vogt
Charter Member
It seems to me that military equipment get built from a boiler plate spec so that they are all exactly the same. Problems and all. They don't get the running product improvements like civilian trucks and the like, when the manufacturer sees that something is junk they fix it so there are not warranty and angry customer issues. I wonder what kind of warranty the military gets?
DMiller
Senior Member
Military equipment is pretty well sold As Is under Customer Contractual Design Criteria. It fails due to a catastrophic component failure they will replace the major part but the small crap is on US.
Wes J
Senior Member
What's aggravating is that the military does things their own way for no explicable reason. I was looking at specs for some road tractors. Just plain Jane trucks for pulling trailers on paved roads. I think they were A M General, but I can't remember.
Looked like regular trucks from the outside. Cummins engine and Allison automatic, nothing wrong there. All 24V electronics. All governed at about 50 mph. Probably livable.
But, the stupid 5th wheel plate is about 8" taller than any other truck in the world. They can't tow a non military spec trailer and a military spec trailer can't be towed by a regular truck. Only the government could come up with that.
I see military trailers being hauled all over the country on the back of a flatbed trailer. Nobody can just hook up to them and go. I'm sure there is no surplus market for trailers no one can tow. What a waste.
Looked like regular trucks from the outside. Cummins engine and Allison automatic, nothing wrong there. All 24V electronics. All governed at about 50 mph. Probably livable.
But, the stupid 5th wheel plate is about 8" taller than any other truck in the world. They can't tow a non military spec trailer and a military spec trailer can't be towed by a regular truck. Only the government could come up with that.
I see military trailers being hauled all over the country on the back of a flatbed trailer. Nobody can just hook up to them and go. I'm sure there is no surplus market for trailers no one can tow. What a waste.
RZucker
Senior Member
The fifth wheel height is to match up with the 6x6 tractors they use in off road situations, otherwise they cant get all the product out of fuel tankers. Also some of the real heavy tank mover trailers used a 3" kingpin.
hvy 1ton
Senior Member
With a cummins and allison it'd have to be a M931/M932. They aren't governed at 55 that's all it's got with 11R20's. The A1's with 14R20's will top out in the mid 60's. I know a farmer that has two 931's that pull hopper bottoms out of the field. It's doable, but they don't ride level.