225 or 215LC for steep slopes

[mfowler]

Okay, this is kind of a continuation of the "How much $ for a Thumb" thread. I'm looking at a Cat 225
https://www.rbauction.com/1979-CATERPILLAR-225?invId=8925715&id=ci&auction=SACRAMENTO-CA-2016168

and 215D
LC https://www.rbauction.com/1990-CATERPILLAR-215D-LC?invId=8920106&id=ci&auction=SACRAMENTO-CA-2016168

at auction this Thursday. Both already have thumbs so that's good. Wondering which would be better for working on steep (15-30 percent) slopes. My instincts tell me a LC would be more stable, but would love to hear some opinions from people who actually know about this. I don't feel I need a machine over 40,000 lbs. so am also considering this

https://www.rbauction.com/1998-HYUN...d=8843505&id=ci&auction=SACRAMENTO-CA-2016168

Obviously three very different machines. I like the 215 but the hours (14,500) scare me, although the machine looks good in pictures, other than the boom cylinders. The Hyundai is really the size I want and it's got relatively low hours, but it's a Hyundai. Anyway, I hope some of you more knowledgable than myself will have some educated opinions. This is for ranch work, not production. I don't really care how fast a machine does a job, I just want it to do it and keep on doing it. Thanks to all who responded in my previous thread and anyone who can offer insights here.

 

[Nige]

Why should 14,500 hours frighten you so long as the major structures are in good condition..? Everything else is a bolt-on and is therefore repairable. So long as the purchase price reflects the machine hours and condition (from a physical inspection, not photos) you should be OK.

 

[movindirt]

The 225 has 12.5 ft of track on the ground, I don't have the measurement off the top of my head, but iirc my 215 is close to the same. I'll measure it and see, its a long undercarriage as well.

Edit: the spread of the tracks will help you more on slopes then the length of track on the ground, the 215 has a 6.5 ft track spread, the 225 is 8ft.

 

[mitch504]

I have a 215C LC, and center to center on the tracks is 8'.

BTW, when discussing machines, the letter series is important, there is quite a size difference in a 215 and a 215D, and many other differences, too.

 

[mfowler]

Nige, of course you are right and I will be inspecting the machines on Wednesday. I guess my concern lies with the internal parts that I can't see. But that brings up a question: in the photos they show two hour meters, one with 14,568; and a second with 1320 hours. Possibly the second is from an engine rebuild? Is this a common practice? Why else would there be a second hour meter? Thanks for your valued opinions.

And thanks to movindirt and mitch504, the more information I have the better I feel spending money, haha. Mitch, you mention other differences besides size and I know HP is higher on the D; anything else that makes the D more or less desirable?

 

[Nige]

AFAIK there should only be one, located on the LH seat side panel so you are looking at it as soon as you open the cab door. However the first of the 6 photos clearly shows two what appears to be hour meters side by side. WTF...?

I think what mitch was inferring is that if someone is looking for technical information, specifications, etc, etc, on a particular machine then a Serial Number is an absolute essential.

 

[JDOFMEMI]

I would say that for working on steep slopes the long U/C option is more desirable. The L or LC machines usually have wider pads to go with the longer roller frames, and this all contributes to stability when things are steep, though 30 percent is not what I would call steep with an excavator.

 

[mfowler]

AFAIK there should only be one, located on the LH seat side panel so you are looking at it as soon as you open the cab door. However the first of the 6 photos clearly shows two what appears to be hour meters side by side. WTF...?

I think what mitch was inferring is that if someone is looking for technical information, specifications, etc, etc, on a particular machine then a Serial Number is an absolute essential.

WTF indeed...I just don't know why there would be two hour meters. According to the website it is a 215D LC serial #9TF00595.

 

[mfowler]

I would say that for working on steep slopes the long U/C option is more desirable. The L or LC machines usually have wider pads to go with the longer roller frames, and this all contributes to stability when things are steep, though 30 percent is not what I would call steep with an excavator.

Thanks for the input JDOFMEMI. I know steep is relative and we all have different comfort levels. I remember the first time my Dad told me to take the TD-6 up to the top of the walnut orchard, I thought it was going to come over backwards on me, haha! That was almost forty years ago, and up till then I'd only run the machine on flat ground in the pear orchard. Are excavators generally more stable on slopes than crawler tractors/bulldozers? What about sidehill travel? I have rented a mini a few times and it does pretty well but I always keep the boom and uphill when sidehilling.

 

[bushcat]

Could be the high hour meter crapped out and they installed a new one so a person would know the total number of hours on the machine.

 

[Nige]

Could be the high hour meter crapped out and they installed a new one so a person would know the total number of hours on the machine.

That's a possibility, you'd have to check the electrical connections to see if only one of them was connected to the machine harness. In that case the total machine hours ought to be the sum of the two meter readings.

 

[Plebeian]

It depends how much you value you safety. Ranch work with small trees you might consider putting on a safety frame. The Hyundai with lower hours might be easier to justify the capital outlay for a safety frame. Check the Hyundai chassis for straightness.
Check up on the costs of replacing undercarriage parts between the brands.
Are there any other diggers than these three such as a Caterpillar 312(A), Hitachi Ex120-5, Kobelco etc?

 

[mfowler]

That's a possibility, you'd have to check the electrical connections to see if only one of them was connected to the machine harness. In that case the total machine hours ought to be the sum of the two meter readings.

Could be the high hour meter crapped out and they installed a new one so a person would know the total number of hours on the machine.

Well if that's true total hours would be about 16,000. I'm certainly no expert but with that many hours I would think nearly every component on the machine would have been replaced at least once, including an engine rebuild? On the other hand they cared enough about maintenance to keep a working hour meter rather than saying screw it. I will check to see what is up with the meters when I finally see it on Wednesday.

 

[mfowler]

It depends how much you value you safety. Ranch work with small trees you might consider putting on a safety frame. The Hyundai with lower hours might be easier to justify the capital outlay for a safety frame. Check the Hyundai chassis for straightness.
Check up on the costs of replacing undercarriage parts between the brands.
Are there any other diggers than these three such as a Caterpillar 312(A), Hitachi Ex120-5, Kobelco etc?

I guess I value my safety pretty highly. I have thought I would like to install some type of safety cage on whatever I end up with. Probably have something fabricated at home. There are some other machines in that size class, unfortunately I don't think any of them will be in my price range.