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Strategies to deal with vandals and thieves on a jobsite?

DMiller

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
16,579
Location
Hermann, Missouri
Occupation
Cheap "old" Geezer
Farmers here have taken to LARGE Quiet pups. Pyrenees Anatole mix dogs that bark seldom and only growl once get REALLY close, they can sneak up or outrun Coyotes. Post the notation at property lines that are on site and NOTHING the perps can complain or counter charge of as to crossing the perimeter. Sheep farm next door has Four now, coyotes have once again decided to venture closer to other farms(As Mine) and are being slaughtered, dogs catch them they maul them to unrecognizable. Couple idjits crossed his fence to either thieve or to scout out and got pinned in his barn on a platform, Sheriff was more than glad he had the dogs. One perp lost a shoe and part of a pant leg with some blood.
 

Tinkerer

Senior Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Messages
9,374
Location
The shore of the illinois river USA
I have 10 inch fire alarm bells in my shop and my house garage. They are very loud and still scare the crap out of me when I forget to turn them off !
Very easy to hook up to any motion detector light.
I have a wall switch connected to the bell circuit so I can reach in and turn off the bell but not the light.
For a garage door opener light a simple plug adapter screwed into the light bulb socket is simple and quick. One of these.
soc.jpg
 

John Canfield

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2009
Messages
431
Location
Texas
Occupation
Ranching
In Texas it is a defense to prosecution if you shoot someone at night stealing your property if there's no reasonable chance to recover the property. However my carry license instructor told the class (this was over ten years ago) there is no way he would shoot at a thief running off with his TV for one example. Absolutely not worth the potential consequences.

I always joke that I have more money invested in security cams at the ranch than I would lose in a burglary.
 

Truck Shop

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2015
Messages
16,992
Location
WWW.
In Texas it is a defense to prosecution if you shoot someone at night stealing your property if there's no reasonable chance to recover the property. However my carry license instructor told the class (this was over ten years ago) there is no way he would shoot at a thief running off with his TV for one example. Absolutely not worth the potential consequences.

I always joke that I have more money invested in security cams at the ranch than I would lose in a burglary.

If a person wins the charge-the civil case against them will clean them out. My wife and I don't own much of any value and what we do have is pretty well used so if someone want's it
that bad [take it] saves me the fee and gas to haul it to the dump. Hell I might even throw in a few bucks for the energy they spent and invite them back to steal the rest of the worthless crap.

Just don't take our two cats-well after they had them for 5 minutes those would be returned.
 

John Canfield

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2009
Messages
431
Location
Texas
Occupation
Ranching
One of my very favorite courses in college was Business Law which was a broad brush of the Uniform Commercial Code (UCC), contracts and some miscellaneous topics. I still have the textbook.

Some notable takeaways: person was having vandals/thieves/whatever violate his shed/barn/whatever (forgot the exact scenario) so he rigged a shotgun to be triggered when a door was opened and fired at the door opening. As I remember the perp was either wounded or killed. The owner was charged with a felony, again I don't recall what the exact charge was.

Another pearl of wisdom gleaned was business owners or individuals that post "not responsible for accidents" signage legally means absolutely nothing. If you are negligent in a situation you can still be charged regardless of how many signs you post. I see gravel trucks with signs on the back of the dump that claims "not responsible for broken windshields, bla bla." They are responsible for securing their load no matter what the load is.

One more - contracts are usually enforceable unless the court finds the party was somehow taken advantage of. Signing a contract is NOT a guarantee of execution. Verbal contracts can be enforced but any contract involving real estate must be written.

I should dig out that textbook and refresh my memory. The instructor was a really good guy and did a lot of pro bono work for those people with limited resources that were somehow harmed (not necessarily physically harmed.)
 

cuttin edge

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2014
Messages
2,736
Location
NB Canada
Occupation
Finish grader operator
One of my very favorite courses in college was Business Law which was a broad brush of the Uniform Commercial Code (UCC), contracts and some miscellaneous topics. I still have the textbook.

Some notable takeaways: person was having vandals/thieves/whatever violate his shed/barn/whatever (forgot the exact scenario) so he rigged a shotgun to be triggered when a door was opened and fired at the door opening. As I remember the perp was either wounded or killed. The owner was charged with a felony, again I don't recall what the exact charge was.

Another pearl of wisdom gleaned was business owners or individuals that post "not responsible for accidents" signage legally means absolutely nothing. If you are negligent in a situation you can still be charged regardless of how many signs you post. I see gravel trucks with signs on the back of the dump that claims "not responsible for broken windshields, bla bla." They are responsible for securing their load no matter what the load is.

One more - contracts are usually enforceable unless the court finds the party was somehow taken advantage of. Signing a contract is NOT a guarantee of execution. Verbal contracts can be enforced but any contract involving real estate must be written.

I should dig out that textbook and refresh my memory. The instructor was a really good guy and did a lot of pro bono work for those people with limited resources that were somehow harmed (not necessarily physically harmed.)
Here, the driver is responsible for securing his load, but I always thought rock in the windshield was a done deal. A shady contractor here was doing a job when one of his trucks had an open tailgate do a bit of damage to a person's car. Instead of the normal go out and fix the car, he fought it. The woman had no proof that the material came off his truck, and she had to fix her own. You pretty much need a dash cam.
 

suladas

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2016
Messages
1,731
Location
Canada
Here you need proof. Too many goofs who see a big truck and think they can get a free windshield, or don't use common sense and drive 10' behind a dump truck, what do you think is going to happen? I had someone follow me to my yard and claim I put 3 chips in their window from my flatdeck. Told him to pound sand if you don't have a dash camera, and maybe use some common sense and not tailgate a truck. If it comes off the tire, not the trucks fault as long as mud flaps legal. The part that baffles me when hauling my track hoe is people will drive right beside the trailer. No matter what you do, if you hit a bump chances are stuff is going to come off. Common sense would say to keep away from any big trucks.
 

Welder Dave

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2014
Messages
12,540
Location
Canada
Loading up a machine and having dirt fly off it or the trailer you are still responsible. City started cracking down on contractors having trucks going in and out of muddy sites and leaving a mess on the road. Contractor doing the Capital Care Norwood expansion had a skid steer with a pick up sweeper constantly cleaning the road before the cold and snow came. Some tires are really bad for picking up rocks and throwing them too. I somehow got a rock in the windshield where there was no one anywhere near me on Hwy. 14.

Quite awhile ago I read a story where someone rigged the door handle of a vehicle so a person would get shocked if they tried to open it. Vehicle owner was liable because they didn't put a warning sign on the vehicle.
 
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suladas

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2016
Messages
1,731
Location
Canada
If you hope to get any action taken you have to have cameras. High quality cameras put in places that license plates and pics of the thieves can be taken. Here, the police, if they don't have plates will post the incident on local internet news apps. Pics go out everywhere, and typically the thieves are caught quickly if there is enough on pics to catch faces and vehicles. We have theft still but these guys get caught where video/pics are available. That works here, certainly not everyone has it this good (if you can call it that) small enough area that the police can actually do something about thefts like this and are willing to. However without any pics you have next to no chance of stopping the thefts or getting your stuff back.

As far as knocking someone down. It sounds good and feels good to write it on the internet, but not so good going through the process after the fact. Even in areas that are more conservative, the process can be very expensive and your future freedom is at risk. Some areas of the US, the suspect has more rights than you do it seems. It can be a huge roll of the dice, with you breaking rock at the State Penn as a result when you roll snake eyes. The facts are unless you or someone else is being attacked or threatened in a way that justifies deadly force, it is not worth it. Having your rights read to you for homicide (no matter how right you may think you are) is a sobering moment, batteries, fuel, tires even a $300k machine wont seem worth it.....and it may not be.

I wouldn't count on anything happening to the thieves from a law stand point. Caught a guy on camera in yard this spring, police came really fast and tracked him to coffee shop a bit away and clearly ID'd him from footage. Even then they didn't want the hassle of pressing any charges. The cops comment was he already had similar charges and if he was able to see a justice that night, they would likely let him right back out. In his mind, pressing charges was a waste of time. The only benefit I see at least is he will go elsewhere to try and steal next time as he didn't even get anything before he was caught. Owner lives on site at yard I rent so it was super handy that way, within 2 mins of the cameras catching the guy he was out there with his dog and scared the guy off.

I do agree it would be satisfying to put a thief 6 feet under, but it's not worth the risk. I would however have no problem with them tripping and falling a bit.
 

fastline

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Joined
Aug 8, 2011
Messages
1,106
Location
OK
You know what amazed me? We had an accidental deer shooting here recently. I was vert surprised that within 48hrs, that deer was completely eaten and gone!!!! I just want to mention that to any pricks that care to visit. Apparently we hit our mark and the evidence is very soon gone. My Doberman is just here to distract you while I select the right ammo.....
 

DMiller

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
16,579
Location
Hermann, Missouri
Occupation
Cheap "old" Geezer
LOL
Local poor attitude types made mention would take to streets and take what want Rural
Have NO clue!
Guy jokingly said something to that effect to me on another forum, explained there are Hog farms out here, the bodies would not ever be found as would be gone in hours. Jimmy Hoffa most likely disappeared that way!
He did not respond back.
 

Spud_Monkey

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Sep 15, 2018
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Your six
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Decommissioned
I have a backhoe and can rent a excavator, there is thousands of acres of state/BLM land plenty of ravines and thermite gets very hot easily made from home with all the metal I got. Acid might work but buying too much raises a flag and cell phones to call 911 don’t work out here.;)
 

RollOver Pete

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2007
Messages
1,510
Location
Indio, Ca
Occupation
Operating Engineer/mechanic
Rule #1....
Never kiss and tell.
Rule #2....
Don't brag about the weapons you have and how you would use them. The DHS is watching and I promise you that they read, copy and use anything sent by anyone anywhere. If you say the right thing, they will investigate and check up on you.
Rule#3.... since most people can't keep their mouth shut, chances are that you just incriminated yourself. Does the phrase " premeditated " ring a bell?
 

fastline

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Joined
Aug 8, 2011
Messages
1,106
Location
OK
Well I am not sure if that is directed towards me or not. In any case, I think the general sentiment from most on here is likely that they are not going to simply roll over like a helpless puppy when the real criminals stop in for a visit.

But anyway, SOO far off topic! LOL I am curious if anyone has seen, heard of, used any basic alarm system for equipment? It would seem like expensive machines without the most basic protections are sitting ducks.
 

cw4Bray

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Joined
Sep 26, 2017
Messages
413
Location
.
Has anyone found a camera that can read a license plate at night from more than a few feet range, without really bright artificial lights to overpower headlights or taillights with or without license plate reader software ?
 

RollOver Pete

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Mar 5, 2007
Messages
1,510
Location
Indio, Ca
Occupation
Operating Engineer/mechanic
Well I am not sure if that is directed towards me or not. In any case, I think the general sentiment from most on here is likely that they are not going to simply roll over like a helpless puppy when the real criminals stop in for a visit.

But anyway, SOO far off topic! LOL I am curious if anyone has seen, heard of, used any basic alarm system for equipment? It would seem like expensive machines without the most basic protections are sitting ducks.
It wasn't.
 
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