Chains on grader.

Hawk · Dec 15, 2018

Weather man is forecasting 60 cm or 2 feet of snow here in the next 6 days. Let her snow, I’m ready now.

Shimmy1 · Dec 15, 2018

I'm not at all an expert on tires, but those look like some pretty damn good winter tires for a grader. Good work getting the bean counter to get that last set for you.

td25c · Dec 15, 2018

Our county grader gets chains all around with a lot of snow & ice .

It's a no brainer . Chains getter done !

I do the same with trucks , farm tractors & daily drivers .

Aint winter time great . LOL !

DB2 · Dec 15, 2018

Shimmy1 said:
I'm not at all an expert on tires, but those look like some pretty damn good winter tires for a grader. Good work getting the bean counter to get that last set for you.

Chains look pretty serious as well

Birken Vogt · Dec 16, 2018

DB2 said:
Chains look pretty serious as well

When he said ice pick chains that is not what I was thinking, those look like ice caulks or spikes like something on a steel wheel tractor from the 1920s.

DB2 · Dec 16, 2018

I thought he was talking about the Sandvic style rotating tooth cutting edges

Shimmy1 · Dec 16, 2018

Hawk said:
We are thinking of putting on the carbit or stinger cutting edge as I have a hard time cutting into ice with the serrated ice edges. Just wondering if you have any experience with them ??

The county here used to have a couple sets of stingers for the guys to use. Damn things cut to beat the band, but they also ground up the rocks and destroyed the gravel. I would think they would work great on ice, not only would they cut but they would also leave a rough surface for traction.

20/80 · Dec 16, 2018

Hawk said:
I don’t use bungee straps. I keep my chains super tight with a chain jack. The net looking chain is connected in four spots on the face of the tire. I use what’s called a pin connector there, then I do up the side chains. Once I tighten the sides with the jack there is no slack at all. They do stretch a bit over time but I tighten when ever it’s needed. I can travel full speed on good parts of the road if I’m just high blading back to my pickup. But I don’t go on pavement. Like you say, I bet they would be really hard on pavement.
We are thinking of putting on the carbit or stinger cutting edge as I have a hard time cutting into ice with the serrated ice edges. Just wondering if you have any experience with them ??

I was wondering how you keep your chains tight, I use the stinger bits blade for ice blading, the type I see in your picture are the old type as we call them but work really well also but wear down quickly unless the tips have carbide inserts or carbide coated which lasts a lot longer, on my stinger blades I take every second bit out and replace them with a cut off stinger bit so ice won't hurt the holders this lets your machine push through hard ice a lot easier, use lots of angle on your blade don't try to bulldoze with your ice blades straight, your machine will cut the ice and pull some dirt up a lot easier with angle, sometimes I will articulate my machine abit to offset the pressure on the blade and keep your front end from sliding, with the chains you got on you should not have any trouble.

Jonas302 · Dec 16, 2018

The stinger bits work great for cutting ice and mixing gravel in the spring the only real disadvantage is they are quite expensive but pay off in the long run

We made a back blade for one of the graders to cut ice when we are plowing its not the perfect solution but its nice always having the option to cut without changing blades

made a handy air hammer driver to knock the teeth in its really nice when the blades are mounted and your hammering upside down

Hawk · Dec 16, 2018

20/80 said:
I take every second bit out and replace them with a cut off stinger bit so ice won't hurt the holders this lets your machine push through hard ice a lot easier, use lots of angle on your blade don't try to bulldoze with your ice blades straight, your machine will cut the ice and pull some dirt up a lot easier with angle, sometimes I will articulate my machine abit to offset the pressure on the blade and keep your front end from sliding, with the chains you got on you should not have any trouble.

Thanks for the grading tips. I had another person tell me that when there tips got worn down they would only replace every second one. I would think that you could break the holders easier then, when you hit big rocks ?

Hawk · Dec 16, 2018

Jonas302 said:
The stinger bits work great for cutting ice and mixing gravel in the spring the only real disadvantage is they are quite expensive but pay off in the long run

If we put the stinger edges on we would run them year round. If they break up the rocks that would be good, as most of the roads are mostly rock. We very seldom do roads that have crushed gravel on them. Just not sure if we would be breaking the tips and holders off ?

20/80 · Dec 16, 2018

Hawk said:
If we put the stinger edges on we would run them year round. If they break up the rocks that would be good, as most of the roads are mostly rock. We very seldom do roads that have crushed gravel on them. Just not sure if we would be breaking the tips and holders off ?

No you won't break a holder I guess it depends on the style of stinger blade you have, maybe a bit or two, we always hard surface the ends of the stinger blades that's where most times it will wear the most, in about a foot back and front and at the ends, I use the stingers all year round and I have gravel roads and I have nothing but rock and ledge roads and they work great, it just takes time to learn how to use them right, some older hands don't like them but they were taught with straight blade cutting edges and its hard for them to convert when running straight blades there hold career, using them right is the key, some cowboy hands in this area like to use them as rakes to hide their sins, this is why they sometimes they get a bad review, but if used right dollar for dollar they are far cheaper in the long run with a lot less down time then straight blades, I believe they cost around $ 3600 for a set comes with the bits, I look after mine and I have had them on now 2 and a half years and they are used 12 months of the year, changed all the bits once replaced the odd broken one every now and then, I have 60 roads to look after, my partner on a 140m series prefers the straight blades and has burnt through $ 10,000 worth this year alone he has 50 roads, he switches to stinger blades for the winter months.

Shimmy1 · Dec 16, 2018

20/80 said:
I use the stingers all year round and I have gravel roads and I have nothing but rock and ledge roads and they work great, it just takes time to learn how to use them right, some older hands don't like them but they were taught with straight blade cutting edges and its hard for them to convert when running straight blades there hold career, using them right is the key, some cowboy hands in this area like to use them as rakes to hide their sins, this is why they sometimes they get a bad review, but if used right dollar for dollar they are far cheaper in the long run with a lot less down time then straight blades.

Like I posted earlier, our county had a couple of sets, until they wore them out. I'm not sure how operating technique could affect the gravel, but I noticed a definite decline in the gravel on the roads that they were ran on by a couple of operators. We did a lot of graveling about 15 years ago, and it seemed to me like the stingers either powdered up the rock, or left the top so loose that the gravel would get slung off the road by the traffic. Obviously this is summertime conditions I'm referring to, but I just wanted your thoughts on it.

Mother Deuce · Dec 16, 2018

I used to also articulate the 16M a bit our haul roads were 75 to a 100 feet wide. The 789's were grossing 700,000 lbs. They just pound the ice into the road base. I found that at the expense of extra wear on the 3 outside picks as the blade "sawed" thru the ice it would bring the road base back up where it was effective again for several hours. 3/4 of a million pound trucks are excellent compactors. If we were in really bad shape at the top of a shift with polished ice, we would take the 994 (in Pewags) and sand with road base once then we would get on it, with both (stingers) blades with a 988 sanding the reported slick spots. The "swirl" if you would created by articulating the machine as the bits passed thru the ice and picked up the base material created a much less hazardous environment for our truck hands. We ran 24 hours a day 7 days a week we would replace about 20 bits a 24 hour day and a whole rack about once a week or two. The end holders would be replaced about halfway through the season and the entire holder was replaced going in to the season. It was expensive and it was done to keep the crew safe. When they are looking down a 10% in a loaded 793 or 789 ice covered haul rod carved out the side of mountain they had the right to be a little nervous. We did our best to make it as workable as we could at 11,000 feet

20/80 · Dec 16, 2018

Shimmy1 said:
Like I posted earlier, our county had a couple of sets, until they wore them out. I'm not sure how operating technique could affect the gravel, but I noticed a definite decline in the gravel on the roads that they were ran on by a couple of operators. We did a lot of graveling about 15 years ago, and it seemed to me like the stingers either powdered up the rock, or left the top so loose that the gravel would get slung off the road by the traffic. Obviously this is summertime conditions I'm referring to, but I just wanted your thoughts on it.

There was a good chance that those couple of operators you spoke of were just raking the road not cutting the road way, that's why the road top was loose, also if your gravel has no fines in it the road will stay loose also, no matter what blades you were using, as far as gravel getting slung off the road you are right, over time you would not believe how much will spill over the edge of the shoulders, last year I was asked to recover a road in another area, the operators in that area used straight blades always, when I started recovering I pulled about 700 ton of number 2 gravel per Km or mile on a 5 mile section, re crowned the road then ditched the road and back sloped all the junk away, cleaned out all the culverts and got the water running properly, the area manager could not believe the amount of gravel that was recovered, it was a huge savings to his area, all done with stinger blades, I do this with all my roads and have been shaking the gravel back and forth now going on 15 years, the picture I have on my page of my grader that road was graveled 14 years ago.

20/80 · Dec 16, 2018

Mother Deuce said:
I used to also articulate the 16M a bit our haul roads were 75 to a 100 feet wide. The 789's were grossing 700,000 lbs. They just pound the ice into the road base. I found that at the expense of extra wear on the 3 outside picks as the blade "sawed" thru the ice it would bring the road base back up where it was effective again for several hours. 3/4 of a million pound trucks are excellent compactors. If we were in really bad shape at the top of a shift with polished ice, we would take the 994 (in Pewags) and sand with road base once then we would get on it, with both (stingers) blades with a 988 sanding the reported slick spots. The "swirl" if you would created by articulating the machine as the bits passed thru the ice and picked up the base material created a much less hazardous environment for our truck hands. We ran 24 hours a day 7 days a week we would replace about 20 bits a 24 hour day and a whole rack about once a week or two. The end holders would be replaced about halfway through the season and the entire holder was replaced going in to the season. It was expensive and it was done to keep the crew safe. When they are looking down a 10% in a loaded 793 or 789 ice covered haul rod carved out the side of mountain they had the right to be a little nervous. We did our best to make it as workable as we could at 11,000 feet

Hats off to you buddy, you are working in the most extreme conditions that requires extreme actions, love hearing about this kinda operating.

Hawk · Dec 26, 2018

Well I sure do like having chains on all tires. Now we are putting on the carbide tips so I can make a bit more dirt show up. We don’t want things like this to happen again. Have never used carbits before so any tips on how to run them would be much appreciated.

Leighva · Jan 6, 2019

I run Trygg SMT studded chains that have continuous pattern on the ground. I keep them tight enough that I run no bungee straps. I plow with a 143H all winter on steep mountain logging roads in North Eastern Washington/Idaho. I’ve found that as long as i keep my speed down a set of chains will last me for many years and never loose a chain off a tire.

Any thoughts on the SHARQ P300 edges..

Re: cutting edges has anyone run Sharq P300 “Swiss cheese” style cutting edges in rocky terrain? This winter we have lots of ice and my flat cutting edges leave the road too smooth for the trucks to get traction. The dealer has stated that they are amazing to cut ice and leave groves for much better traction. Additionally he says you run with very little down pressure thus a lower RPlM and operators state up to 40% less fuel consumption.

I heard that the city of Spokane and Spokane County just switched over to them.
One account I heard was an operator cut 9-10” of hard parcked snow and ice out of a paved road in one pass in South Dakota.

Jonas302 · Jan 6, 2019

Leighva said:
I run Trygg SMT studded chains that have continuous pattern on the ground. I keep them tight enough that I run no bungee straps. I plow with a 143H all winter on steep mountain logging roads in North Eastern Washington/Idaho. I’ve found that as long as i keep my speed down a set of chains will last me for many years and never loose a chain off a tire.

Any thoughts on the SHARQ P300 edges..

Re: cutting edges has anyone run Sharq P300 “Swiss cheese” style cutting edges in rocky terrain? This winter we have lots of ice and my flat cutting edges leave the road too smooth for the trucks to get traction. The dealer has stated that they are amazing to cut ice and leave groves for much better traction. Additionally he says you run with very little down pressure thus a lower RPlM and operators state up to 40% less fuel consumption.

I heard that the city of Spokane and Spokane County just switched over to them.
One account I heard was an operator cut 9-10” of hard parcked snow and ice out of a paved road in one pass in South Dakota.

There has been a few posts on here about those type blades not a lot of hands on experience though

DB2 · Jan 12, 2019

Not to downplay what your saying but it can be easier to remove 9-10 inches of ice/hardpacked snow than to remove an inch or two depending on the surface underneath. I find removing ice from concrete is easier than removing ice from asphalt as it doesn’t bind as rigorously to the less porous surface. Here in Winterpeg we get some pretty severe conditions and I’ve seen graders take off a foot of buildup in one pass. One its starts peeling and if you can maintain traction it’s quite satisfying to see the heavy thick pieces of ice flying off the road. Its actually quite violent. I’ll have to take a video sometime.

And just to note all this is done with regular hardened cutting edges. Those “swiss cheese” blades couldn’t take to side load abrasion of running against the curb surface. We use all different kinds of material for “curb runners” and used track pins are some of the best. Alternatively I just weld old blades to the new ones to effectively thicken the edge at the corners. I’ll try and find a picture.

Chains on grader.

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