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Chains on grader.

Hawk

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Dec 7, 2018
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British Columbia
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Semi retired. Run grader for the fun of it.
My question is, if you put one set of chains on a back axel, is this going to be hard on the drive chains as you now have tires that are different sizes. Should you have chains on both axles ? Running on snowy and icy, mountain logging roads. ?
 

Shimmy1

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My question is, if you put one set of chains on a back axel, is this going to be hard on the drive chains as you now have tires that are different sizes. Should you have chains on both axles ? Running on snowy and icy, mountain logging roads. ?
Wheel circumference won't be the problem, the stress on the chaincase from that axle doing all the work will be. Question is, are the chains that expensive that you can't get four sets, or do you only have two sets and want to work like that until you get two more?
 

Welder Dave

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I think if you were in conditions that required chains it wouldn't make a lot of difference and you'd be going a little slower. 4 chains would be better and it depends on what type of chains too.
 

Mother Deuce

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Worked in a mine where we had 10% grades for haulage that would regularly get dumped on with huge amounts of snow. We had 16 M's with Bridgestone VSWs. The tires were amazing! We could routinely blade uphill equipped with picks. We had chains on the nose so we could steer. While the tire expense and possibly wheel expense make the price of chains look real good, it may be something to consider in the future
 

cuttin edge

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Finish grader operator
I ran an old 13e with chains on front right and left rear. It was only residential plowing, but I broke 4 axles on 7 years. Always the one with chains. They must have had them piled like wood somewhere because they didn't seem to care. I love my winter tires. I don't work in the mountains, but I have never had to back down a hill. We run snow tires on all the loaders, and they have paid for themselves a couple times over.
 

Hawk

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Dec 7, 2018
Messages
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Location
British Columbia
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Semi retired. Run grader for the fun of it.
Thanks everyone for your replies. I know good tires really make a difference but there is no way the best tires you could buy, will go where I go with chains on. Last winter I ran with all four back tires chained up. I was always having problems with the front, so this winter I am going to try one back axel chained and run chains on the front also. I think there will be enough slip on the back axels that it won’t really matter the difference in tire size.
 

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cuttin edge

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So why not just buy another set of chains. If you can't afford something that you need, then you are working too cheap
 

Hawk

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Dec 7, 2018
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British Columbia
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Semi retired. Run grader for the fun of it.
Ya I do agree with you cuttin edge. But when you are only the driver, sometimes it is hard to convince the boss of things like that. The set that’s on the front were new last year and I think they cost around 1200 bucks.
 

cuttin edge

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Finish grader operator
I see companies and even owners taking work so cheap these days. One phase of a new highway here, engineer's estimate was over 7 million. The bids were all pretty close. We were 5th place at 6.5. boss was hoping for 5 to 700 000. Lowest bid was 3.6. on the other end, going rate for a private driveway plowed is around 35 bucks. Young lad with a case backhoe is doing them for 15 and probably putting 40 miles a storm on to do it
 

Shimmy1

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going rate for a private driveway plowed is around 35 bucks. Young lad with a case backhoe is doing them for 15 and probably putting 40 miles a storm on to do it
Holy f#(/. Is he only spending about 5 minutes per drive??? If he's taking any longer than that, he's spending more in fuel than he's making. o_Oo_Oo_O
 

Welder Dave

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I lived in an apartment several years ago and a couple guys showed up with an older skid steer to clear the parking lot. it was about -20C with a pretty good wind and they had no cab on the machine. They left their pick up running the whole time and switched back and forth every 10 or 15 minutes to warm up. What was worth is that they weren't scraping down to the pavement, they were just leveling off the packed snow. 2 days later it warmed up to where the snow got soft and people were getting stuck.

They called a large paving company who brought a wheel loader to dig up all the snow. Did a much better job but it took 2 days to finish because the operator promptly quit at precisely 5pm. I have never seen another snow removal outfit leave a job when there's less than 2 hours to finish unless they had a breakdown. There was no breakdown, they drove the loader off site and brought it back the next day.
 

Nige

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G..G..G..Granville.........!! Fetch your cloth.
Thanks everyone for your replies. I know good tires really make a difference but there is no way the best tires you could buy, will go where I go with chains on. Last winter I ran with all four back tires chained up. I was always having problems with the front, so this winter I am going to try one back axel chained and run chains on the front also. I think there will be enough slip on the back axels that it won’t really matter the difference in tire size.
Despite the fact that everyone here has advised you not to do it that way and yet you're still "gonna give it a try". There will not be "enough slip on the back axels" (sic) when one is chained and the other one isn't. One will be spinning and the other one will be wound tighter than a clock spring.......

Dear God, go out and buy another set of chains FFS. Even at $1200 they are going to to be waaaaaaay cheaper than the cost to fix the machine when it's stuck in a ditch somewhere with a popped drive chain or (even worse) a torn-up final drive that needs the complete tandem pulled off to fix it. Oh, and it'll have to be fixed right where it lies because it can't move. Good luck finding a mechanic who's prepared to work on it under those conditions........
 

20/80

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We make all or own chains for our grader's it is way cheaper by far to do, as far as using chains it depends on the conditions, if its just snow and no ice than I put chains on just the rear tires for extra traction but do not spin your tires with chains on, if its ice or a combination of snow with ice underneath 4 chains always with 1 on the front to help with steering, I have not ad any problems with wheel bearings or breaking the drive chain doing it this way, but reading what Nige has said makes me wonder if this is what happened to one of our M series graders in our sister shops with a rear axel bearing gone on one of the tandems on the left side, the operator might have been running just one chain on that side last winter, Hmm.
 

Hawk

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British Columbia
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Semi retired. Run grader for the fun of it.
Well after a bit of convincing I got the boss to order me another set of chains. Now I will have all 6 wheels chained up. We are in some pretty wild country here. The logging trucks are mostly tri drive trucks pulling B train trailers. They have all three drive axels chained, one axel on each trailer chained and most have one or two steering chains on. Not a place for new drivers to be starting out driving.
20/80 could you maybe post a pic or two of the tire chains you build ? Are they anything like the ones I am running or just the ladder style kind. Thanks again everyone for all your help.
 

Nige

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G..G..G..Granville.........!! Fetch your cloth.
I'm glad you got a result. Come back and let everyone know how it pans out once you've had some experience with chains all round.

Refer back to post #6 above regarding tyre choice. Never a truer word spoken that tyre choice can majorly affect traction in poor conditions. Maybe your boss needs to get a bit less cheap on tyres as well as chains..?
 

20/80

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nova scotia canada
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Well after a bit of convincing I got the boss to order me another set of chains. Now I will have all 6 wheels chained up. We are in some pretty wild country here. The logging trucks are mostly tri drive trucks pulling B train trailers. They have all three drive axels chained, one axel on each trailer chained and most have one or two steering chains on. Not a place for new drivers to be starting out driving.
20/80 could you maybe post a pic or two of the tire chains you build ? Are they anything like the ones I am running or just the ladder style kind. Thanks again everyone for all your help.
That's right they are the ladder style chains that we make, we find that if you happen to break a cross link you can repair it easy in the field, the one's you are running are studded chain for ice pretty much the best you can get but would play hell on pave roads getting from one back road to another which we do a lot of, our roads are not far enough apart to justify taking them off, we used to run square link cross chains for ice back in the day they were harder and worked very well on smooth ice but cuts in the department they just buy regular chains for cross links now, I find keeping your chains tight on your wheels will save them and your tires, so put lots of rubber bungee straps or spider bungee to keep them tight, we had a operator on one of our loaders ruin a complete set of new tires spinning them inside the chains, very similar to your style of chains because of running them to loose, he does not work for us now.
 

Hawk

Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2018
Messages
11
Location
British Columbia
Occupation
Semi retired. Run grader for the fun of it.
Refer back to post #6 above regarding tyre choice. Never a truer word spoken that tyre choice can majorly affect traction in poor conditions. Maybe your boss needs to get a bit less cheap on tyres as well as chains..?
I have to disagree with you a bit on this Nige. Don’t get me wrong, I really appreciate your input but I don’t think spending big bucks on the best tires and putting chains on them makes sense to me. If I was working in conditions where traction was just a bit iffy a lot then maybe good tires. But when it turns to winter here chains are a must, so I don’t see the benefit to spending big bucks on tires also. Once I put chains on they stay till spring. I’m sure glad for your advice, think it was your post that I showed to my boss, that convinced him to buy me that last set of chains.
 

Hawk

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Joined
Dec 7, 2018
Messages
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Location
British Columbia
Occupation
Semi retired. Run grader for the fun of it.
I find keeping your chains tight on your wheels will save them and your tires, so put lots of rubber bungee straps or spider bungee to keep them tight, we had a operator on one of our loaders ruin a complete set of new tires spinning them inside the chains, very similar to your style of chains because of running them to loose, he does not work for us now.
I don’t use bungee straps. I keep my chains super tight with a chain jack. The net looking chain is connected in four spots on the face of the tire. I use what’s called a pin connector there, then I do up the side chains. Once I tighten the sides with the jack there is no slack at all. They do stretch a bit over time but I tighten when ever it’s needed. I can travel full speed on good parts of the road if I’m just high blading back to my pickup. But I don’t go on pavement. Like you say, I bet they would be really hard on pavement.
We are thinking of putting on the carbit or stinger cutting edge as I have a hard time cutting into ice with the serrated ice edges. Just wondering if you have any experience with them ??
 
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