Deere vs Cat controls

[Jdigger4130]

I want ask the experts what your preference is and why in regards to control layout in an excavator. For me I can only be efficient w Deere. I am curious to what the industry standard is and why. Is there A benefit? Thanks in advance

 

[sultan]

Use whatever control layout works best for you. It's just what you get used to. Where I am in Southern Ontario, 95%+ of excavators I've seen run on CAT controls. I'm used to CAT controls and they're the only layout I can be productive with. My own John Deere excavator runs on CAT controls. What I like about the CAT layout is that I find there is better division of work between the hands. When digging, I have my left hand working the stick, while my right hand works the curl (and boom).

Now Deere layout guys will say the their right hand works the stick and curl while their left hand can work the boom, so... it's just a preference of whatever you're used to. Being proficient with cat controls is an important and near necessary skill round here due to the popularity of the cat layout.

 

[Jdigger4130]

Thanks sultan, I only rent small machines at work maybe A few times A year and seem pretty natural on the Deere system but find myself liking this type of work more satisfying than carpentry. With the Cat controls its apparent REAL quick my skills are novice at best! The guys I know round here ( California) say the pros lean to Cat as well. I truly flail when I set the machines to Cat... I embarrass my self and it gets dangerous! MORE PRACTICE

 

[Digga Dave]

G'day guys,

In Australia Excavators are almost all SAE and Backhoes (traditional controls) are ISO. However newer Backhoes with excavator style joysticks offer both styles.

In the SAE control pattern, the left hand controls swing (left-right) and dipper (in-out), and the right hand controls the boom (up-down) and bucket (curl-uncurl).

* Left hand left = swing left.
* Left hand right = swing right.
* Left hand forward = dipper out away from operator.
* Left hand back = dipper in toward operator.

* Right hand left = bucket curl.
* Right hand right = bucket uncurl.
* Right hand forward = boom down.
* Right hand = boom up.

The other most commonly used control pattern is ISO controls, which differs from the SAE control pattern only in that ISO controls exchange the hands that control the boom and the dipper.

I have next to no experience on Deere excavators downunder because they are as scarce as hens teeth and am curious as to what Deere controls are?

 

[S.R.E.]

G'day guys,

In Australia Excavators are almost all SAE and Backhoes (traditional controls) are ISO. However newer Backhoes with excavator style joysticks offer both styles.

In the SAE control pattern, the left hand controls swing (left-right) and dipper (in-out), and the right hand controls the boom (up-down) and bucket (curl-uncurl).

* Left hand left = swing left.
* Left hand right = swing right.
* Left hand forward = dipper out away from operator.
* Left hand back = dipper in toward operator.

* Right hand left = bucket curl.
* Right hand right = bucket uncurl.
* Right hand forward = boom down.
* Right hand = boom up.

The other most commonly used control pattern is ISO controls, which differs from the SAE control pattern only in that ISO controls exchange the hands that control the boom and the dipper.

I have next to no experience on Deere excavators downunder because they are as scarce as hens teeth and am curious as to what Deere controls are?

"Deere controls" is ISO
"Cat controls" is SAE

 

[S.R.E.]

I want ask the experts what your preference is and why in regards to control layout in an excavator. For me I can only be efficient w Deere. I am curious to what the industry standard is and why. Is there A benefit? Thanks in advance

If your just starting out and would like to make a career out of operating check with some large companies around you and see what they run. Then take the time to "relearn" that control pattern and go with that.

On a side note I have been operating equipment for over twenty years and just last summer switched to Deere controls for a new job. It took me a couple of months before I could fine grade without concentrating too hard.

 

[LSchulz]

A lot of it is what yo've learned on. I started on Deere controls around 8th grade, and have been running those ever since. If I get into something set to Cat controls it's all back-asswards.

 

[Drc]

I think that possibly Cat controls are better on an excavator and JD on a backhoe either way it good to be able to operate both but that requires constantly changing back and forth on a almost daily basis.

 

[OOOSQ]

Just fit a pattern change valve and use both!!

 

[wnydirtguy]

I am used to Cat on excavators and deere on backhoes. if they are switched I look like a rookie trying to run them. After some time I can run it ok when they are backwards.

 

[spitzair]

My dad is used to JD controls and when I was a runt that's what I learned on. Then came the rude awakening when I went to run a machine for somebody else. It seems only a handfull of people use JD controls around my neck of the woods. So I relearned the cat controls and now I can't function on JD controls. When my dad and I switch out on his 303 we always reach for the pattern changer knob first. When I bought my EX200-2 recently my dad insisted I install a JD/CAT switch too so we could both use the machine as he was too stubborn to relearn the Cat pattern... At least he paid for the switch! Actually not the biggest deal in town to install, and it works quite well.

 

[ILLICEMAN]

Too old to change.I will not even try to run JD controls.My JD 200 CLC is set on Cat.

 

[DGODGR]

I prefer Cat controls. That's what I learned on. I have used "Deere" controls in the past. I have always felt most comfortable with Cat controls. I think that's because I learned on them first and I have a lot more hours on that pattern (by far). I think that going back and forth, between Cat and Deere, is harder than going between other patterns. IMO this is because they are so similar. IME Cat controls are more popular in the US. Certainly with the larger outfits. It seems odd to call Cat SAE and Deere ISO. The "Cat" pattern IS SAE standard for a "large" excavator. The flip side is that the "Deere" pattern is SAE standard for a "small" excavator. I'm not sure what size the break is at or why the brilliant minds at SAE even made two different standards. There are a lot more patterns out there if you throw in the TLBs. It seems to me that all the different patterns were, or developed into, a marketing strategy. Once a customer gets used to a particular pattern it will be difficult for a competing brand to win him over if he will have to learn a new pattern. You have to admit that it's a good marketing strategy. It sure can be frustrating for the end user though.

 

[Jdigger4130]

Thank you all. I am glad to hear practice seems to be the answer and being a "good all around hand" takes most people awhile. It's nice to know that I am not the only guy that struggles. I wish we actually owned A machine at work so I could just run the hour meter up w no one around after hours as it is just plain unsafe trying to "get it right" during work. At 250 A day to rent A Deere 50 which is what we get when we dig I just cant afford to get one to D**K off over the weekend! Thank again fellas for yer input

 

[csuf007]

lol

 

[WV earth mover]

stick to what you know i have to use jd but just because of years on a rubber tired hoe befor ever running excavators there is no reason to switch now

 

[ZAXIS]

Jdigger4130, I am definately not an expert, but I do have a preference. I learned on "JD" controls and that's how our three Hitachi's are set up today. Learned to dig on a Ford 555 wobble stick backhoe, so it was a natural for me. Still cannot run "cat" pattern". Not sure if one is more productive than the other, just what I am used to. Had the opportunity to go to a Komatsu Demo in Chattanooga,Tn. back in '97 & got to run the PC750, PC1000, a 200, and 220, but they were set up "Cat", so that was frustrating, but still a memorable experience.

 

[GCC]

I can operate in both cat and deere but like cat so much more.

 

[xcv8tr7]

When I used to run ISO the other didn't make any sense. Now that I run SAE I don't know why ISO ever seemed right. HAHA

 

[digger242j]

It's an age old question, discussed in the first thread I ever started on here. That's ok, we can always have fresh discussions. I just posted that link for anybody who'd like to review the earlier one.

I learned on Case 3 lever controls with swing pedals. Later, I bought a Case 580 that had JD type joysticks, so I, learned that. I could jump back and forth between those two machines and never miss a beat. Still later, I got on an excavator, with Cat type controls, and that took some getting used to, but I found that I could still switch back and forth to that hoe with the JD controls and never had a problem.

Fast forward to today--I've spent lots of time on excavators with Cat controls, but occasionally, a plumber friend of mine will ask me to run his Takeuchi mini, and it has the JD controls, and no pattern switcher. It takes me about an hour to re-program my hands so that I don't look like I'm clueless. You might think that having run that 580, I'd have no problem, but it's the fact that that one was a backhoe and the others are both excavators that screws my mind up.

Last year, we had to borrow a Cat 416 from another guy for an hour or so. My old 580 is long gone. The Cat's usual operator had it switched to JD pattern, and I had to switch it back to Cat pattern to use it, so, so much for the difference between hoe and excavator any more.

Yesterday, I had to load some trucks with a full size Kobelco, Cat pattern. Most recently, I'd been on the plumber's Tak for a few weeks, and a Kobelco mini a few weeks later. On the Kobelco mini, I just switched to JD pattern, becasue I might have to get back on the JD patterned Tak, but I still didn't feel quite at home. I spent about 15 minutes making a fool of myself on the full sized Kobelco, and another half hour being a little uncomfortable, but after an hour or so, I was right at home again.

(Now watch the plumber call me, and screw me up all over again.)

Anyway, having run both the Cat patterned excavators and the JD patterned 580, almost side by side, and done so proficiently on both types, I can't say that my preference would be for anything more than what I'm used to at the given time.

(And it's off topic for this specific thread, but I'll still take the 3 lever Case pattern for a hoe, because I can use my right hand for boom and dipper, swing if necessary with my feet, and reach around behind me with my left hand and steer the front wheels while pushing with the hoe. Try that with one hand needed for the dipper and the other for the boom.)