Why no prices advertised on websites?

[LRAT]

I am in the market for a new excavator and I'm flabbergasted with the fact that none of the distributors nor dealers are listing the sales prices. The only exception seems to be Sany.
When I want to buy a car or a bike or whatever the cost price is always shown.
But for excavatores of even attachments: Nothing!
I have sent all these emails to distributors to find out a price and even then they won't give a cost price and refer me to the dealers.
Dealers don't want to give a price over the phone. I live in the middle of the sticks and the nearest dealers are 150 km away. I am not going to burn all that fuel just to find out the price.
This is such an annoying fact and I wonder why.
Al least they could give an inficative price such as: Starts from, and depending on accessories, implements, options, etc. it will go up.
I am just wasting my time chasing prices and can't compare brands.
Why the secrecy???
I'm puzzled and anoyed.
How do you guys find out the cost price? Are their any hidden secretive websites floating around on the internet?

 

[92U 3406]

Seems to me that's the way it normally is in the equipment and heavy truck industry here in western Canada anyways. Only the used stuff seems to have prices easily displayed.

 

[LRAT]

I just made another call to another dealer (Hyundai): Same story: Can't give you prices over the phone, asking for contact details and a sales representative will call me tommorrow.
I am not interested to hang on the phone and listen to a sales advertissement telling that their machines are the best. I just want a price and then I will know whether it's in my budget or not. All that hassle and time wasting for nothing in return at all. Crazy world. This is worse than dealing with time shares.
I am time poor and I don't have the time to liaise with 50 sales persons. I might just buy a Sany!

 

[OzDozer]

No pricing means you would go into shock if you saw the starting price - and it also gives the sellers a chance to "feel" you out for a start, to see if you have so much money, you don't care what you pay to get their item of equipment, you just need it NOW!

Also, in times of high inflation, as we have now, pricing can change from day to day, and the sellers are intent on screwing the maximum price rise out of unsuspecting buyers.
In 1972-1975 in Australia, we hit 17% inflation under a left-wing, free-spending, wastrel Govt, and prices changed weekly, and went up more than double, in less than 3 years.

 

[uffex]

Good day
Known has "catching the fish on the hook" knowing who you are where you are so they can pester you with offers.A good method to adopt is to enquire with recent customers for that product, most are prepared to give you an idea.
Kind regards
Uffex

 

[zeroo]

I’ve never experienced that with kubota. I can get price texted to me from dealer I use. You can build and price on their website but it’s just an msrp. Like $10k higher than what you’d pay unless your an idiot.

 

[Canadian_digger]

Let the salesman call you. let them know what you’re looking for, and if they are any good they will get you a price. I’ve gotten prices before without meeting anyone in person.

 

[KSSS]

Another way to look at this process is this. Buying and selling new equipment is a relationship, talking with a sales person on the price and options is the start of that relationship. It will tell you somethings about the dealership to which your also in a relationship with, at least until the warranty is gone, if not for the life of the machine. Does this take time? of course it does, but its hardly a waste of time. Your busy, their busy, we are all busy, but how much money does that piece of equipment bring into your operation? Does picking the right machine and dealer to support you worth the time to properly investigate the purchase? My personal thought is, if your strictly buying off price, you also not as informed about the products as maybe you should be. It would likely be beneficial to spend the time understanding fully what the equipment and dealer can do for you. It makes little sense to post prices on the internet. Like someone mentioned, they are always at MSRP which even today, doesn't represent the actual price you will pay.

 

[John C.]

Price is only a starting place in a negotiation. Value is what you pay. A negotiation is a competition with the rules based on leverage. You derive interest by way of conversation with your rival, the sales rep. You start the conversation with a little bit of information about yourself. "I need to do something that requires a machine." They reciprocate by asking about that something and hopefully you then have a dialog started. Calling up a dealer saying I want a price on a certain machine will get you nowhere if you have never started the dialog in the first place.

 

[oceanobob]

The dealership sales personnel have consistently informed me (over the years) there is and can be no price mentioned until they know things about the purchaser such as if you are self funded, or require financing....are you trading in....and accessories like buckets, options, factory packages, machine in stock vs order lead time, does the machine have to be new or can it be a dealer lease demo model with a couple or so several hours but contractually sold as factory new as to warranty, etc etc.
Once the potential deal is defined, the price is calculated and presented.

Sorry to hear of ye frustrations.

 

[LRAT]

Hi oceanonbob,

That's all well and true, but the same is applicable to cars and they show the price on every website!
I agree, there are many variables. but at least they could show a price for the base model and add prices as we go along with the order.
By showing a base price then I would know straight away whether it's in my budget or not. Calling around is a waste of everybody's time.
If I have a budget of say $80,000 and I call around and they tell me the machine will cost $100,000 then it's a waste of time. I will need to do this at least ten times to compare brands against one another.
Thanks for your reply.

 

[Vetech63]

The price is what the market will bear.
If you have $100K.......then the price of your machine is $100K.
If you have $175K........then the price of your machine is $175K
So on and so forth............

 

[sfrs4]

Let them call you, it's then like playing poker, NEVER let them know what's in your hand, and let them play theirs first, if they ask what you have as a budget "enough to buy what I need, not enough to waste on what I don't" if you are looking at a specific machine just outright ask " what's the price on that?" if they don't tell you, put the phone straight down, don't get suckered into "well it's this but if you tell me what you have to spend I'll have a look around for something for you" because that cheap machine round the back of the lot just went up a few grand to just under what you have.
Every dealer knows what they need out of a machine to 1. breakeven 2. make a healthy profit 3. make market value, so they know what its worth, if they won't tell you they're just trying to rip you off, this is what happened once they started making the larger portion of a salesman's wages come from commission percentage, they don't care about you, your circumstance, or even what the best machine really is for you, just where they can get max profit and largest commission. this also now works with houses, cars anything with bonus wages based on commission.

 

[ianjoub]

That is great in theory. BUT, if you want to now if something costs $30k or $300k, you want a rough price thrown your way. You may be in the market, but you may also never be in the market.

 

[sfrs4]

@ianjoub the problem is that it is now pretty much industry standard to not give a price on adverts, as annoying as it is ( and I really do appreciate this, as currently trying to buy a new used tractor for my dad) it's just how they all try to use their salespeople to pull you in. no one but the sales people like the idea, but it's the way it is unfortunately.

 

[Clguest]

I was looking for a 4000 series Deere tractor here in the states some time ago and found a very low hour one equipped just the way I wanted. The sales guy was young, and in my opinion, oddly indifferent to building a warm relationship with me. He gave me a price, and indicated in so many words, 'take it or leave it'. Some time later I came to realize that it was a good price on a tractor the dealer was ready to move. Unfortunately, I had not done my homework and did not realize the price was reasonable.

Since then I have invested several hours over several days looking at asking prices on the internet for equipment (and autos) that I plan to buy. Then, with a reasonable understanding of asking prices (and sometimes auction price results) I phone the dealers to learn if they have the unit I want available. After learning who has an offering suitable for me, I call the sales guy back and tell him about when I plan to come in and how long I have to talk to him. Yes, it is a long process. It can be interesting however if not 'fun' to make the rounds and what you want at a fair price. (I should add a step, I often will spend several hours running the specific machine or similar demo machine (or test drive the auto) before talking price.

Alternatively, I have seen corporate purchasing guys call a dealer, tell them what they need (specs) and where to deliver it, and commit to pay the MSRP. They need it now and time is more valuable than getting the best price on a single piece of equipment.

In Australia where I believe you are located, long distances to any dealer may make it necessary for you to call for the price. Be persistent. If they understand you are serious, they will do what is necessary to make the sale.

 

[John C.]

You also don't have to deal with the flunky that stays by the door of the business. I have seen plenty of people just walk into the sales managers office and start asking questions. It best he will provide answers right away. At worst he will get someone else to deal with you.

 

[CM1995]

Another way to look at this process is this. Buying and selling new equipment is a relationship, talking with a sales person on the price and options is the start of that relationship. It will tell you somethings about the dealership to which your also in a relationship with, at least until the warranty is gone, if not for the life of the machine. Does this take time? of course it does, but its hardly a waste of time. Your busy, their busy, we are all busy, but how much money does that piece of equipment bring into your operation? Does picking the right machine and dealer to support you worth the time to properly investigate the purchase? My personal thought is, if your strictly buying off price, you also not as informed about the products as maybe you should be. It would likely be beneficial to spend the time understanding fully what the equipment and dealer can do for you. It makes little sense to post prices on the internet. Like someone mentioned, they are always at MSRP which even today, doesn't represent the actual price you will pay.

This. ^^^

The initial purchase price is a small component of the life cycle cost for a piece of iron.

My Cat salesman has taken parts (intercooler hose and aux valve) off a brand new 325FL in order to keep us running on a high profile job. What's the value in that?

When I get ready for another 325 we will have a conversation on options, technology, etc and then he will send me a formal quote that will be more than I want to pay for.

There is a huge difference between buying a Honda Accord online compared to 25 ton hydraulic excavator. The car is a commodity and the excavator is a specialized piece of heavy equipment.

 

[John C.]

A car is a want to have or maybe a need to have and it always costs you money. Heavy equipment is a have to have and it has the element of being able to make money for you.

 

[apetad]

Nowadays a lot of MANUFACTURERS do not know what it will cost until it is actually built & shipped. Therefore, what do I charge for one on hand when I do not know what the replacement is going to cost me, or when I'll ever get replacement inventory? I literally get a call that says "the 2 you ordered 18 months ago are built and ready to ship, the price is X, do you still want them?" A VERY DIFFICULT question for a dealership to answer now is "how much and when?".