What if we had New Control Pattern on the M Series Graders?

[Radrock]

OK, I had to toy with this a little. I have been operating graders for most of my 40 year career. I just started operating a 140M about 4 months ago. I like lots of things about it and if I had nothing to do but maintaining haul roads or even building them it isn't too awful bad. But any of you old-timers out there that know how to grab a handful of levers at the same time know what I am talking about when it comes to grading a very tight corner. It is a combination of wheel lean, articulation, steering and blade control. This joy stick works fine with the steering and I can get along with the articulation fairly good. But you watch your left hand doing all of the work while the right hand is merely moving the blade up and down and turning the circle. Oh and running the blade side shift. I think the wheel lean is very very unusable and is probably the one thing I hate more than anything. I used to do lots of small turns using nothing but the wheel lean so I did not have to remove my hands from the rack. You can accomplish this pretty easy now with the joystick turning. You can grab both the wheel lean and articulation with your right hand at the same time (pull them both for right turn and push for left turn) in the old rack style. I created this drawing changing things around a little how I would like to have a joystick controlled motor grader. With this you could still hit the wheel lean, articulation and steer all at the same time. Oh did I mention that I think the hat switch is a piece of junk?? hahaha.

Well I just thought I get an opinion and see how much of you know what I could stir up. Of course I'm too old to ever see a change in them again but it is always nice to have a wish list.

Oh and those are slider switches...

 

[gilledp]

Radrock, I like thinking outside the box. You are proposing eliminating the twisting action of both joysticks? One question...is it important to be able to use articulation and circle simultaneously? When turning around for a pass in the opposite direction I will use circle and articulation together as I setup for the next pass...seems this would be impossible since both functions require my right thumb. Perhaps you have already thought through this....

 

[Radrock]

Radrock, I like thinking outside the box. You are proposing eliminating the twisting action of both joysticks? One question...is it important to be able to use articulation and circle simultaneously? When turning around for a pass in the opposite direction I will use circle and articulation together as I setup for the next pass...seems this would be impossible since both functions require my right thumb. Perhaps you have already thought through this....

Actually I do use the circle too when turning around. But honestly I didn't think about what that would be like. I don't mind the circle reverse being a twist handle. And it all gets a little easier with time. I don't think that wheel lean is something that I will ever like. It is too out of reach for me. It's too bad there isn't a way to experiment but there isn't. Everything is in the opposite hand now as the rack was. Another thing I noticed on my M is that the circle doesn't seem to turn as fast as the H did. I don't know if there is a way to turn them up or not. Not much response on this post so I'm guessing everyone that is running one is OK with it. I am too, when just doing regular blading. Just have to think ahead what you want to do with the wheel lean. Before long it will be like our cell phones... Just tell it what you want it to do. hahaha.

 

[d9gdon]

I agree on the wheel lean, it's not handy where it is.

I use articulation a lot and notice that I can't seem to use it and wheel lean together very well. I'm not sure that it wouldn't feel more natural to put the wheel lean on the right joystick side to side(where blade slide is now). I haven't put a lot of thought into that and I don't have a lot of hours on our 140M yet.

 

[Radrock]

I agree on the wheel lean, it's not handy where it is.

I use articulation a lot and notice that I can't seem to use it and wheel lean together very well. I'm not sure that it wouldn't feel more natural to put the wheel lean on the right joystick side to side(where blade slide is now). I haven't put a lot of thought into that and I don't have a lot of hours on our 140M yet.

I thought I had replied to this but I guess not. I don't think I would like the wheel lean on where the blade slide is. I use that a lot for close quarter blading. You have a little more control on that rather than a button. And after a little studing I don't think I would want the circle reverse on the joy stick like I am showing. Not to sure if it wouldn't be better to still keep the rotation of the stick for the circle reverse. You could still use the slider buttons for sharp turns. Oh well. I thought I would get a little more input on old blade men that has done a lot of close quarter blading. It is all just a thought anyway.

 

[Bluetop Man]

Congrats, Radrock, that was excellent rant about how crappy is the M Series for fine grading. Yes, the wheel lean is one big problema. I reject any revision of the joy stick controls. My contempt for this machine is based on exactly 40 years this year of on-again, off-again cumulative experience as a grader operator, much it finishing soil-cement and rock base with E's, F's and G's. Few people ever gain an in depth understanding what a highly experienced motor grader operator like yourself knows. I leave it to you to be the judge.

Since you are actually running an M Series at the present time, perhaps you can answer this question: Has the new cab shape eliminated gaining cab access by climbing onto the rear chain case and making your way to the door?

I mean, if that access has been eliminated, that is simply sacrilegious, worse than the wheel lean. I reckon CAT will say something like, "Well, you don't get on a horse from the rear, do you?" The Lone Ranger did...

 

[Radrock]

Congrats, Radrock, that was excellent rant about how crappy is the M Series for fine grading. Yes, the wheel lean is one big problema. I reject any revision of the joy stick controls. My contempt for this machine is based on exactly 40 years this year of on-again, off-again cumulative experience as a grader operator, much it finishing soil-cement and rock base with E's, F's and G's. Few people ever gain an in depth understanding what a highly experienced motor grader operator like yourself knows. I leave it to you to be the judge.

Since you are actually running an M Series at the present time, perhaps you can answer this question: Has the new cab shape eliminated gaining cab access by climbing onto the rear chain case and making your way to the door?

I mean, if that access has been eliminated, that is simply sacrilegious, worse than the wheel lean. I reckon CAT will say something like, "Well, you don't get on a horse from the rear, do you?" The Lone Ranger did...

Hi Bluetop,
Aww,, I'm sort of use to the way it is but I haven't been to a test on a tight situation yet. I don't think I could keep it in near as a straight line as an H or G model. Of course the old E and F was real easy to keep a straight line hahaha. It is nice cause it is tight and newer than my old H. Lot's of good stuff but I think it could have been better. I have no clue how many M's are out there now but there are a bunch and some guys will tell you they are the best there is. I'm just glad I have a tight blade and I am at the point in my life that I really don't care one way or another. I'll do the best I can with what I have and I have one thing to look forward to in the near future. I really wish that I could operate a John Deer GP model once but that will probably never happen. As for access climbing in from behind the blade. I have not even tried it but I am sure you would have trouble doing it. I have done it that way a lot of times in my life, probably mostly cause some operators can't seem to keep the blade out from under the steps and tear the damn things off. The M is easy enough to get in and out up the steps although it seems that big door gets in the way most of the time. It is like everything else on it. You have to learn everything all over. Another thing I don't like is that it does not have an air compressor. I know you can get an option for that but this one does not have it. We have lots of flint rock here in our part of the world. I keep my tires underinflated a lot of the time to save wear and tear on them. I have seen a new tire get cut to shreds very quick especially when aired up too much. Having an onboard air compressor lets me air them back up if working on steep slopes or other situations. Can't do that now. So I just leave them down hahaha. Mine has the wide tires so I am glad about that.

It is what it is and I can't change much. It's fun to think you can though

 

[Bluetop Man]

For me, the E and the F Models remain the best fine grade machines. The center of gravity was lower, so there was less rocking, providing more stability. Lower the tire pressure to 17 lbs. all the way around and there was less bounce. These outdated machines will out grade a G Model and anything newer any day of the year.

 

[Radrock]

For me, the E and the F Models remain the best fine grade machines. The center of gravity was lower, so there was less rocking, providing more stability. Lower the tire pressure to 17 lbs. all the way around and there was less bounce. These outdated machines will out grade a G Model and anything newer any day of the year.

I remember the first F I ran. I thought I was in heaven not getting the poop kicked out of my hands. It sure did shear a lot of pins though.