i need to buy

[mouse]

i'm sure someone in china'd soon cast you up a few. alternately a local foundry should be able to assuming you supply them with the pattern.

there's a yard at either wagga or albury that sells a lot of vintage stuff on ihub, steam based mainly, though they might know where to find some at a guess.

if i was looking for one in australia i'd place a wanted ad in The Land and/or the qld equivalent and see what turns up. I suspect they been recycled eons ago however.

bit of gumpf bout the process

in the working photo here it shows a dozer chasing and presumably about to clear the ball

 

[Deas Plant]

On needing correction......................................

Hi, OCR.
Before making any comment on that statement, I'd like to see some photos of the country that is being cleared and some information about chain size and the tractors being used to pull it. There are a few too many variables in the equation to be making many firm recommendations about it.

Maputowhite, is there any chance that you might be able to post some photos of the country and some details of the tractors and chain? The photo piranhas here will love you for it.

One thing that always surprised me about chaining, especially in heavier timber, was just how big a tree TWO dozers could pull down between them when one would have been struggling to push that same tree over with just its blade with probably more reach up the tree than the chain would have. In my experience, if the two dozers could not PULL a tree down, it often took a dozer with a tree pusher bar to knock it down, or at least to knock it down quickly. Which is why they often used a chaser dozer WITH a tree pusher bar when working in heavy timber. The idea was not necessarily to flatten the tree but rather to loosen it up to the point where the two pulling tractors could finish it off.

It was also not a good idea to totally flatten a tree inside the chain before the chain got to it as it would often get its roots and/or branches tangled in the chain. If one of the pulling dozers saw a tree that might be a problem, the best approach was to soften it up a bit and leave it for the chain to pull right down.

 

[Squizzy246B]

Maputowhite,
I'm sure Deas would love to come over and give you some help with your clearing job.....but I've heard he doesn't have the balls for it.......:lmao:falldownlaugh


Ok Ok...someone had to do the balls joke:cool2

 

[Deas Plant]

On not having..................

Hi, Squizzy246B,
Since neither my ex-wife nor my last long-term partner seem to have them in a jar on their respective mantelpieces, I don't know who else would have them BUT me.

Last time I tried it - some little time ago now - crossing my legs was NOT the most comfortable way for me to sit. I seemed to have a quite distinct feeling of a 'crush zone' in there somewhere.

And just what sort of an example is a moderator setting by hi-jacking a thread?

LOL.

 

[maputowhite]

Txs for all the comments from "having too not having balls"
I'll try post some photos - i really appreciate your help even the tonge in cheek replies.
The tress are sadly very large african hardwoods & are older than most of our combined ages - 2 to 4m dia.i know it's a sin but it's what's know as progress.i'm not the farmer i'm the oily rag.

 

[Vantage_TeS]

If you wanna go home made try this:

Take a metal 55 gallon drum (thats around 3" diameter right?) and find a thick metal pipe that your chain will fit through nicely. Place the pipe in the center of the drum and pour concrete around it. That should give you some nice weight and decent strength. You could also made up a rebar "cage" to insert in the drum for added strength as well as weld a bunch of plate etc on the outside of the drum. Once the conrete is set weld on metal "caps" on either end then slide your chain through the pipe. Tadaa! Cheap roller made from scrap.

You can also find tow behind sheeps foot compactors such as this: http://www.rbauction.com/equipment_images/2008299/large/2149839_1.jpg

If you found a old scrapped or broken (or cheap) one you could just use a single wheel as it would chop up underbrush pretty good and already has bearings you could attach your chains to.

 

[maputowhite]

txs guys both good ideas from vantage TeS & Deas Plant.I let you know the result.

 

[Deas Plant]

One snag that I can see.

Hi, Maputowhite.
Vantage Tes has come up with a couple of ideas that may well work too. There is one snag that I can see to using pipe or 55 gallon drums or old sheepsfoot roller drums in trees of the size you describe. If a ball hit such a tree pretty much square on, it would tend to slide to one side or the other leaving the great bulk of the load as a more or less direct pull on the chains, shackles and swivels. If a roller hits such a tree - 2m to 4m dia. - anything like square in the middle it may well end up with the chains pulling at quite sharp angles to the centre line of the roller and thus to the shaft through said roller. This may result in bending or breaking unless said shaft is 'Gah-dawful' strong. The narrower the roller, the less likely this would be to happen.

You haven't yet mentioned the size of the chain you are using or what tractors you are using to pull it. I would imagine that if you are pulling trees of the size you describe, you would hardly be using a couple of 7J series D4's and I don't think your grandfather's fob watch chain is going to hack the pace either. Also, are you using a 'chaser' dozer?

 

[mouse]

ok deas, potential alternatives to using a chain with/without a ball?

2-4m is good sized timber and much bigger than most of the typical country i've seen pulled from walgett to charters towers.

all in all a nice challenge.

 

[Deas Plant]

Potential alternatives

Hi, Mouse.
Possible alternatives? BIG dozers with rakes and GOOD tree psuher bars. If some of those trees are 2 - 4 metres in diameter, unless they are awfully shallow rooted, they are going to be hard to pull down with a chain, especially if there are any largish gaps between them to allow the chain to fall down to the ground again.

I have not been able to quickly find any really helpful information about topography and vegetation in Northern Mozambique beyond that it is largely tropical/sub-tropical and mostly coastal lowlands. A look at Google Earth seemed to indicate the presence of a LOT of waterways with possible heavier vegetation bordering them.

From what I have seen of trees in photos of other parts of Africa, they seem to tend towards thick short trunks with VERY wide-spreading branches. Such trees are NOT easy to pull down with a chain 'cos the wide-spreading branches tend to snag the chain and stop it sliding up and over the tree and moving on. Whether or not this same scenario applies in the country that Maputowhite is talking about, I have no idea.

Such trees are also a PITA with a dozer/rake/treepusher combination 'cos you often have to break some of the branches off to allow access to the main trunk so that you can get a halfway decent purchase for a tree pusher bar. A sort of a parallel here in DownUnder would be a big Moreton Bay Fig tree with its spreading branches and buttressed roots. At least with a Moreton Bay fig, the buttressed roots would help to lift the chain as it approached the tree. I don't know if Maputowhite's tree have buttressed roots.

Input! Input!

 

[Squizzy246B]

Hi, Mouse.
Possible alternatives? BIG dozers with rakes and GOOD tree psuher bars. If some of those trees are 2 - 4 metres in diameter, unless they are awfully shallow rooted, they are going to be hard to pull down with a chain,


From what I have seen of trees in photos of other parts of Africa, they seem to tend towards thick short trunks with VERY wide-spreading branches. Such trees are NOT easy to pull down with a chain 'cos the wide-spreading branches tend to snag the chain and stop it sliding up and over the tree and moving on. Whether or not this same scenario applies in the country that Maputowhite is talking about, I have no idea.

The dozer idea has it merits. We used to clear areas known locally (aboriginal) as "Wilgie"...so named because man nor dog could hardly walk through this country. When the scrub was cleared away you were left every 30 yards or so with massive Paperbark trees...about 2-3 metres in diameter but the trunk only went up about 10-12 metres. Very very dense timber and well rooted. Our best operator could bring one down about every 15 minutes or so with a D8 fitted with a tree pusher....but he was a very skillful operator and concentrated on ripping the key roots first. You would have had no chance chaining these trees. The trick was to do it at the right time of year. In summer the D8 would have no chance and in winter the D8 would sink to the belly. Springtime, when the ground was just firm enough for the dozer. A modern D9 would probably do well.

 

[mouse]

haven't you got work to do squizzy

how goes it over there?

 

[Squizzy246B]

haven't you got work to do squizzy

G,day Mouse....yur assumin that poor old contractors like me will blindly submit to that politically motivated moronic habit of fiddling with mother natures timing an such. Nobody is going to get me adjustin me watch. It may well work for those on the eastern extremes of political time zones but when you are already on the western edge of a zone it plain sucks.

Besides which...it was hammerin down with rain this mornin.

Busy busy, too much to do here at the moment.

 

[mouse]

err, fair call, i forgot bout the time difference...

i'd have thought rain just makes for better traction if you are working in sand?

 

[Deas Plant]

I HATE Peace.

Fight, you buggers, fight. I HATE peace.

LOL.

 

[Squizzy246B]

err, fair call, i forgot bout the time difference...

i'd have thought rain just makes for better traction if you are working in sand?

Its a fair to call to say that WA is a bit outa sync with the rest of the known universe Mouse

...and normally you would be correct about us needing adequate quantities of H2O in order to acheive compaction. However, not all sand is good sand I'm afraid. Are you familiar with the practice of trying to compact a bag full of marbles?. Today, the 4WD tractor delivering our blocks got bogged in our worksite......thats not a good omen if you follow my drift.

Please ignore the Bufo Marinus above

whats the chances of getting this one back on track?:cool2

 

[Deas Plant]

Sticks-n-stones

Hi, Squizzy246B.
"Sticks-n-stones"...........................

I'm waiting for the thread originator, Maputowhite, to get back to us with more details of chain size and the tractors he is planning on using and - am I being too optimistic - some photos of the country he will be working in. Jus' havin' sum funn whyl way-tin'.

Is that back on track enuff fer yuh?

 

[OCR]

Bufo Marinus

Eeewww .... Nasty, nasty.... poison too.
Rather sour facial expression also... :lmao



Now... back on track.


OCR

PS...

Howzyer edumackayshun progressing, young feller?

Seems to be progressing, as I learn more... :lmao

 

[Squizzy246B]

OCR...while we are waiting for this thread to get back on track...

The trick is with the Toads, you need to hit them head on...so the wheel closes their mouth....this way the pressure builds up in the Toad and their innards explode out their........ointhead

A lot of people like the old salt and vinegar trick but I prefer a 3 iron or a 5 wood.:drinkup

Anyway...better stop picking on ole Deas....the property values just fell dramatically in his area....well since my wife got off the plane in Brisbane this morning anyway.

I thought talking about Balls was much more fun. Which begs the question;

Was the balls & chain clearing business an Australianism or was it used much in other countries???...

 

[Deas Plant]

Ball and chain.

Hi. Squizzy246B
I don't think we-us Aussies had any patents or copyrights on the system/method but I haven't heard an awful lot about it from anywhere else either. One member here did mention using 2 x D8's and a chain for clearing in Belize a while back.