Help getting my first 953 loader. Advice Please Hauling questions also.

[Georgia Iron]

Hello all.

I currently have a 75xt case skid steer(7300 lbs) and mini ex (11,000 lbs). I want to get a larger machine to load dirt and clear land while the prices are cheap. Currently 953s loader seem to be going cheaper than in the past. 14k to 23k no cab.

I have been shown how to look at the idlers, rollers, pins, spockets, and basic under carriage. To check for wear.


My questions are?

1. I was told that LGP is the only type to buy?
2. What is a fair price for a machine now?
3. Does 4 or 6 cyclinder even matter. I drove a 4 and it would spin the tracks and not move when I pushed on a large enough pile. Which one burns less fuel?
4. How can you tell if the motor needs to be rebuilt?
5. What are signs that the hydrostat drive is going bad.
6. Is fluid in the belly pan normal for the older machine.
7. Any specific problems items to look out for.
8. Hauling. I also will need to get a dump truck and 20 ton trailer? Any advise on good older cheaper models?
9. Could i be getting into more than I bargin for? Might I be better off with the largest track skid steer?

Since I dont have a way to move it, and I dont have any work for it it yet it will be dead expense until I can get going with it. So far the skid steer seems to be the item that always goes to a concrete job or small grading job. I rip out a lot of concrete and have an old farm where I dump it. Wish I could crush it but dont have a crusher. I buy a lot of dirt and have to drive to get it for a single axle dump truck I have (F700) @ 25 per load (10 tons) I am always over loaded at the plant. But this truck will not be strong enough to haul the loader around.

I was thinking I could put the loader on the farm and dig up a big dirt pile to have dirt to sell to my customers and bury all the old concrete. Right now I have about 18 loads of concrete I need to deal with, almost 400,000 pounds But the loader will not be able to dump it lightly into the back of my dump truck. So that is a major draw back. I am running out of spots to dump it. Yes i could spend a day with the ex and skid steer and get rid of the concrete which involves me moving both machines out to the farm. The machines are keep about 7 miles away. I use the dump without a trailer cause it does not have a way to hook them on. I use an F250 (prefered way) or F550 to move my machines now.

Getting dirt with my skid steer is too slow. It takes about 12 - 14 bucket loads to fill my truck and I feal like I am wearing it out trying to dig up dirt. Around here you can take a dump load of concrete to the crusher and pay $65.00 per load to dump it and you can buy it back crushed for $11.00 per ton. So if I deal with it myself every load will save me $65.00. And every load of dirt I dig up and sell could be worth $25.00.
I am not sure how many loads of dirt you can get out of a gallon of fuel in the 953. Here in georgia we have mostly red clay.

Plus it would just be nice to own a 31,000 pd loader. I have always wanted a loader.



Thanks For any and all advise.

 

[06Pete]

I have had both 4 and 6 cyl models the 6 burns less fuel but in my opinion both are under powered. The lgp is the only one I would consider. I remember loading out 50 loads of stockpiled topsoil with one and my father saying we need to take fuel and I said it should't have burnt 50 gal yet and the next load it ran out so 1 gal per load as that was start and stop every 2 trucks not much carry right out of pile. It is nice to use your own dirt but remember the time it takes to fix what you tear up $25 a load is not that much figure $4 for fuel loading $4 for fuel reclaming $5 for your time loading assuming $20 per hour another $5 of time reclaming and owning and maintence at $30 per hour now your load has cost $25.5 figuring 15 min to load now what is the dirt worth. I am not selling my farm load by load for nothing. Also what are you going to do if the EPA ever gets on you for burrying the concrete as it leatches out. It does not seem worth it to me if I were you I would buy a excavator and look into a la Bounty crusher to crush the concrete and load out dirt. The excavator will burn less fuel wear out less tracks and do more dollar for dollar. Just my opinion as I own 3 excavators and 1 953B it does have it's uses but the excavators get way more hours each year and earn way more $ Good luck with your choice.

 

[Georgia Iron]

06Pete thanks for the advice. I did not think that burying old concrete would be a problem. I am surpised that it is. I know that the crusher yard where I dump it sells 1400 loads of the crushed stuff a year. I am sure that it is getting used as a fill somewhere. To me this would be the same as burying it. I will just load it up and take it to the crusher and pay. I can load it up and drive it back faster than I could load it up and bury anyway. Save on the fuel. Seems that would be the best course to take.

Looking at the laBaounty I did not think that would be a fast enough way to crush it up nor does it size or sort it into a finished product. Not to mention I dont have a machine anywhere near big enough to use a large one. So i am limited on one of those I think. Some guys like to bust the concrete up in to small pieces to get it out. Me I like to get the largest pieces I can into my truck and lay them flat. This protects the bed from when I start dropping in the pieces from the top when I cant load any more from the rear.

I appriecate the input on the fuel usage. Those 953s really drink the fuel fast! I am still up in the air on jumping into a track loader. Everyone around here has them sitting or is selling them off. Most grading companies have folded around here and I was thinking that now is a good time to get a cheap machine to use.
I really want a 963 but hauling it will prove to be impossible for me at this time.

 

[JBGASH]

You will be happy with a 953C they are fuel eff. & cheap to buy and will work good for your needs. I would not get a LGP unless it was a bargain, they have more track to maintain and put added strain on the undercarraige. Just my opinion.

 

[ih100]

I have had both 4 and 6 cyl models the 6 burns less fuel but in my opinion both are under powered. The lgp is the only one I would consider. I remember loading out 50 loads of stockpiled topsoil with one and my father saying we need to take fuel and I said it should't have burnt 50 gal yet and the next load it ran out so 1 gal per load as that was start and stop every 2 trucks not much carry right out of pile. It is nice to use your own dirt but remember the time it takes to fix what you tear up $25 a load is not that much figure $4 for fuel loading $4 for fuel reclaming $5 for your time loading assuming $20 per hour another $5 of time reclaming and owning and maintence at $30 per hour now your load has cost $25.5 figuring 15 min to load now what is the dirt worth.

Just curious here, Pete. 15 minutes to load a truck? How big were the trucks and how far were you tracking from the heap to the trucks? The fuel consumption per hour seems reasonable, I've never measured it on a 953 but I've gone through about 8 gallons an hour on a 963, but if the trucks were 20-tonners and lined up I'd want to see that 8 gallons load around 15-20 trucks, (perhaps more if the drivers were on the ball) without too much tearing around if the ground was hard and the distance was short. I appreciate we aren't talking apples to apples here, but that does seem a lot of fuel to me. I know someone's going to come on here and ask why I'm so slow, but I'm getting a bit older these days.

 

[06Pete]

That was start and load yourself and cut it off burns more fuel that way I guess. 15 min per load figuring levaling, keeping a neat pile for load your self is not to far off. Production loading with drivers and the loader waiting on the should make it more efficent but that does not sound like what he is planing on. The burrrying the concrete in large pieces traps water and causes problems as I have heard with people filling old pits around here. Me I just use it as riprap aroung pipes and pond drains leaving it exposed and leating the water drain through.

 

[Georgia Iron]

What would the average owners operating cost per hour be on a 953?
How about a 963?

 

[wosama931b]

Hey There, There is a decent looking 953 at action on machine trader, last day to bid, good luck.

 

[Georgia Iron]

Thanks for the info. I purchased a 953 this weekend and I am learning how to grade with it now. Went with a 90 model with the wide track bottom, U/C 50% with 70% pads. 14,000 hours on a machine that was rebuilt 8 years ago, a local guy had it. He just used it to clear and level a hill behind his shop. He did not use the machine too much 1000 hrs ? in the last 8 years and in the last 2 years not two much few hours here and there. It has Tight pins and all appears to be in good order other than it needs a new muffler with elbow. It will fill my single axle dump in three scoops. I figure I will learn how to grade with this one and if it proves to be big enough I will decide if I like it or I will resell it and buy a newer one. I had the owner of a large grading company move it for me and he thought that it would be a good first machine for me. He however does not like rear engine loaders said he learned on a 955/977 and would take a good front engine machine over his 963s any day, but his employes all like the rear engine machines. I wanted a 963 loader more than the 53 but I did not want to buy a low boy truck and trailer and have it sit around just to move it. A dump truck is needed weekly for me so, the 53 can be moved with a tandem dump and tag along (which i dont have yet) and that is as far as I see going unless big grading jobs just start falling in my lap out of the air. Far as I see fat chance with that, all the companys here are folding left and right with too much over head and cost with little work. Even the big companys are cutting back. Helped me decide to buy a slightly older machine so that I have no payments to maintain.

So far I like the loader. Roots, trees and dirt all move fast. It is amazing to me how much faster it is than a bobcat/skid steer at clearing land. It is also much more dangerous to drive. IF you hit an unlevel spot it really will try to throw you out of the seat. I hit my head on the top of the cab and realize that I need the seat belt on. It controls different than my excavator or skid steer. The first hour was hard for me. The secound and third hour I am able to almost get the machine to do what I want to with in about a foot left or right as I move around trees and attempt to rip out brush. Soon it will be second nature I am sure.

 

[ih100]

The seat belt is definitely not an option on these rigs, I've seen the windscreen head-butted outwards before now. Do you have a 4 in 1 bucket fitted? The rear-engined machines are so much more flexible than the front-engined, and so much faster as well.

 

[qball]

a cat 953b is by far my favorite general grading machine. ballsy, balanced and comfortable. i have backfilled and sub-final graded many, many homes with one. loaded countless trucks and absolutely loved it all.
the track loader is a dying choice but in my eyes, with a good operator, can be the handiest single machine available.

 

[Georgia Iron]

Normal GP bucket with good shanks. After running the loader more yesterday I am truely in love with it. I dont understand what the excavator guys on here think when comparing the 2 units. The loader will clear over growth faster than a comparable excavator can. For a general purpose farm type or clearing then grading machine that can change from clearing to loading and then back to grading I think is where it shines. It is not the cheapest to run per yard of dirt moved the excavator is but for more of a do all it rules. It is amazing how fast you can get an 8' bucket of hard clay. It also moves through areas much easier than a wheel machine does.

It wont get out the big trees as fast but it will clear in a hurry and it moves fast too. You can take the machine and drive through a densly packed 10 year old growth area and it all just folds to the bucket. I was pushing piles of brush as large as the machine. It will also load my dump truck in 5 mins? 3 scoops = 17,000 to 19,000 lbs. 4 scoops 22,000 to 26,500 lbs is what I am guessing, way overloaded for me. The single axle F700 I have fills fast.

Only thing I dont like is how the dust flows up over the front of the machine right on to you.

 

[CM1995]

As previously stated by other members, wear your seatbelt unless you want to become a news story...:cool2

If I only have one machine in the stable to make a living with, it will be a trackloader. I have a 953C that's the work horse. True it's more expensive to operate than a dozer or excavator but it can do the jobs of both of those machines - trenching excluded of course unless you want an 8' wide trench.

It took me a while in the seat of the '53 until I could really operate it. Coming from excavators and skid steers, the controls were completely backwards to me and led to many frustrating hours at first. It just takes some time, patience and practice to become proficient.

I know a local grading contractor that has A model '53's where the hour meter stopped working at 15K hours, years ago and they are still producing. Keep your fluids and filters changed and run clean fuel. A well taken care of machine will give you many years of service. If you bought it right, you can run it for a while and then probably get your money back out of it when you sell it.

Keep your overhead and expenses low. When you don't need as much cash to feed monthly bills, it allows you a lot of flexibility and survivability.

 

[Georgia Iron]

Radiator cap blows water out?

I installed new a new cat muffler, elbows, entry pipe, and flex pipe, the one on my machine was rusted out and shot. Cat is proud of there parts. $700.00. I snuck a glance at how one of the parts guys was calculating part price. He took the price and multiplied it by 1.5. 50% markup on there stuff. Must be nice to able to charge that kind of profit. I thought about one of the after market mufflers on ebay for a 1/3 cost but I was not sure of the quality. So I let cat hammer me.

The man I bought the machine from ran it with the hole in muffler elbow partly sending some exhaust out back through the radiator. I did not really think about it at first. On my second trip to inspect the machine I checked the radiator fluid first and noticed that it was gallon or so low. I added water to it and let it run for 30 mins on a fast idle. It seemed to be fine. Once I got the machine home and started using it hard, the over flow vavle on the cap started blowing water out of the cap. I then decided to fix the exhaust. I used the machine again thinking the exhaust was causing the problem but once it got hot it started blowing more fluid out the cap. Now I am wondering if it is the cap or do I need to do something else?

Also my machine is missing the jack that raises the cab any one got a spare laying around?

 

[CM1995]

Georgia Iron, find out who your local Product Support Rep is for your area. This person can make a big difference in your parts prices. I am good friends with mine. The parts guy priced you the "walk-in price", your PSR can get you different pricing.

The BBX C model 953's don't have an overflow bottle on the cooling system, just an overflow tube by the radiator cap. If I overfill the coolant on my 953, any excess will come out the overflow. What model 953 do you have? Is the engine overheating?

I am not a mechanic but you might want to flush and fill the cooling system and see if that helps. I run red Cat ELC coolant.

 

[Fastdirt]

Awesome machine. I started running 953's all around this state back in 94 and spent a lot of my life running a 953. Open cab 953B was the best choice back in the boom days. It will do everything and super fast. Most good 953's will operate a lot faster than you should run them, giving you the control. Rear engine and LGP is the only way. I've ran all the 953,963,973's with skinny tracks and it is a shear nightmare.

I would like to get one just like you've done since you're already making money with your equipment you own now it's no risk. Work will come to the loader and you'll be really capable of taking on work . Although I would never go into business with just a 953 these days, that would be very tough to keep it busy. My friend got a nice 953B for around 25K and its strong and straight. I was impressed, but some get desperate and sell cheap.

I would do what you're doing too by burying concrete and generating dirt if I had farm land but I can dump a load at the inert for $80. I don't have guilt burying concrete but it's not something our government really allows us to do.

Congrats on the machine. 953's are awesome machines.You're probably in heaven "pushing piles of trash as big as the machine" and that thing will dig itself out of site in no time. A 963 is huge HUGE fuel guzzler, I'd go through a tank a day a lot. I know what you mean about all the grading companies folding around here. One ad on craigslist has like 8 953C's a 963/truck/bobcat/lowboy for sale as a pkg. You need a move let me know.

 

[honest outlaw]

wide tracks =purtier finish work/ narrow pads = better bite in HARD ground or rock/ less flotation = better bite

 

[Flhr62]

I found out in about 15 minutes that I needed the seat belt on.

 

[Georgia Iron]

Awesome grading.

"Awesome machine. I started running 953's all around this state back in 94 and spent a lot of my life running a 953. Open cab 953B was the best choice back in the boom days. It will do everything and super fast. Most good 953's will operate a lot faster than you should run them, giving you the control. Rear engine and LGP is the only way. I've ran all the 953,963,973's with skinny tracks and it is a shear nightmare.

I would like to get one just like you've done since you're already making money with your equipment you own now it's no risk. Work will come to the loader and you'll be really capable of taking on work . Although I would never go into business with just a 953 these days, that would be very tough to keep it busy. My friend got a nice 953B for around 25K and its strong and straight. I was impressed, but some get desperate and sell cheap.

I would do what you're doing too by burying concrete and generating dirt if I had farm land but I can dump a load at the inert for $80. I don't have guilt burying concrete but it's not something our government really allows us to do.

Congrats on the machine. 953's are awesome machines.You're probably in heaven "pushing piles of trash as big as the machine" and that thing will dig itself out of site in no time. A 963 is huge HUGE fuel guzzler, I'd go through a tank a day a lot. I know what you mean about all the grading companies folding around here. One ad on craigslist has like 8 953C's a 963/truck/bobcat/lowboy for sale as a pkg. You need a move let me know. Sitting on a machine all day does not improve people skills.
www.youtube.com/fastdirt505
www.ParrishExcavation.com"

Man, I checked out your web-site. That is some impressive grading. I thought I knew what I was doing till I saw your jobs. I cant believe how you cut those pools in. I wish I could work with you to learn how to do that. How do you like the 312 cat excavator?

 

[Georgia Iron]

Caterpillars Cab Jack and brackett $1000.00

I decided it was time to raise the cab on my 953a. Some one has taken my cab jack.
I went down to CAT here in Atlanta and priced a new cab jack and had a first hand look at what it is. Since I have never seen one. I also got it priced out. They want $827.00 for the jack and $185.00 for the metal bracket that screws to the bottom of the jack.

The sales guy goes and gets the box. I open the box before I buy it and can not believe my eyes. I thought for $827.00 it better be heavy duty and have some cool features. No. It came straight from China with blue paint and it was just a longram jack with a metal bracket on one end and 4 holes on the other end for the other $185 metal bracket that you must also buy for it to lock on the the metal post inside the loader.

I starting thinking that what I was looking at should not cost more than $300.00 tops. I started to loose my cool and decided to leave before I said something I should not. I left not buying the jack and thinking about other options.

I jump on the net and locate a crane jack at Grainger for $385.00 looks almost like the cat jack minus a end bracket.

I then check Harbor freight and Northern tool. Low and behold look what I find.




The jack cost $69.99. You know they probably only have $25.00 cost in the jack. I still need to weld up some ends for it to work.

I think we all need to get together and start our own company to build heavy equipment. The profit margin they have is unreal.
Cat figured out that it is better to not dig for gold just sell machines to others that do!

Hell maybe I could just start my own CAB JACK company.