Case 580B Cranks but Not starting???

[WB Automotive]

I am having trouble starting my case 580 B i purchased with a blown injection pump ive replaced the pump with a Reman Pump. the fuel is getting to the pump Via Gravity but no fuel to the injectors.






W&B,

 

[willie59]

Sounds like a project for Phil. I have to ask, are you sure the manual shutdown lever is in the run position? Sometimes on gravity feed injection pumps you have to open bleed screws on the pump and allow the fuel to fill the body of the injection pump so it can move fuel.

 

[RHINOS TRANNYS]

Sounds like the injector pump is 180* out. You said you replased the pump, did you change the shaft. If not there are dots, one on the shaft and one in the injector pump that need to line up.

 

[WB Automotive]

Yes hi i appreciate your response, i made sure that the markings on the timing gear (shaft) match the markings within the pump. However: if the shaft was to spin while the pump is off will effect the timing? Also i was told that wether or not the pump is off timing that it is still supposed to deliver fuel to the injectors..Regaurdless.

*Please inform me as to what information is correct or incorrect.

Thanks

WB

 

[willie59]

Yes hi i appreciate your response, i made sure that the markings on the timing gear (shaft) match the markings within the pump. However: if the shaft was to spin while the pump is off will effect the timing? Also i was told that wether or not the pump is off timing that it is still supposed to deliver fuel to the injectors..Regaurdless.

*Please inform me as to what information is correct or incorrect.

Thanks

WB

Hold on, are you talking about one of those Stanadyne pumps that you pull the injection pump and leave the shaft mounted on timing gear?

 

[WB Automotive]

Yes its a Roosa Master injection pump.
DBG-FCC-431-46AJ

 

[willie59]

I got ya, I'm trying to figure out what you meant in post #4

However: if the shaft was to spin while the pump is off will effect the timing?

On some of the Stanadyne/Roosa Master pumps, you could remove the 3 mounting nuts of the injection pump, and simply pull the pump off of the pump drive shaft, leaving the drive shaft in place mounted to the timing gear. Is this what you did?

 

[WB Automotive]

i Meant the engine was turned over while the pump was off..

 

[WB Automotive]

yes i did that but wasnt sure if the timing gear shaft was actually spinning over the pump so i removed the pump and spun the engine over to verify transit of the shaft while cranking.

 

[willie59]

i Meant the engine was turned over while the pump was off..

Well, that's pretty weird, I mean, to turn an engine over while the pump is removed, not something I've done or make a habit of doing. Ok, I'm going to say that "shouldn't" make a difference, but I don't know that you can say that with all confidence. Like I said, that's not something I've done, so I can't say with all assurance that it hasn't changed the timing of the gears, just don't know. You said you installed a re-man pump. I assume it was a pump that was fully assembled and had a tapered shaft sticking out of the nose of it that you simply mounted on the engine by turning the shaft to match the keyway in the timing gear, correct? At this point, I just want to clarify that you haven't removed or re-inserted the shaft from the nose of the injection pump going into the injection pump.

 

[WB Automotive]

Yes hi again: bear with me here.

you stated:

At this point, I just want to clarify that you haven't removed or re-inserted the shaft from the nose of the injection pump going into the injection pump.

there is a shaft with a keyway that comes out of the timing gear, i matched the timing marks on the pump and slid the pump on the shaft into the key way.

 

[willie59]

Yes hi again: bear with me here.

you stated:

At this point, I just want to clarify that you haven't removed or re-inserted the shaft from the nose of the injection pump going into the injection pump.

there is a shaft with a keyway that comes out of the timing gear, i matched the timing marks on the pump and slid the pump on the shaft into the key way.

Ok, that's good. I know this sounds crazy, but on some of those Roosa Master pumps you could actually remove the input shaft from the pump. This would allow you to remove the pump without disconnecting the shaft from the timing gear. It was really a neat set up, made for easy pump replacement, but you had to re-install correctly. But it sounds like you didn't remove the shaft from the pump, that's all I wanted to verify.

Now, let's start over. You installed a re-man injection pump, and your not getting any fuel coming out of the injector lines (and timing doesn't matter here, timing only matters when we have fuel coming out of the injector lines). It's a gravity feed system. You have verified fuel is being delivered to injection pump. You have opened bleed screws and filled the injection pump with fuel, you have verified the fuel shut off lever is in the "run" position, yet you still have no fuel delivery out of the injection lines. Correct? If so, I'm taking the injection pump back to a pump shop and having them check to see if it's working properly.

 

[WB Automotive]

see now thats the 2nd pump that "Deisel injection Services" in Illinois sent me. he (Andy)assured me that the pump was put on a tester to verify that its pumping fuel. i dont know what to belive at this point, its been an ongoing battle to try and get this machine running. and i am still making an effort to make it happen.

 

[WB Automotive]

thank you for your help, i really appreciate your time.

 

[Phil]

WB,
I'm assuming fuel will run out the supply line that attaches to your injection pump. I'm assuming to that the fuel inlet strainer assembly came with the new pump you have. The inlet fitting screws into it.

If you have the 'dots' lined up, then your pump timing will be close, but as you know the pump body mounting holes are slotted. Using the timing window on the pump, and aligning the marks inside, with the flywheel timing marks in the correct position, at #1 TDC, assures it's set to factory specs.

There is a bleed screw just underneath the throttle control on the pump, I believe. Make sure you have fuel coming out there. Try cranking the engine if not. You can also remove the special return fitting at the top of the pump and check for fuel there. The pump must be full of fuel.

To get fuel coming out the lines at the injectors it will take about 12 seconds of cranking. I sometimes take an injector line off, right at the pump and check for fuel coming out there. Use safety glasses. Make sure the bolts holding these lines on, have 2 sealing washers on them, one on each side.

Turning the engine over by starter, with the timing gear/shaft unsupported, is a little iffy. There is a key or roll pin to align the shaft with the gear, so although I've never heard of these shearing, it would be wise to check that the pump is turning, possibly through the timing window. When these pumps build pressure to inject fuel, a lot of force is required. Got to go. Phil

 

[WB Automotive]

Ok thank you. i am going to try that..