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Bobcat T190 Engine help.
- Thread starter Black71gp
- Start date
Yes valves were in the right spot when the injection pump pumps. Attached is a video showing how I was doing the test? Let me know if it's actually way outta time or I'm screwing up the test!!
https://vimeo.com/153158476
https://vimeo.com/153158476
I'm not a Kubota expert, but on most engines, the injection pump timing is set by lining up timing marks on the gears inside the front cover. Fine tuning of the timing is done by slightly rotating the injection pump on its mounting studs until the factory marks are aligned. If the are not marks, some engines require a special alignment tool and/or removal of an inspection cover on the pump to see the internal marks.
I don't know what your test shows. If the injection pump was removed without removing the drive gear, you should be fine, but many engines require you to remove the front cover and drive gear to remove the pump. The the gear has to be timed using the factory marks when reassembled.
I don't know what your test shows. If the injection pump was removed without removing the drive gear, you should be fine, but many engines require you to remove the front cover and drive gear to remove the pump. The the gear has to be timed using the factory marks when reassembled.
willie59
Administrator
The injection pump on this Kubota has its own cam inside the governor housing, that cam operates the 4 injection delivery valves. If the governor housing cam is timed properly upon engine assembly via the gears in the timing gear housing then there's no issue removing the injection pump housing with the delivery valves for service because that has no effect on the timing of the cam. Likewise, if the cam is timed properly, the shims either slightly raise or slightly lower (change distance) of just when the cam in the governor housing contacts the rollers on the bottom of the delivery valves thereby changing the time of injection. Less shims, deliver valve distance in relation to cam is shorter, timing will be advanced. Add shims, distance is longer, take a few more degrees of cam turning to operate delivery valve, timing retarded. And this is only to change injection timing a few degrees, it's not meant for giant leaps, the cam has to be timed with the crankshaft correctly.
What serial number is your machine?
What serial number is your machine?
40 degrees could be 2 teeth off, anybody know how many teeth are on that cam gear? 18 or so? Wait, 1/2 of engine rpm means 1 tooth off? In any case, if the head was off, then somebody could have done more fixin on the engine and anything is possible?
willie59
Administrator
Exactly, not knowing the history of the machine. :drinkup
So working on the Machine today, all the bolts to the front cover look painted still, Does not look like anybody was in there. Without removing the front cover is there a way to adjust the timing cam? Does it look like I did the timing test correctly? If so timing would need to be very advanced correct? If it's firing after tdc, and I need it to fire before tdc? There is a cover on the front and rear of the timing cam and it looks like it was removed possibly before, paint is off the bolt heads. There are two c clips on each end holding the cam in place. If I have to pull the whole front cover off I will but only if we are pretty sure it's out of adjustment. Just wanting to make sure I did that test correctly
http://www.kubotaman.co.uk/spill-timing-1
Here's an explanation that seems easiest to understand to me. Ignore everything about removing the delivery valve if you're using a pressure pump to overcome the delivery valve. Note that when you back the engine up, go 1/4 turn to get the slack out when you come back, and the timing is when the flow stops.
I couldn't tell how it went in the video, and wouldn't have known anyway.
Edit: also "full throttle" position for timing
Here's an explanation that seems easiest to understand to me. Ignore everything about removing the delivery valve if you're using a pressure pump to overcome the delivery valve. Note that when you back the engine up, go 1/4 turn to get the slack out when you come back, and the timing is when the flow stops.
I couldn't tell how it went in the video, and wouldn't have known anyway.
Edit: also "full throttle" position for timing
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Following those instructions, I didn't use a high pressure pump so I did take the valve out, doing as they explained the flow stopped just after the tdc mark. I can still see it in the view hole just went slightly past it. So is that saying timing is a few degrees after tdc?
Ok after getting the manual and doing the test how they state gave the same results and the drip test earlier linked. The mark on my flywheel is apparently the timing mark, 18*. So it is not tdc mark, but it is still firing a few degrees later than it should. Let's say it's firing 2-3* late, could that be causing the issues? Hard start and excessive smoke under load.
So I need to advance the timing correct? Needs to fire sooner cause it's firing too late right now. So that means remove a shim??
The injection pump looked changed before, so it could have been changed and never re timed?
I'll get this set and hopefully it starts and runs better, but we shall see if there is other issues
So I need to advance the timing correct? Needs to fire sooner cause it's firing too late right now. So that means remove a shim??
The injection pump looked changed before, so it could have been changed and never re timed?
I'll get this set and hopefully it starts and runs better, but we shall see if there is other issues
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Unless you drive another identical machine, I don't think you'd notice 2-3 degrees late timing, I sure wouldn't. Yes, removing a shim advances the timing.
It sounds like you have compression, checked the turbo, air filter, valves, pump, and injectors. The only other things I can think of is a combination of problems, like a crimped exhaust pipe, hydraulic load, weak starter/battery/cables. Have you used this enough to know if you're using any oil? Oil level correct? Does the dipstick look original? Have you checked the hydraulic filter? Just throwin stuff out to see what sticks...
It sounds like you have compression, checked the turbo, air filter, valves, pump, and injectors. The only other things I can think of is a combination of problems, like a crimped exhaust pipe, hydraulic load, weak starter/battery/cables. Have you used this enough to know if you're using any oil? Oil level correct? Does the dipstick look original? Have you checked the hydraulic filter? Just throwin stuff out to see what sticks...
Well of course no changes. Had a .25 and .30mm shim removed the .30 timing is dead on now. No change still takes forever to start, while blowing white smoke. Once starts turns to black and will lug down to the point of stalling when a load is put on.
Doesn't seem to be using much oil. I have muffler disconnected to make sure it wasn't plugged. I changed hydraulic filter as well.
Hydraulics work strong when you don't let the engine lug.
I'm out of ideas. I've tested and checked everything fuel and air related.
Doesn't seem to be using much oil. I have muffler disconnected to make sure it wasn't plugged. I changed hydraulic filter as well.
Hydraulics work strong when you don't let the engine lug.
I'm out of ideas. I've tested and checked everything fuel and air related.