2010 Kubota KX91 vs Bobcat E35 - Need assistance

[Sertain]

Greetings everyone...first time poster for HE.

Kubota KX91 vs Bobcat E35.

I'm trying to make an educated decision on which of the two Mini's would give me the best bang for the buck. Price wise they are very simular.

I'll be just using the equipment on my property, so generally it won't be abused but I could end up helping a contractor friend when he's in a bind.

I've rented a Kubota KX91 several times and am really comfortable with the machine but I was hoping for a ZTS over a convential. I looked at Kubota's U35 but the cab is just a little to tight for me (I have some back issues, so cab comfort is definitely a factor).

I really like all the attachment options that the Bobcats have but I've only heard concerns about how fast & sloppy thier equipment is. Now, I'm not a prof dirt worker, so I can imagine what 'Sloppy' is but I don't know if I can really understand it enought to consider it to be a major concern, expecially if I'm maintaining it...assuming the slop is from heavy use?

I was hoping for a ZTS for two reasons...
1 - Less chance that I'll make a rookie mistake and take out somethine close to the cab. Maybe i just need to be careful...
2 - Little wider stance could be helpful on my very uneven property.

Any help or advice would be appreciated..

p.s. if anyone has an idea on what a good prices is for a retail 2010 of either of those units (baseline model, no adds), i would really help. Since I'm a rookie, I'm not sure if the 36K they are quoting is a good price or bad...it's not like any of these places has MSRP listed anywhere....and comparing against a used unit is pretty much impossible...and ya, i thought about a used one but couldn't find any that i trusted in my area.

-Sert

 

[Hendrik]

Yes the advantage of the ZTS is that it can work in more confined areas but you lose lifting power, or in other words a conventional swing machine will be more productive.
It's up to you to decide which you need more.
However by using your blade you can get a ZTS machine to lift a fair bit but when you swing the load over your tracks you have to be very careful. One trick is to lift a heavy load over the blade and then swing the machine slightly, place the load on the ground and then swivel the machine so the blade is in the right position for the next lift.

 

[wolf44]

KX-91 vs bobcat

Bored I ran both thru a spread sheet that I worked up when I was looking at mini's. The bobcat has better numbers BUT I think they are a little odd the way they have listed horse power, digging depth ect. the bobcat is wider has less digging force but has higher aux hyd GPM 16.9 to 10.9. All in all they are close may get down to which color you want to look at and which one has the best dealer support in your area. As I said in the beginning I don't like the way the specification are detailed out on the bobcat and the Kubota is very detailed. I purchased a Kubota and have been very happy and if this was my decision I would buy the KX -91

 

[Sertain]

Yes the advantage of the ZTS is that it can work in more confined areas but you lose lifting power, or in other words a conventional swing machine will be more productive.
It's up to you to decide which you need more.
However by using your blade you can get a ZTS machine to lift a fair bit but when you swing the load over your tracks you have to be very careful. One trick is to lift a heavy load over the blade and then swing the machine slightly, place the load on the ground and then swivel the machine so the blade is in the right position for the next lift.

I meant to ask more about the mfg's and those specific models in comparison to eachother but this information was actually a really great tip. I had not considered the counterweight impact of a ZTS. Thanks

 

[Sertain]

Bored I ran both thru a spread sheet that I worked up when I was looking at mini's. The bobcat has better numbers BUT I think they are a little odd the way they have listed horse power, digging depth ect. the bobcat is wider has less digging force but has higher aux hyd GPM 16.9 to 10.9. All in all they are close may get down to which color you want to look at and which one has the best dealer support in your area. As I said in the beginning I don't like the way the specification are detailed out on the bobcat and the Kubota is very detailed. I purchased a Kubota and have been very happy and if this was my decision I would buy the KX -91

After quite a bit of talking to both the Bobcat and Kubota dealers, i have collected a pretty detailed comparison of the two (at least stat wise) but the info I can't just get from the # is which one is really a more reliable machine?

Is there any value in the name of either long term? Now that Bobcat was bought out a couple of years ago, I've been wondering if they would start to get impacted.

Both dealerships in my area are pretty solid and have been fairly nice. There's even a Kubota mfg warehouse about 70 miles from where I live (not that it really matters).

Does the 36K price seem about right for a new machine? I think they are quoting around 42k after tax for Machine, 18" bucket, angle blade, Thumb and Ripper.

Angle blade is around 2k, thumb around 1.5k and bucket/ripper are kind of normal prices...the machine is the basic unknown.

Thanks again for the advice and tips.

 

[Sertain]

Found MSRP of Bobcat E35 $42659.0 and Kubota U35 of $43,628, but no price for a KX91, though I have heard they are fairly close.

 

[KSSS]

There are not enough of the E series Bobcats out to get a good feel for how well they perform. At least in my view.

Honestly I would try and find something used. Being a homeowner and not doing this professionally do you really need to spend 35K or more on a new excavator? Get a near new machine and save 8-10K then you have more money for a thumb, quick coupler, additional buckets, maybe a brush mower, post hole auger whatever else may come in handy. Unless you get an extended warranty, the new warranty is typically only a year anyway. For a homeowner that only going to be a couple hundred hours. Hardly worth paying a new price for.

Kubota is a proven machine no matter what model. The BC is another story. Their machines have suffered in performance and QC. Some models are clearly better than others but overall in my opinion there are much better machines out there. Maybe the E series will turn this all around, but for now its time for BC to prove that they got their act together on the mini ex product line.

I like Takeuchi, IHI, CASE/Kobelco and the Deere/Hitachi mini ex are a good machine as well.

 

[Digger Dan]

Before I bought my Kubota 161 i used to rent bobcat brand mini's frequently and I always found them lacking in many ways.... underpowered, BIG for a mini and they just seemed like they were thrown together compared to other brands.
I would hands down buy the Kubota over the Bobcat, no question.
I like the advise above for a homeowner too, the advise to buy a good used machine, lots of them on craigslist and other places and some are real bargains..

 

[wolf44]

Just a point of reference I purchased my 2005 KX-71-3 with 346 hrs for $12500.00
There are lots of good used cheap machines.

 

[Sertain]

Just a point of reference I purchased my 2005 KX-71-3 with 346 hrs for $12500.00
There are lots of good used cheap machines.

I've actually started out looking for a used one but couldn't find one within driving distance to check it out. There are several in other states but I'm not up for that. I'm in the Sacramento area (network california).

I also have no experiance with excavator engines, so i'd definitely be using my local Kubota dealer for anything above standard maintence. Filters and stuff isn't a problem, but I wouldn't know where begin or even know if the hydro was not producing the correct pressure....

I mean, I really don't WANT to buy a new one but then again, i don't want some beater rental unit that will be in the shop more than not...that is the really the only reason why i have been looking at new ones.

-Sertain

 

[strott]

Do new Kubota's in the US come with a 3 year warranty? - if so, that is peace of mind for you so if you're not mechanically minded then any problem should be sorted by your dealer, the 3 year warranty is also a testament to Kubota's confidence in their machine

Also from a security point of view the kubota should come with an immoboliser as standard.

On a price perspective, I believe ZTS models command a premium over a conventional machine so a new KX91-3 should be cheaper than a new U35.

 

[Digger Dan]

No it appears the factory security device is for the European market only, they just don't get stolen over in this continent:beatsme

And its a two year warranty in Canada for new ones, one year for the whole machine and the second year on the engine only....

 

[KSSS]

I've actually started out looking for a used one but couldn't find one within driving distance to check it out. There are several in other states but I'm not up for that. I'm in the Sacramento area (network california).

I also have no experiance with excavator engines, so i'd definitely be using my local Kubota dealer for anything above standard maintence. Filters and stuff isn't a problem, but I wouldn't know where begin or even know if the hydro was not producing the correct pressure....

I mean, I really don't WANT to buy a new one but then again, i don't want some beater rental unit that will be in the shop more than not...that is the really the only reason why i have been looking at new ones.

-Sertain

You might try IronPlanet.com They inspect the machines and likely will do a better job inspecting a machine than you would if your an inexperienced operator anyway. You need to arrange shipping if the machine is not close, not a big deal. You don't NEED to buy new to find a good machine, but of course its your money. If you would prefer the peace of mind your local dealership would certainly appreciate it.

http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/267432?h=2,Browse
http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/267541?h=2,Browse
http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/266499?h=2,gotoPage

http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/265772?h=2,gotoPage

Here are some quick examples

 

[KSSS]

Here are some coming up for sale



http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/269380?h=405,4251

http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/270451?h=405,4270


There is a Kubota 80 in Ca. coming up for sale but that is a big mini. Good luck

 

[KSSS]

Here are some coming up for sale



http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/269380?h=405,4251

http://www.ironplanet.com/jsp/s/item/270451?h=405,4270


There is a Kubota 80 in Ca. coming up for sale but that is a big mini. Good luck

 

[CEwriter]

Bored I ran both thru a spread sheet that I worked up when I was looking at mini's. The bobcat has better numbers BUT I think they are a little odd the way they have listed horse power, digging depth ect. the bobcat is wider has less digging force but has higher aux hyd GPM 16.9 to 10.9. All in all they are close may get down to which color you want to look at and which one has the best dealer support in your area. As I said in the beginning I don't like the way the specification are detailed out on the bobcat and the Kubota is very detailed. I purchased a Kubota and have been very happy and if this was my decision I would buy the KX -91

Be careful when comparing specs. Hydraulic effectiveness comes from a combination of flow and pressure. Calculate hydraulic horsepower by multiplying flow times pressure and dividing the result by 1,714 (a constant). Unfortunately, Kubota doesn't publish its hydraulic pressure.

Look carefully at boom, stick and bucket sizes used in reporting arm-crowd and bucket-breakout forces. Common variations in those attachments can lead to significant change in delivered force.

L

 

[wfodickinson]

Well put CE. A finely tuned hydraulic system will outperform a poorly tuned system that looks good on paper.

Manufacturer specs are a good reference but not the best way to choose a machine. Analyze the specifications to ensure you are comparing like machines but get on them to get a real world idea of how they perform.

FYI, the new M-series bobcat's are nice.