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WW2 Iron

hillbillywrench

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Joined
Apr 14, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Ozarks, USA
i’ve had some free time for surfing lately and read up on some of the innovations of ww2 designers. I guess the weight alone would qualify some of it as HEAVY Equipment. Look at a Soviet V12 diesel: aluminum block iirc, one bank had a longer stroke, pre-start oiling system, and 38L displacement. The most common Sherman tank model had an air-cooled aircraft radial engine. And aircraft engines using (or trying to use) turbos, superchargers, direct injection, multi port fuel injection, and multi bank engines. The 6-71 2-stroke was a 1930’s design that was in production well into the 1980’s(?) with few major changes. All of this done before FEA, computer modeling, cnc machines, or even calculators. Horses were still commonly used on farms and steam power equipment was common as well. Tear into a 1940 piece of equipment (ag, industrial, or construction) and compare it to a 1950 model. Of course some of their mistakes are still being made (when will designers realize that Ease-of-maintenance, parts commonality, and extensive PRE-production testing are all good things.)(I realize that designers don’t have complete design freedom and are backed into a corner sometimes. It’s just frustrating sometimes.)
They didn’t always get it right the first time, and sometimes wasted resources on ill-conceived designs, but they did do some amazing work in a short time. My hat is off to them, the people who built the equipment, and the operators who used/repaired that equipment! A generation of innovators!
 

DMiller

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
16,427
Location
Hermann, Missouri
Occupation
Cheap "old" Geezer
Have seen nothing until you get into the big Waukesha gas and diesels, White's own engines, IHC Mack and GM HUGE gassers, Hercules, Lycoming pattern V12 from American LaFrance. Ford, Packard and Chrysler all put engines in Shermans, GM built aircraft engines for Allison patterned SIMILAR to Rolls Merlins. Lots and lots of oddball engines in those days.
 

hillbillywrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Ozarks, USA
I watched a video of Russians pulling a KV1 tank out of a lake. It had been in there since ww2. They winched it out, rolled it over (it was upside down all those years), and when they started dragging it the tracks and road wheels were turning. I couldn’ believe the bearings hadn’t seized solid. I’ve seen that in other videos as well. (Maybe their idea of bearing clearance was “less than a finger width”. IDK. The maintenance intervals and hours-before-overhaul times were extremely low for most ww2 equipment, but equipment that survived the war seems to have held up well in civilian use. They were breaking new ground in engineering, materials, and applications (some of this developed much further in postwar years).
They also had some crazy ideas that never worked out. I can’t imagine the headaches involved with the multi bank engines. Trying to tune five (or six?) Gas engines tied into one crankcase? Or build a 3500 rpm sleeve-valve aircraft engine making well over 3000hp with materials and machining technology of the time.
BTW, DMiller did you enjoy this last round of winter weather? I’m a few hours southwest of you and we hit -12 last night.
 

DMiller

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
16,427
Location
Hermann, Missouri
Occupation
Cheap "old" Geezer
SUCKS here!! Was -1 degree just yesterday morning, so cold the dogs did NOT want to go outside to pee. We got just a little snow, side lots are treacherous so no hauling happening for a bit. Can't wait for next week, frost will be rolling out and all the frozen lots will be quagmires!!
 

hillbillywrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Ozarks, USA
Our lot sees approx. 3000 loaded semis (hopper bottom grain trailers) a year and it will still be Slop when the ground thaws a bit. The boss had untold loads of shot-rock base put down and it still gets squishy. Of course I could drive ten miles and hit ground that doesn't ever get soft. Welcome to the Ozarks.
I would just be happy if grain bin designers could build a system that works reliably. Spent all day fighting one bin. Had a gearbox shell out. We replaced that same box two or three years ago. It only sees a few hours use a year, is out of the weather, and had oil when installed. Of course it's a pita to replace.
At least the weather is warming up a little.
DMiller, you should get some days to move equipment around wine country next week.
 

hillbillywrench

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2014
Messages
49
Location
Ozarks, USA
I grew up listening to 6-71’s and 6V92’s in loaded dump trucks coming down a long hill near our farm with the jakes on. And then listening to them going down thru the gears to get back up it empty! Amazingly versatile engines but probably not the best truck engine. Maybe if HD automatics had been more advanced they would have done a little better. Incredibly tough motors though.
IIRC, they were designed for marine propulsion. Way ahead of their time at introduction. Overhead valves, a roots blower, unit injectors, modular design, ease of manufacturing, easy to maintain, weren’t very sensitive to fuel quality, long life at max rpm, and a very good power/weight ratio compared to existing boat motors. And, easy to evolve into multiple applications, advancements, and various displacements/layouts over the years.
I still see some old boats on TV that sound like they’re running Detroit 2strokes. I would imagine that lack-of-parts, fuel economy, and retiring mechanics eventually end that. Of course, I consider NOT having to plug a computer into the harness a good thing!
 

DMiller

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
16,427
Location
Hermann, Missouri
Occupation
Cheap "old" Geezer
Lots of DD power on the water, many bigger boats use EMDs which are just overgrown DDs or DDs on steroids.
 

Willie B

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
4,039
Location
Mount Tabor VT
Occupation
Electrician
FullSizeRender.jpg It isn't WWII. All components were WWII, but the first power wagon rolled off the line in 1945. They claim hours after the last WWII military vehicle left. For several years these were strictly civilian market. Perhaps 1952 the military started buying a few. Military pickup versions were open, or canvas cab, troop carriers, ambulances, and a few command cars.
It was the first factory produced four wheel truck on the market. The Willys CJ beat it to production by hours.
 

RZucker

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Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
4,077
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Wherever I end up
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Mechanic/welder
View attachment 177095 It isn't WWII. All components were WWII, but the first power wagon rolled off the line in 1945. They claim hours after the last WWII military vehicle left. For several years these were strictly civilian market. Perhaps 1952 the military started buying a few. Military pickup versions were open, or canvas cab, troop carriers, ambulances, and a few command car
It was the first factory produced four wheel truck on the market. The Willys CJ beat it to production by hours.

I have a construction magazine from 1967 that shows an ad from Dodge offering those trucks for sale.
 
Last edited:

RZucker

Senior Member
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Jul 7, 2013
Messages
4,077
Location
Wherever I end up
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Mechanic/welder
I grew up listening to 6-71’s and 6V92’s in loaded dump trucks coming down a long hill near our farm with the jakes on. And then listening to them going down thru the gears to get back up it empty! Amazingly versatile engines but probably not the best truck engine. Maybe if HD automatics had been more advanced they would have done a little better. Incredibly tough motors though.
IIRC, they were designed for marine propulsion. Way ahead of their time at introduction. Overhead valves, a roots blower, unit injectors, modular design, ease of manufacturing, easy to maintain, weren’t very sensitive to fuel quality, long life at max rpm, and a very good power/weight ratio compared to existing boat motors. And, easy to evolve into multiple applications, advancements, and various displacements/layouts over the years.
I still see some old boats on TV that sound like they’re running Detroit 2strokes. I would imagine that lack-of-parts, fuel economy, and retiring mechanics eventually end that. Of course, I consider NOT having to plug a computer into the harness a good thing!

Not made for trucks???? :rolleyes: Man I have pulled loads with everything from a turbo 4-53 to a 16V71 in a Euclid rock truck. They were very much at home in a truck.
 

Willie B

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
4,039
Location
Mount Tabor VT
Occupation
Electrician
I have a construction magazine from 1967 that shows an ad from Dodge offering those trucks for sale.
They were marketed heavily to returning veterans, among others. A farmer didn't need a tractor, truck, and car. A Power Wagon filled the need for all. A vast array of attachments were available including three point hitch, hydraulics, belt pulley PTO, and shaft PTO, dump bodies, snow plows, winches, and the list goes on. One advertising film shows the farmer plowing all day, then his lovely wife climbing in in her dress, and high heeled shoes to go to town for groceries. The price immediately after WWII was quite low, but skyrocketed when federal price restrictions were lifted. It is said they cost what a top of the line Cadillac did. How many farmers used them as their only machine? I don't know.
1967 was near the end of production for the domestic market. There were plenty built until 1971 for export.

Willie
 

Shimmy1

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2014
Messages
4,257
Location
North Dakota
Our lot sees approx. 3000 loaded semis (hopper bottom grain trailers) a year and it will still be Slop when the ground thaws a bit. The boss had untold loads of shot-rock base put down and it still gets squishy. Of course I could drive ten miles and hit ground that doesn't ever get soft. Welcome to the Ozarks.
I would just be happy if grain bin designers could build a system that works reliably. Spent all day fighting one bin. Had a gearbox shell out. We replaced that same box two or three years ago. It only sees a few hours use a year, is out of the weather, and had oil when installed. Of course it's a pita to replace.
At least the weather is warming up a little.
DMiller, you should get some days to move equipment around wine country next week.
Sounds like they should have excavated a few feet, installed geomat, and then built on that.
 

td25c

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
5,250
Location
indiana
Ford, Packard and Chrysler all put engines in Shermans, Lots and lots of oddball engines in those days.

Pretty amazing what manufacturers were able to do on short notice ....... :cool:

What engine would ya like in that Sherman ? We got options for Continental , General Motors , MOPAR & Ford . :)

http://www.theshermantank.com/category/gm-6046/

Not the perfect Tank but under the circumstances the Greatest Generation was able to mass produce them in high numbers & move them quick to where they were needed . :cool:
 
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