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will I kill my truck or someone else? DT/466 GCVWR?

dadanddaughterexcavation

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Joined
May 20, 2021
Messages
103
Location
NH
Occupation
owner/ operator at Dad and daughter excavation
I have 1990 International 4900 dump truck with DT466, air brakes, double frame, spicer 5speed with 2 speed rear, 22k rears, 11k fronts, GWVR 33k. My tag trailer is 20 ton with unladen weight of 9,700 lbs. The million dollar question is what is the heaviest machine I can put on the trailer and not hurt my truck or put myself or other people on the road in a unsafe situation? I have my CDL-A so its not a legality thing just a saftey thing. well and I dont want to kill my 31 year old truck. Input would be great!!!!!!
 

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heymccall

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
5,349
Location
White Oak, Pa
We run
C7500 3116/allison
C7500 3116/7 spd manual
Pete 325 C7/ 8LL

All of them pull my Interstate 40DLA trailer, with up to a Cat 953C (39k # + trailer) on them. Never an issue, BUT, make sure your hitch in the truck is rated for that. When I replaced one of the hitches, I found similar that were rated much lower than what we tow.

Never a problem.

Our 963B LGP @ 49k # broke the tow hitch on one of the trucks (actually a Mack RD688S) before it ever pulled out. My Mack's use the same hitch.
 

mekanik

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 20, 2015
Messages
943
Location
Canada's Northwest
Does the trailer have electric brakes? If so that is the biggest safety issue.
Making sure they are all working and the breakaway switch and battery is in good order.
 

skyking1

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2020
Messages
7,465
Location
washington
I'm hoping it's an air brake trailer at 20 tons. I have not seen a 20 ton electric brake trailer.
I'm far more conservative and would draw the line at about 15 tons of equipment. that would be 40,000 lb of trailer and equipment, minus up to 6,000 lb of hitch weight.
At 6,000 lb of hitch weight that trailer is going to manhandle you in corners. think about the forces driving down into a downhill corner in the slick. You can do it, but you better be familiar with the Johnson handle. The trailer will want to push you into a jackknife, and your relatively light tractor isn't going to resist it very much.
That's what I tow with a LN9000 tandem axle dump truck. it gets around pretty good but there are times when that pin weight coming in at an angle can be fun!
 

Willie B

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
4,039
Location
Mount Tabor VT
Occupation
Electrician
Mine is GMC Top Kick 1990, Cat 3208 V8 10.4 liter turbo rated 250 HP, Allison 4 speed trans. Eaton 22000 LB differential is about 4.89:1. Truck is rated 28000 GVWR.
I tow a triaxle CAM Superline rated 23000 GVWR. Trailer nameplate claims 3000 LBS empty, I know better. Trailer brakes are electric, truck is air. Current backhoe is Case 580 Super N, I'll estimate 17000 LBS.
On Vermont hills, every trip involves up & down hills. Steep hills are a slow process whether up or down. Loaded, the whole rig is 37000 LBS. I would NOT want anything heavier on hills!

If truck manufacturers rate trailer tow rating, I haven't seen it.


Inspect your truck frame. Two layer frames can weaken with rust.
 
Last edited:

AzIron

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2016
Messages
1,541
Location
Az
With a dt 466 your going to overload your motor before you get to full rated weight a powerhouse they are not

I have done that setup before a backhoes a pretty good load but food for thought with axels your bridge about 60000lbs truck and trailer probably get between 25000 and 30000lbs so your really only left with about 30000lbs of usable weight

If your pulling any hills or anything you will lack horsepower with that setup before brake power if everything is air brakes but them ol dt never seem to die
 

Willie B

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
4,039
Location
Mount Tabor VT
Occupation
Electrician
Mine is a 1960 B75 Mack 400 Cummins, 13spd tandem 280" WB--------It hasn't hauled or moved a damn thing except my own a$$. :):p:D
We need pictures!
I've always been terrified of buying an old truck. They are, in every case SO needy. My obsession with owning a truck that won't earn its keep has lead me to fire trucks. I've owned two. In each case, converting a fire truck to a dump truck costs a pretty penny, then I get the pleasure of working all the bugs out. Old fire trucks are low mileage/hours, low on rust, but they suffer all the problems age brings on other trucks.

I occasionally see vehicles come from climates less conducive to rust. In all measures of mechanical condition, they are attractive. Maybe I need to travel to shop for trucks.
 

Willie B

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
4,039
Location
Mount Tabor VT
Occupation
Electrician
I cant help you with anything on trucks........but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night!:D

I had a father in law, two brother in laws gave lots of unsolicited advice. Dysfunctional people who knew exactly how my life should run. Two died, one is estranged. I now stumble through life making mistakes without them.
Do you really think you're ready to fill that role?
I got a trouble light on a Case 580 Super N.
 

DeereJohn

Active Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2014
Messages
43
Location
PA
As someone who also has a single axle, 33k dump, it is painfully slow with anything around and above 15k on the trailer. It will do it, safely, given the airbrakes. These trucks are slow with 9 ton in them. I have found you will run out of power before anything else (brakes or GCVWR)
 

dadanddaughterexcavation

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 20, 2021
Messages
103
Location
NH
Occupation
owner/ operator at Dad and daughter excavation
Does the trailer have electric brakes? If so that is the biggest safety issue.
Making sure they are all working and the breakaway switch and battery is in good order.
it has air brakes. my truck is set up to tow a trailer with electric too but my trailer is air brakes
 

dadanddaughterexcavation

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 20, 2021
Messages
103
Location
NH
Occupation
owner/ operator at Dad and daughter excavation
the trip would be 17min and 95% highway. I'm hearing most say that bottom line my truck dosn't have the power and its not really a too much weight on frame or brakes issue but the motor it has in it. dose that sum up the consensus?
 

Old Doug

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Joined
Oct 16, 2013
Messages
4,484
Location
Mo
What do you want to haul? Power is one thing speed is another. If you are careful you can haul way more than your truck is rated for and never have a problem. Most of my stuff is way under powered for heavy traffic but there are alot of back roads were i can take my time and be safe.
 

NepeanGC

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Mar 18, 2017
Messages
203
Location
Ottawa, Ontario
Occupation
#dirtherder
I had an 05 International 4300 with a 15 ton tag. Truck had no problem with 30k trailer, 12k truck. We're pretty flat around here, so take that for what it's worth.

At 195hp, it ran out of power long before I considered it 'unsafe'. 40-45k gcw was comfortable. Mine had a 6 speed.
 

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Willie B

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Jan 2, 2016
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4,039
Location
Mount Tabor VT
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Electrician
Yeah I saw that. From my experience a circle with teeth around it is a transmission symbol, probably some type of pressure issue I would guess.
Seth figured out how to read it all. Four codes come up. One is intermittent signal from fuel gauge, others are electrical connection to transmission.
 

AzIron

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2016
Messages
1,541
Location
Az
the trip would be 17min and 95% highway. I'm hearing most say that bottom line my truck dosn't have the power and its not really a too much weight on frame or brakes issue but the motor it has in it. dose that sum up the consensus?

Are you doing it every day or one time deal and what are you hauling

You can push that truck and motor a long ways loaded maxed out but you will take about double the time to get there nepean is right that 45000lbs is the sweet spot for that set up it can handle up around 60000lbs but it wont be running speed limits in traffic
 

NepeanGC

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Mar 18, 2017
Messages
203
Location
Ottawa, Ontario
Occupation
#dirtherder
Are you doing it every day or one time deal and what are you hauling

You can push that truck and motor a long ways loaded maxed out but you will take about double the time to get there nepean is right that 45000lbs is the sweet spot for that set up it can handle up around 60000lbs but it wont be running speed limits in traffic

Agreed - I had my rig around 50-55k a few times, and although brake and stability wise it was fine, it was slow as can be. I felt like I was burning the motor out of the truck. Never did kill it, but I only put 100k on that truck before I sold it.
 
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