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What engine?

Discussion in 'Track Loaders' started by Catdidrun, Mar 21, 2020.

  1. Catdidrun

    Catdidrun Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2020
    Messages:
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    Location:
    Beech Creek, Pennsylvania
    I have a Caterpillar 977k track loader.
    Serial number 11k3729
    Block number M 5S6777 29
    My engine seized during a run away a couple of years ago. It ripped the rod out of the piston and then shoved the valve through the head leaving the pan full of shredded piston. I believe the best option is to replace the engine. I was told that the metal shavings could block oil flow if I tried to rebuild it.
    I am not sure what or where to look for a replacement. I'm pretty sure it's a 3306, but there seems to be many versions of this engine. Can any one explain what I should be looking for? What are the differences in the 3306B, 3306PC, 3306DI, d333, gen sets, industrial vs marine vs truck etc. It's very confusing. Also should I keep the original equipment or swap for a different model? Which engines would be a direct bolt up? I've seen some engines on marketplace, Ebay and some heavy equipment sites, but they have different accessories. Usually a bunch of extra junk that mine doesn't have. Would I just take all of that stuff off and install the accessories from my existing engine? They usually don't have the same intake and exhaust or fuel pump configuration. Also I don't know if I have a scroll or sleeve metering fuel system. I've asked some local mechanics, but no one seems interested in helping.
    I am sure I can change the engine myself if I have the correct parts. I have some mechanical background, but I work in construction.
    Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 20181229_135208.jpg 20191230_131239.jpg 20190429_132015.jpg
     
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  2. Welder Dave

    Welder Dave Senior Member

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    If it helps your machine is a 1971 only about 200 units before they became the 977L. L started at 11K3919.
     
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  3. Rusted

    Rusted Well-Known Member

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    If your engine is original it's a D333c. If that's the case, the engine serial number tag will match the machine serial.
     
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  4. Catdidrun

    Catdidrun Member

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    Thanks for the date, I thought it was early 80s.
     
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  5. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    You should look for a Serial Number plate on the engine that bears the same number as the machine 11K3729. if that's the case it stil lhas the original engine. Until you find that plate (or something similar) you have no idea what the engine is with the machine being almost 50 years old. It could've had a previous engine transplant......... Your first challenge as I see it is to establish if the engine is the original. The arrow indicates where the Serial Number ought to be on your machine.
    upload_2020-3-21_16-11-12.png
    Who the f**k told you that..? Provided the block is not damaged (would require a check by a machine shop of things like main bearing cap alignment, etc, etc) and it is cleaned out carefully and correctly on the face of it there ought to be no reason why the block could not be reused.
    Please elaborate a tad. What exactly happened..? Depends on circumstances but the crank might possibly be compromised.
     
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  6. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

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    Location:
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    The key words here are "carefully and correctly" I would not have any problem with reusing the block IF the main bearings were still in the right alignment. The trick would be is the person doing the job of the skills set to know what the correct way to clean the block?

    Every place oil flows through the engine has to have all plugs and fittings removed and a good stiff brush run through the oil galleys. On this engine, I believe there is a dowel in the block that has an orifice in it to control the flow of oil to the rocker arms. I can see that as an easy place for some uninformed person to miss. NOTE! this is not a full list of places to clean! Like I said any place oil touches need to be cleaned!

    To be honest all that cleaning is to me SOP(standard operating procedures) for any rebuild whether it was a failure like this or just due to high hours!
     
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  7. Welder Dave

    Welder Dave Senior Member

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    When my engine was rebuilt they hot tanked it.
     
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  8. kshansen

    kshansen Senior Member

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    That is a good step but.... still no replacement for a good scrubbing of the oil galleys.
    Actually I think it is more important for a hot tanked block, that cleaning solution gets in every where and it is not always nice and clean!
    Back when were were doing our own engine work we had a hot tank and before that we had a tank filled with the same caustic stuff they used to sell in stores for cleaning carbs that was some nasty smelling stuff! But it sure did the job!
     
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  9. Welder Dave

    Welder Dave Senior Member

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    I think a shop that hot tanks engines might have a little higher standards than the shop that doesn't do engines very often. Mind you there are some very good independent mechanics.
     
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  10. Dave Neubert

    Dave Neubert Senior Member

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    If your block is not damaged just rebuild it you can clean out oil galleys replace hed and rod
     
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  11. Cat977

    Cat977 Well-Known Member

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    Occupation:
    Machinist
    Location:
    Madison WI
    I have a 11K1263 witch should have the same engine as yours. I was thinking about pulling the tracks off of (See 977 switching tracks, thread). Engine is great, best of the 3. All accessories included $3000 plus the cost of shipping. Come and run it or send Cat dealer, They are 20 miles away have them check it.
     
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  12. Cat977

    Cat977 Well-Known Member

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    Sellers remorse. I'm not ready to switch the tracks this year. So if it can wait till next summer it would be available then.
     
  13. Catdidrun

    Catdidrun Member

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    Location:
    Beech Creek, Pennsylvania
    I replaced an o-ring on one of the pumps and got it out of time. The first few times it wouldn't start then it started, but wouldn't take full throttle. Then the last time I tried to install the pump, it started right up and went to full throttle. I thought yea, this baby is really ripping now. Then it wouldn't throttle down or go into detent, I turned the key, nothing. Now I was freaking, air filter cap was installed, I never had this happen or knew that it could. I jumped off the machine and started to walk away then I remembered that there was a shutoff at the fuel tank. I ran over and shut it down. The motor stopped in a few seconds. Steam was flying from the engine and antifreeze leaking. I think the hose just blew off the water pump. I had a Caterpillar tech come adjust the pump and start the engine. After a few minutes it got louder then clanking clank clank. He shut it down immediately, but too late the piston seized and the rod tore out of the bottom then the rod came back up to hit the piston and drive it into the valve which went through the head. He didn't seem th think it was worth rebuilding and recommended athat it be replaced or parted out.
    Ohh, just after the runaway I noticed that the oil dipstick tube was dripping, when I checked it was way over full. So I drained the oil to find it was full of fuel. I put new oil in it before the cat tech arrived.
    I would consider rebuilding if I knew how to clean the oil pump and crank of metal shavings.
    Thanks for the replies guys
     
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  14. Catdidrun

    Catdidrun Member

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    Location:
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    Can anyone tell from the cylinder block number, M 5S6777 29 what engine it is?
    It would be nice if they just stamped D333c or 3306c on the engine block. 20191230_131223.jpg
     
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  15. Rusted

    Rusted Well-Known Member

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    Location:
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    Did you find the serial tag on the engine? (see Nige's diagram).
    The tag may be missing or painted over, but the numbers will be stamped into the block underneath where the tag was if it's missing.
     
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  16. Cmark

    Cmark Senior Member

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    Post some pictures of the water pump area.
     
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  17. Nige

    Nige Senior Member

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    See the bottom of your photo. Right behind the cables to the alternator there is a raised area. Are there any numbers stamped on the vertical (smooth) face of that flat surface hidden behind the cable.?

    upload_2020-3-22_16-10-18.png
    upload_2020-3-22_16-13-22.png
     
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  18. Catdidrun

    Catdidrun Member

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    Location:
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    I just noticed and figured out what the chicken scratches on my parts book reads, D333 engine. I will still check the engine plate though. 20200106_101752.jpg
     
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  19. Welder Dave

    Welder Dave Senior Member

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    That's consistent with the L's starting at 11K3919. Still be good to double check it hasn't been changed.
     
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  20. Cat977

    Cat977 Well-Known Member

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    Occupation:
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    Location:
    Madison WI
    This info used to be on the specs database of Ritchie Bros. Auctioneers,hope it helps.

    The 977K has a D333 turbocharged, six-cylinder engine producing 170 hp (130 kW) (FWHP). It has a three-speed powershift transmission. It comes standard with oil cooled clutches and brakes, pedal steer, and electric start.
    The 977K was manufactured in the USA, with an 11K or 46H serial number prefix; in Japan with a 70J or 76H prefix; and in Scotland, with a 48J prefix.
    The 46H unit has a walk-through operator’s compartment.
    Modifications/updates Edit
    Production of 46H ended in 1967.
    Production of 76H ended in 1968.
    In 1970 Caterpillar modified the final drive, beginning with 70J00569, 48J00376, and 11K03019.
    In 1971 a sealed loader linkage was added, beginning with 70J01083, 48J00584, and 11K03687.
    Caterpillar replaced 977K with 977L in 1971, but retained the 977K serial number prefixes. The 977L features increased horsepower to 190 hp (140 kW) FWHP, beginning with 70J01303, 48J00586, and 11K03919.
    In 1973 a rollover protection system (ROPS) was added to the American unit, beginning with 11K05417. Cat also added a two-piece master link, beginning with 11K05959.
    In 1974 Cat added a sleeve metering fuel system, beginning with 70J02754 and 11K07130.
    In 1975 a sealed and lubricated track (SALT) was added, beginning with 70J03167 and 11K07292. A ROPS canopy was made standard on the American unit, beginning with 11K07500.
    The cab, and a cartridge pin in the lower bucket joint.
    The Japanese unit has a turbocharged engine.
    Caterpillar offered a certified rebuild program with this model. Units beginning with the following serial number run were certified rebuilds: 70J75000, 95X75000, 48J75000, 64X75000, and 11K75000. Production of 977L ended in Japan in 1981, USA in 1982, and Scotland in 1983.
    In 1976 the Japanese unit received ROPS adaptability, beginning with 70J03307.
    In 1977 Cat added an interim scroll fuel system, beginning with 70J03329.
    Production of 70J, 48J, and 11K ended in 1978; they were replaced by new 977L units.
    It is estimated that more than 22,100 Caterpillar 977K/977L crawler loaders have been produced.
     
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